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Obama Bows to Saudi King

Discussion in 'Political Zone' started by ABQCOWBOY, Apr 8, 2009.

  1. Rogah

    Rogah Well-Known Member

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    You are very wise :D

    I pride myself on being someone that can just call 'em as I see 'em... no matter which party is doing things, I will praise the good and criticize the bad. I think each party has plenty of both.

    And I bet anyone in here dollars to donuts that going forward, Obama will be much more careful not to do such a thing when greeting people. He will not be "showing respect" in quite the same manner anymore.
  2. Rogah

    Rogah Well-Known Member

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    But you are also much better positioned and motivated to spin things in such a way so as to make youself look good. Of that, there is no dispute either.
    Perhaps she was indeed in way over her head, but no more so than the equally gaffe prone Joe Biden. When challenged on the matter, you said "The difference between Palin and Biden is the difference between Bozo the Clown and Dennis Miller."

    Now is that an example of what you consider level headed and impartial political analysis? I rest my case.
  3. Rogah

    Rogah Well-Known Member

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    I have to agree with burmafrd here. Don't forget we enacted a no fly zone over Iraqi territory, which is an act of war. So while there may not have been widespread infantry combat or anything like that, we certainly weren't exactly bosom buddies either.

    [IMG]
  4. tyke1doe

    tyke1doe Well-Known Member

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    Right, because lying is a justification for starting a war. Gotcha. :rolleyes:

    Oh, and didn't you put me on ignore? ;)
  5. tyke1doe

    tyke1doe Well-Known Member

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    Actually, the no-fly zone was a part of the cease-fire agreement. Thus, it wouldn't have been an act of war, unless you're describing war as any military conflict which involves gun fire exchange.
  6. tyke1doe

    tyke1doe Well-Known Member

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    Huh? Why would I need to make myself "look good"? :huh:
    Why would I even care about that on a board dominated by neo-conservatives?

    Again, I asked you what evidence do you have that I made fun of Bush's gaffes. You could give no evidence.

    But you do know how to borrow my catch phrases. :D


    Thanks for the admission. That's all I needed to read. But I love how you guys argue one thing and then subtly change the topic beyond what was offered. Of course, Biden makes major gaffes. Of that there is no question. But when I say Palin was way over her head, I'm not talking about gaffes. (How interesting considering another discussion I'm having about what "gaffes" mean in the context of a statement.) She was politically clueless. When you can't intelligently discuss or articulate the "Bush Doctrine," something you say you agree with, when you can't reasonably discuss foreign policy except to say you see Russia from your front door and when you can't answer what magazines you read and give even a semblance of a reason why, and when your campaign has to "hide" you from the press, you're over your head. (And, please, let's not confusing giving a good speech with thinking quick on one's feet.)

    Biden may be a gaffe machine, but he has a better understanding of politics and the geo-political landscape than Palin.

    BTW, I think your comparison of Bozo the Clown and Dennis Miller is very telling and probably more on the mark than you realize. Dennis Miller can reasonably discuss political issues even if he is a comedian. Bozo the Clown? :lmao2:

    Sarah = Bozo. :laugh2:

    I'll take that. :D
  7. Rogah

    Rogah Well-Known Member

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    Mandating a no-fly zone is an act of war, period. According to your logic, the Nazi occupation of Paris wasn't really an act of war because it was just one of the consequences of a ceasefire.
  8. tyke1doe

    tyke1doe Well-Known Member

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    It's not a matter of my logic. It's a matter of the nature of the agreement.

    No-fly zone war.

    If the cease-fire agreement ended the war and allowed no-fly zones, then it's only reasonable to conclude that the no-fly zone agreement existed even though the Gulf War had ended officially.
  9. Rogah

    Rogah Well-Known Member

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    Anyone but me find it hilarious how often someone in here writes "why would I care what people in here think?" before diving into a 300 word response?
    Ah, but I have plenty of evidence of your extreme partisanship. So I have observed your prior behavior and projected what you would have done if Bush had bowed so low to royalty. Your denials aren't really fooling anyone - except yourself.
    Just out of curiousity, what admission?
    What about someone who can't intelligently discuss the Great Depression?
    Excuse me, but I made absolutely no such comparison. While it's funny how you put words in my mouth and then respond to what you're pretending I've said and not what I've actually said, I would like to politely ask you to please not continuine doing so going forward.
  10. Rogah

    Rogah Well-Known Member

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    My friend, you're arguing semantics. A no-fly zone is an act of war. If you think I am wrong, what do you think would happen if Canada declared there would be no air traffic allowed over Minnesota and they enforced their declaration with military jets? Do you think we would just sit here and say "eh, that's just Canada being Canada..."

    The very same source you referenced goes on to say "All 3 of the U.S. led coalition wars with Iraq can really be seen as one long, extended conflict ... Since American and British forces carried out Operation Desert Fox in December 1998 against Iraq, this "forgotten" war in the Middle East has only become more intense. In the years since the Gulf War (1990-1991) the United States and Iraq have engaged in a state of continued hostility ... Periodically, this "cold war" erupts into open warfare, as the Iraqi government of Saddam Hussein defies the UN and the U.S., prompting military responses."

    So I am not quite sure your own source backs up your claims quite as much as you think it does :D
  11. iceberg

    iceberg detoxed...part 2 Zone Supporter

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    sure. but when people reply to you, your "brilliance" still graces my eyesight.

    now if bush lied how did he get the clinton admin and several other countries to lie to?

    glad you're not biased. and glad that saddam (apparantely lying also) is not subject to your bashing.
  12. trickblue

    trickblue Old Testament... Zone Supporter

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    [IMG] :D
  13. ScipioCowboy

    ScipioCowboy More than meets the eye. Zone Supporter

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    Really? Who classifies as a "neo-conservative" around here? And would you mind defining the term for me?

    According to Charles Krauthammer -- the journalist who coined the term "Bush Doctrine" -- the gaffe was not Sarah Palin's. Krauthammer states that the meaning of Bush Doctrine has been revised four times throughout the Bush presidency. When Gibson posed his question, he was using an outmoded meaning. Consequently, Palin offered the most reasonable response, "In what respect, Charlie?"

    Bush doctrine has become a politically amorphous term whose meaning varies from journalist to journalist. Palin responded in the most appropriate way, in my opinion.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/12/AR2008091202457.html
  14. tyke1doe

    tyke1doe Well-Known Member

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    Rrrriiiiggghhhtttt. Which is why post #378 of yours is a direct quote of mine, just as is this one. :lmao:

    You can't even lie to yourself straight. :laugh2:

    Please, put me on ignore. Pretty please. :)
  15. tyke1doe

    tyke1doe Well-Known Member

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    Yes, because a conflict means a war. :rolleyes:

    Again, the cease-fire agreement which ended the war allowed the no-fly zones. It doesn't get any more basic than that.

    Now if you're going to argue that every engagement that involves gunfire or military weapons being fired is a war, then even the U.S. Navy's actions against the Somali pirates was a war. We might as well call it the "Piracy War." :laugh2:

    At any rate, we can go round and round on this. We'll have to agree to disagree. :)
  16. Jarv

    Jarv Loud pipes saves lives. Zone Supporter

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    I don't put people on ignore, I like to read their lies. Wish I had more time to read this forum.

    Its like watching MSNBC instead of the comedy network, its fun. Don't you agree ?
  17. tyke1doe

    tyke1doe Well-Known Member

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    Yes.

    Those who argue that it's okay to attack Iraq because a.) we needed to get rid of a violent and brutal dictator and b.) we needed to spread democracy in Iraq would classify as neo-conservatives.

    The problem with Krauthammer's argument (and I respect his opinion because he's one of my favorite conservative columnists) is that Palin doesn't respond at all, in any way that suggests she understands.

    And this was a pattern for her, highlighted by how handled she was by the McCain administration.

    It's interesting that Krauthammer, in his opinion, could give the various definitions of the "Bush Doctrine" but Palin could not.

    If I or you were asked that question and we responded, "which aspect," if we're fully knowledgeable of the various aspects, we would cite them.

    Do you mean .. this aspect.

    Or do you mean ... this aspect.

    Or do you mean ... this aspect.

    And, knowing that Gibson would play the "Gotcha" game (she was suspicious of the media yet still interviewed? She had to know. So she should have been prepared.), we wouldn't have fallen into that trap. (If I presume upon your position, forgive me).

    It was a stall tactic to cover the fact she really didn't know what the Bush Doctrine was. She probably knew the concept of engaging our enemy if we suspect the enemy has weapons that could be used against us. But she didn't tie it to the Bush Doctrine.

    Again, a senior or knowledgeable politician is going to know that, particularly since it's the doctrine you purport to support.

    Krauthammer is merely covering for Palin, IMO.
  18. tyke1doe

    tyke1doe Well-Known Member

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    I don't put people on ignore either. I simply don't respond to their post if I don't want to. But iceberg claims he put me on ignore. Yet he responds to my post. No wonder he can't tell the difference between the truth and lie. :laugh2:

    At any rate, the facts are available for all to see.

    I wish he would put me on ignore. I mean, be a man of your word. :)
  19. JBond

    JBond Well-Known Member

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    What is the record amount of posts in one thread?
  20. trickblue

    trickblue Old Testament... Zone Supporter

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