Discussion in 'Fan Zone' started by rpatricc, Aug 27, 2013.
You are assuming that 31 other teams had draft boards mirroring that of the draft experts.
The 49ers gave up their 1st round pick and their 3rd round pick to move up in the first round. That is for staying in the same round, but just moving up a few spots.
For Dallas to move up a round from the 2nd to the 1st it likely would have taken their 2nd round pick, their 3rd round pick and something like a 6th round pick.
Had we taken Floyd at 18 and then tried to trade back up to the late first to take Frederick, there is a good chance we end up losing out on the center we HAD to have. Even if the Cowboys had managed the trade, the draft wouldn't look anywhere near as good.
Dallas would have lost Terrence Williams straight off, because they never would have gotten that third.
Then, assuming Dallas had to give what is listed above (2nd, 3rd, and 6th) that means no Gavin Escobar, JJ Wilcox, and DeVonte Holloman this year.
So they end up with:
You lose 3 players right off the bat:
Holloman alone is looking like a real steal and is likely to be a ball-hawking LB for Dallas for years to come.
Escobar is a long, natural pass catcher who will provide a downfield threat in 12 personnel packages.
Wilcox looks like a natural safety who hits like a truck. Many people who know are saying it is only a matter of time before he is starting. He should be a good one who spends his career in Dallas' defensive backfield.
Terrence Williams is flashing his potential more and more every day. He is Austin's eventual replacement and by all accounts should be a terrific #2 opposite Dez for years to come.
All four of those guys are looking like solid starters at worst. At best, you have a ball-hawking LB who creates chaos for the offense every time he steps on the field, a Jimmy Graham type of receiving TE who creates mismatches each week, a big-time enforcer at S, and a long, lean WR that stretches the field and can take the top off of a defense.
If any Cowboy fan would says he'd rather have Floyd than Escobar, Wilcox, Williams, AND Holloman, then really, I'd have to question their motives and football acumen. Those 4 guys are going to help create a young core of players that will be around for years to come.
Floyd probably would have been a solid run stopper who might get an average number of sacks for a DT each year. Escobar, Wilcox, Williams and Holloman will provide considerably more impact in all likelihood.
It seems like the Dallas front office made a much better decision than some Floyd fans would have.
Just my two cents worth.
So... if the fans don't agree that Floyd should have been the pick, then we also have to disagree that the team will start out 4-1 or 5-0? Am I reading that right?
I really think that Baltimore wanted Frederick at #32. There is no way Frederick makes it to Dallas' 2nd round pick. To be certain, they would have had to move up into the late 1st and that would have cost them a lot. There's no way Clarence could be sure how far into the second Frederick would have lasted, and it was so important to Dallas they couldn't take that chance.
Great post, but you're also assuming that we would've had to trade into the 1st round to get fredrick, when many scouts had a 3rd round grade on him. We most likely could've gotten Fred in the 2nd round. Just playing a little devils advocate here
I'm not totally against the OP like everyone so far seems to be. I am, however, very happy with the Frederick pick.
The reality is (if you take into account *and believe* PFF and preseason reports around the league) Frederick is definitely playing better than any center we've had in a while, and he is impressing as a rookie, but he's not playing at such an elite level like people are making it out to sound. Kyle Long is playing like a stud. He's the highest rated OLman in the league and it's not even close. Frederick is playing like an average player... which is great considering what we had last year.
Also, if you believe PFF and preseason reports, despite not being a starter, Floyd was playing like a complete stud. People are thinking that since someone isn't a Day 1 starter they aren't any good. Some of the best rookies right now are not starters. By all indications, Floyd is playing like someone who will contribute this year and someone who will be a complete stud for the next 10-12 years.
I guess what I'm trying to say is, I love the Frederick pick and he was sorely needed, but we are overrating Frederick and underrating Floyd... well, so far, based on preseason performances.
I would have loved to get Floyd and Frederick. I would also be willing to sacrifice the 3rd round consolation prize in Terrence Williams to get them. One reason I wish we would have drafted Floyd with our 1st and traded up to #31 to get Frederick is because I feel like we completely wasted our #47 pick on Escobar.
One more comment... People are saying, "Imagine if Costa was starting this year," and I completely agree. However, if we would have gotten our way and either Jonathan Cooper or Chance Warmack fell to us, you do realize that they would have most likely played OG and that the starting lineup would have been Smith-Leary-Costa-Cooper/Warmack-Free.
I guess my point is, you're all happy that we finally drafted a center, but if we could all have had our way, nobody here would have wanted Frederick over Cooper or Warmack. I think we kinda got lucky that those two were taken early because I think a true center will help our OL much more. That being said, I wish we would have gotten Floyd at 18, traded up to get that true center, and not wasted wasted our 47 on Escobar. All in all, I'm still happy with our draft... but let's not pretend that it couldn't have been better.
Every single rookie except for (maybe) Escobar-who the team loves I'll note-has played well during the preseason and flashed good promise, if not excellent promise for being able to contribute well to the team. While it is early this looks like one of the strongest draft classes in years.
It is absolutely ridiculous to argue at this point that we should have sacrificed either a much improved center or numerous members of this class (possibly including that same center) for a DT who hasn't been healthy since the first game of the preseason and who won't be starting for his team over a guy whose performance has dropped off a cliff after he got dinged for steroid use.
Yeah maybe, but the post I was reading before I wrote that was saying we could have traded back up to 31 to take Frederick, so that's what I was addressing. I should have quoted that guy I suppose. Still, I don't think Frederick would have lasted very long in the second, and frankly, I thought Baltimore would have taken him at 32.
Really the core debate here is if we could've gotten Fred in the 2nd round, and since that's impossible to know, this is a pointless debate
A spin that seems to be pissing off the likes of you and many others because the front office nailed this pick, and your agenda does not allow you to welcome the Frederick signing. Eh, oh well.
At our pick? You really think he could have lasted that long when considering how many OL had already been taken and who was available after Frederick was gone?
It's not a stupid debate. We should have drafted or brought in a proven DT, I don't see how that's debatable. I do agree, however, that bringing it up at this point is completely pointless.
I can't stand this Floyd talk. It's done with. Frederick is going to be the real deal
Like I said before almost every scout had a 3rd round grade on him
I know some did... but almost every one? I don't believe that to be the case.
You were right that this is a pointless debate though.
Really cool screen name you have by the way.
In this equation, are you also factoring in that we received an extremely talented Wr from Baylor? I do appreciate your valid concern with Ratliff, however, I do believe our new DL coach has done a great job with who he has to work with etc.......therefore, I would not trade the beard or the Baylor bear for Floyd--period........and I feel certain, Mr. Jones would agree with me on this issue. Next guy up will do great until Rat can get healthy.
Whatever happened to Brian Price?
At this point if we were playing hindsight and wanting a DT, I think getting Akeem Spence in the 4th would have been sweet.
I'd gladly trade down from Escobar and get a bunch of picks--one being used to trade up in the 4th for Spence.
As it stands, our draft does not look so bad so far.
The biggest anchor to this team has been, and may continue to be, the offensive line. I've got no problem with them targeting a player at a position of extreme need. Even with this selection they still find themselves short at least one more OL to have really addressed it, so crying about a different player they could have had instead makes no sense. Nit pick the 2nd rounder if you must nit pick.
And not a single one of them projected 6 O-linemen going in the first eleven picks, either.