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Who is to blame for our poor drafting of offensive line or is it strategy thinking?

Discussion in 'Draft Zone' started by cowboyjoe, Jan 27, 2011.

  1. cowboyjoe

    cowboyjoe Well-Known Member

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    Ok we have drafted these linemen say since 2008 with Flozell Adams

    98 2nd round Flozell Adams
    # 5 Oliver Ross

    99 # 2 Solomon Page

    2001 # 5 Matt Lehr
    2002 # 2 Andre Gurode
    2003 # 2 Al Johnson
    2004 # 2 Jacob Rogers
    # Stephen Peterman
    2007 # 3 James Marten
    # 4 Doug Free
    2009 # 3 Robert Brewster
    2010 Sam Young (hasnt seen enough of him to make judgement)

    Note: I posted ones that made the team, also keep in mind Jerry Jones didnt want to pay Flozell Adams extra money to be ROT or was his decision to let him walk without a goodbackup at backup OT in case something happened to Doug Free or Columbo.

    So, whose fault is the poor drafting of offensive linemen? Houck for not being able to coach them up or Jerry Jones or coaches choices for picking the offensive linemen or is it the scouts that do the scouting and their reports on these offensive linemen.

    also keep in mind, we know why jacob rogers didnt pan out, because the scouts stood up on the table during draft and warned parcells not to take Rogers because he was injury prone. So, basically in 12 years, we have drafted 12 offensive linemen from 2nd round to 5th round, with only 3 offensive linemen making the team. Thats poor drafting or whoever is in charge of scouting and drafting those players.

    So, who should be made accountable zoners, so it doesnt happen again?
  2. cobra

    cobra Salty Bastard

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    joe: I think it is lack of bluechip investment.

    Olineman drafting is really hit or miss. There are hundreds of offensive lineman taken every draft. The vast majority end up stinking.

    Taking proven, established blue chip o-line players early in the draft decreases the likelihood you are going to miss, but it does not eliminate it. There are plenty of busts out there.

    Your list is 3 out of 12 on picking starters or about a 25% success rate. Drafting o-line earlier may bump up that rate to 50% or more. But we just haven't made the investment.
  3. TheCount

    TheCount Pixel Pusher

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    It's gotta be terrible scouting at this point.

    We've all seen some of the values we have placed on linemen in recent years, we'll put a 4th round grade on a guy that ends up going in the late 2nd round.

    But then we draft guys like Marten and Brewster with 3rd round picks. Guys that for all intents and purposes should have gone later.

    Who ever is/was putting our board together or making the final call is just throughly clueless when it comes to linemen.
  4. cowboyjoe

    cowboyjoe Well-Known Member

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    good input cobra and thecount,

    i think its a 3 step contribution
    1. Scouts that do the offensive line evaluation
    2. Jerry Jones/Parcells not listening to scouts or coaches
    3. Not drafting the offensive linemen high enough

    some scouts may for instance be good at evaluating cbs, rbs, wrs, dl etc, but stink at offensive linemen, but this needs to be looked into

    I have read sometimes where media writers read some stuff we post, so maybe they can write up an article about it, and thats gets back to the cowboys, so they say, hey wait a minute, now we can put a finger on why we have been missing on offensive linemen

    I am not trying to blame anyone person, i think its a combination of things, but whatever it is, get it fixed, dont keep having horse blinders on
  5. natesboys051

    natesboys051 New Member

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    Jerry's philosophical viewpoint is to SELL tickets and make money from Jersey sales of STAR players. Therefore, his FOCUS is on 'flashy' players that can make him MONEY!!! O-Lineman are GRUNTS with little or no SEX APPEAL. Jerry would DRAFT a pass rushing guy DE or OLB to get SACKS (and to sell the guy's Jersey) than invest in a top tier OL. DEZ's highlight reels receptions definitely SELLS tickets and jerseys for Jerry....need I say more?
  6. burmafrd

    burmafrd Well-Known Member

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    Clearly our scouting has been off. We have guys sometimes rated 2 rds lower than just about everyone else. ANd if you notice during Parcells first 3 years we were spending a 2nd or 3rd every year on an O line guy. Once he left we have not used a 2nd since and only one 3rd that looks like a bust (Brewster). You show me any other team in the NFL who has NOT used a first or second rd pick for O line in the last 5 drafts.
  7. jimnabby

    jimnabby Well-Known Member

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    The draft is much more of a crapshoot than people realize. The way to get good OL in the draft is to pick lots of OL in the draft. High, low and in between. The Cowboys have picked fewer OL in the draft than any other team in recent years. If you do that, you have to get really lucky for it to pan out. We didn't, and it hasn't.

    I'm not sure why it's gone that way, but here are a couple thoughts:

    1. Maybe it was a deliberate decision to upgrade the OL in free agency - Bigg, Kosier, Colombo. But we haven't done that in a while.

    2. Maybe it's because OL tend to move up on draft day, and we've been sticking to our board. At some point, you have to adjust and be willing to "reach" a little.

    3. Maybe we're just dumb, and really thought we could get through a few more years with four 32+-year-old linemen.
  8. AmarilloCowboyFan

    AmarilloCowboyFan Active Member

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    edit after reread
  9. Doomsday101

    Doomsday101 Well-Known Member

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    These picks are made as an organization with coaches, scouts and yes Jerry. At the end of the day he is GM, he has to take the blunt of it but others had a say in it as well. BP got credit for the good picks when he was here does he then take blame for the poor OL choices?
  10. Patton

    Patton Benched

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    Poor scouting, mainly. Whoever thought Robert Brewster could play tackle in the NFL is no better a scout than some people posting on this board.

    And as stated earlier, we've seen first hand how the front office misappropriates value in regards to linemen on a pretty consistent basis. I have a feeling this goes right back to the scouting.
  11. burmafrd

    burmafrd Well-Known Member

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    no one is saying he did not. BUT he has been gone for 4 years now; cannot blame him any longer for our O line problems and refusal to used high picks on them. No other team has used fewer high picks on Oline then the boys over the last 5 drafts.
  12. Sam I Am

    Sam I Am Unfriendly and Aloof!

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    It was Jerry Jones. Insisting that OL talent could be found late in the draft.

    I know Jerry was getting quite a large ego from finding late round or undrafted talent. Of course we saw what happen with the 2009 draft when he decided to keep trading back and accumulating more picks knowing he could land lots of late round talent. FAIL!
  13. Doomsday101

    Doomsday101 Well-Known Member

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    When did 2nd and 3rd rd picks become late rd picks?
  14. bbailey423

    bbailey423 Well-Known Member

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    here is a SCARY thought...I believe we had a first round grade on Alex Barron
  15. Sam I Am

    Sam I Am Unfriendly and Aloof!

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    Where are you getting 2nd round pick? As for 3rd, that is day 2 in the draft. For me, that is a late round pick. If you want a player that can start as a rookie, he almost have to come day 1 of the draft.

    The last offensive lineman that was drafted before the 3rd round was Jacob Rogers in 2004. That is seven drafts ago.
  16. Doomsday101

    Doomsday101 Well-Known Member

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    So did other teams which is why he was selected with the 19th overall pick.
  17. TheCount

    TheCount Pixel Pusher

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    You forgot the third we spent on James Marten.
  18. Idgit

    Idgit Ice up, son. Ice up! Staff Member

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    Anybody care to guess that the number of probowls/pick and the number of years on an nfl roster/pick are on that list? Compared to the average length of an NFL career, it's probably not that bad a list.
  19. TheFinisher

    TheFinisher Well-Known Member

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    Jerry's philosophy has always been to get his OLineman through Free Agency, that's why we don't spend many high picks on Lineman in the draft. He figures it's better to spend his money for lineman on proven veterans, and for the most part it has worked. That's why I think we'll get 2 solid Lineman in FA this year, it's what Jerry has always done.
  20. sonnyboy

    sonnyboy Benched

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    And with good reason.......college offensive lineman are perhaps the hardest position to grade. That's why you see more OL 1st rd busts and more later round finds than most any position.

    I'm no expert here and I've certainly done no study backing up this claim. It's my own perception formed over follow many teams drafts over many years and what I've read.

    One thing I read that's stuck with me over the years in relation to offensive lineman succeeding/failing in the NFL.
    And that's that success for OL in the NFL has more to do with consistent effort than any other position. Will/desire and discipline to make that constant total effort is critical and measuring that in college lineman is difficult.

    So with that said, I can understand why the Cowboys have chosen to spend dollars on know FA OL, and not premium picks on college OL.

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