Underrated Qualities of finding a good NFL QB

[Bobhaze]

Not bad. He just thinks it's Matt Jones instead of Mac.

Thanks for catching that- it’s corrected now.

 

[csirl]

Here's 2 more:

1. Visual processing.

The ability to know exactly where every player is on the field at any given time. Both pre snap and live when the play is underway. The best QBs have something akin to a live 3-D map in their head of all the players on the field at all times and can rapidly process visual information in their peripheral vision in real time while looking down field.

2. Looking comfortable on the field.

This is an off-shoot of the "eye test", but with practise as the control. Does he look exactly the same on the field in a game as he does in practice. For example, is the QBs footwork every bit as crisp as it is in reps in practise. Does he keep his form, maintain his technique in real games when throwing the ball. No combine or pro day can test for this.

 

[CATCH17]

I like QBs who win things in the post season.

 

[Diehardblues]

Im not sure why we’d have any confidence this dysfunctional organization could find a better QB. Their best chance would be signing a veteran like a Wilson for example.

 

[kskboys]

Here's 2 more:

1. Visual processing.

The ability to know exactly where every player is on the field at any given time. Both pre snap and live when the play is underway. The best QBs have something akin to a live 3-D map in their head of all the players on the field at all times and can rapidly process visual information in their peripheral vision in real time while looking down field.

2. Looking comfortable on the field.

This is an off-shoot of the "eye test", but with practise as the control. Does he look exactly the same on the field in a game as he does in practice. For example, is the QBs footwork every bit as crisp as it is in reps in practise. Does he keep his form, maintain his technique in real games when throwing the ball. No combine or pro day can test for this.

#1 is prolly the biggest determining factor on whether a QB fails or succeeds.

What cracks me up is when scouts claim a QB can read a D, then he gets to the NFL and is absolutely awful at it. I still haven't figured this one out, or why the scouts miss it so often.

 

[CATCH17]

Im not sure why we’d have any confidence this dysfunctional organization could find a better QB. Their best chance would be signing a veteran like a Wilson for example.

They found a QB in FA that can win games at the same rate if the situation is similar.

 

[Diehardblues]

They found a QB in FA that can win games at the same rate if the situation is similar.

Not at the same rate over his career in Dallas. That’s an incorrect statement.

 

[Diehardblues]

#1 is prolly the biggest determining factor on whether a QB fails or succeeds.

What cracks me up is when scouts claim a QB can read a D, then he gets to the NFL and is absolutely awful at it. I still haven't figured this one out, or why the scouts miss it so often.

Yea, I’m just not sure how much of those type analysis apply to the enormous leap to the NFL.

 

[kskboys]

Yea, I’m just not sure how much of those type analysis apply to the enormous leap to the NFL.

I'm trying to remember one of the worst examples. Dwayne Haskins, there it is: "A strong armed pocket passer who makes quick accurate decisions w/ the ball and shows great anticipation."

Anticipation? No he doesn't.

 

[Diehardblues]

I'm trying to remember one of the worst examples. Dwayne Haskins, there it is: "A strong armed pocket passer who makes quick accurate decisions w/ the ball and shows great anticipation."

Anticipation? No he doesn't.

Yep

Some of these analysis are like a sales pitch . They actually have little meaning or description. They’re basically just describing their performance in college which in most cases doesn’t translate to the NFL .

 

[kskboys]

Yep

Some of these analysis are like a sales pitch . They actually have little meaning or description. They’re basically just describing their performance in college which in most cases doesn’t translate to the NFL .

They don't do it on other positions.

 

[Diehardblues]

They don't do it on other positions.

Right.

Its all hype my friend.

 

[Bobhaze]

#1 is prolly the biggest determining factor on whether a QB fails or succeeds.

What cracks me up is when scouts claim a QB can read a D, then he gets to the NFL and is absolutely awful at it. I still haven't figured this one out, or why the scouts miss it so often.

Here’s two mistakes many scouts make regarding how well a QB can read defenses-
1. College QBs get a ton more pre-snap communication from the sideline than they get in the NFL.
2. If the college QB plays for a powerhouse like Ala, Ohio State, or Oklahoma, their QBs are often given unbelievable amount of protection and time to “read” defenses because the OLs at those schools are usually full of NFL talent.

 

[Diehardblues]

Here’s two mistakes many scouts make regarding how well a QB can read defenses-
1. College QBs get a ton more pre-snap communication from the sideline than they get in the NFL.
2. If the college QB plays for a powerhouse like Ala, Ohio State, or Oklahoma, their QBs are often given unbelievable amount of protection and time to “read” defenses because the OLs at those schools are usually full of NFL talent.

Right

It would be like starting all of the top drafted QB’s on contenders instead of bottom basement teams they normally go to. I’d bet the results would be more favorable.

 

[Diehardblues]

Find me a QB in college who had tremendous success in a program that normally doesn’t have much success . That’s who I’m looking for is someone who elevated a program . Not someone who benefitted from being in a top program.

Like a Mahomes at Texas Tech , Herbert in Oregon or a Allen from Wyoming.

None of which are powerhouses in the NCAA. Oregon might be somewhat of an exception. They are usually a solid program but not a perineal top 10 team.

 

[CATCH17]

Not at the same rate over his career in Dallas. That’s an incorrect statement.

When the Bengals were good.. Dalton was about like Dak. In a better division as well.



Dalton is one of ten quarterbacks in NFL history to have thrown for over 3,000 yards in each of his first three seasons and one of only six to throw at least 20 touchdowns over the same span. Dalton is the only quarterback to lead the Bengals to five consecutive playoff berths, and one of five quarterbacks to lead his team to the playoffs in each of his first five seasons. He is also the Bengals franchise record holder for passing yards in a season, passing touchdowns in a season, and career passing touchdowns

 

[Diehardblues]

When the Bengals were good.. Dalton was about like Dak. In a better division as well.



Dalton is one of ten quarterbacks in NFL history to have thrown for over 3,000 yards in each of his first three seasons and one of only six to throw at least 20 touchdowns over the same span. Dalton is the only quarterback to lead the Bengals to five consecutive playoff berths, and one of five quarterbacks to lead his team to the playoffs in each of his first five seasons. He is also the Bengals franchise record holder for passing yards in a season, passing touchdowns in a season, and career passing touchdowns

I thought you were referring to his record in Dallas.

Dalton in his prime I’d agree. But not someone who’s going to take us any further for years to come. At most a bridge . A very limited and short bridge.

 

[john van brocklin]

We all know the hardest position to draft in the NFL is QB. It’s the most important position for team success yet the last two decades are littered with first round busts for multiple teams at QB.

And we also know what scouts typically look for: Arm strength, accuracy, athleticism, and pocket presence. And those are all important skills. But I’ve believed for years that there are several key parts of a QB’s game that are often vastly undervalued by teams in their scouting. Some of them are:

• Leadership (ability to make everyone else play better)
  • Some examples of guys who have great leadership or intangible abilities to make everyone better- Roger Staubach, Johnny Unitas, Joe Montana, Tom Brady- none were drafted early. They all had the ability to make great comebacks and inspire teammates. That’s not always easy to measure.

• Accuracy under pressure (can they hit receivers while under duress)
  • Guys like Tua, Mac Jones and Trevor Lawrence rarely got pressured in college like they will in the NFL. Last year as a rookie, Justin Herbert was off the charts accurate while under pressure. He showed that in college too. So did Mahomes and Russell Wilson. It’s easy to look great when no one is in your grill.

• Playing experience in college (how many games they started in college) One thing that really helps college QBs get ready for the pros is simply getting a lot of experience as a starter in college.
  • Look at Dwayne Haskins. Dude started like 15 games in college before being drafted in first round. Same for Mitch Tribisky. He had less than 20 starts. Contrast that with guys like Peyton Manning, Pat Mahomes, Justin Herbert, Baker Mayfield and Russell Wilson all started between 35 and 45 games in college. That makes a huge difference in being prepared to play in the NFL.

• Team context where they played (what kind of team they were surrounded by)All college QBs play in the context of the team they played for and how their play impacted that team.
  • For example, too many college QBs drafted early have been overvalued because of the team they play for. I always thought Tua was good, but he was constantly surrounded by tons of NFL talent on those Alabama teams making him look a little better than he really is. Contrast that with Mahomes- because I’m a Texas Tech fan- I saw him play every game in college- he was great while being surrounded by almost zero NFL talent on below average Tech teams. Performance context matters.

In the end, drafting a QB that can play in the NFL is difficult. Which is why I’ve always been in favor drafting a QB every other year or so, even in mid to late rounds to see if you can develop them. I hope we re-sign Dak because the idea that we can just find another one as good or better is a long shot. And the cost is not going down.

Another great write up Bob.
Will mention Roger would have been a 1st round pick if not for the 5 year Navy commitment

 

[john van brocklin]

As always, thanks for the well thought out post.

When you see tons of the same threads hating/loving Dak and then a few others sprinkled in saying the Jones boys stink (not denying that), it gets tiresome.

Keep the good posts coming.

1000 likes

 

[MarcusRock]

Here’s two mistakes many scouts make regarding how well a QB can read defenses-
1. College QBs get a ton more pre-snap communication from the sideline than they get in the NFL.
2. If the college QB plays for a powerhouse like Ala, Ohio State, or Oklahoma, their QBs are often given unbelievable amount of protection and time to “read” defenses because the OLs at those schools are usually full of NFL talent.

I was going to chime in and say that your point in the OP about the pressure they see in the pros by comparison to college makes reading a defense/going through progressions a tough thing to determine. We all react differently to the pressures of life and pressure on the QB is no different when they think they see something and then a monkey wrench gets thrown in that they didn't account for. Unfortunately, one of the things that makes a good pro QB is a thing you won't see until he's actually there: how he will adapt to a vastly changed landscape for executing plays. Ask DiNucci about that. You can ask questions about his game preparation, maybe get intel from the schools, etc. but when the bullets start flying, his prep will be put to the test like never before and he'll either be daunted or accept the challenge of trying to figure it out.

Maybe someone can create a virtual reality program or something to simulate plays breaking down and noting the choices made in the face of the unexpected. Instead of the Wonderlic test they can call it the Wonderdick test because someone named Richard will invent it. Sorry, I know you're a mod now so do your thing if you have to, lol.