Jaycee Horn has the most ridiculous coverage resume ever

RonnieT24 said:
A rookie corner on a bad team struggled? In other news .. water is wet.. I didn't watch Okuda in college and never saw him with Detroit.. However I will never get caught up deciding what a rookie corner is going to be based on one season.. especially one as weird as 2020 when there was no offseason prop.. These kids went from bowl games to NFL games. That's a tall order for even the best of them.
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Well, I did see him play some games in Det. I'm not surprised he struggled, but there were times he played like a special teamer, not a top 5 pick.
 
RonnieT24 said:
A rookie corner on a bad team struggled? In other news .. water is wet.. I didn't watch Okuda in college and never saw him with Detroit.. However I will never get caught up deciding what a rookie corner is going to be based on one season.. especially one as weird as 2020 when there was no offseason prop.. These kids went from bowl games to NFL games. That's a tall order for even the best of them.
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All good points, yet our Dallas Cowboys continue to count on these youngins for immediate help.

That aside, corners are at such a disadvantage in today's game. Even the best of the best are going to give up yardage....one way or another.

I have a tough time thinking there's a good return on investment taking a CB high in the draft.
 
Okudah's rough rookie season in Detroit is a cause for concern no question, especially after he was billed by many (me included) as being pro-ready. But I am definitely giving him another chance. Imagine if you had Surtain's technique and feel wedded to Horn's athleticism... that's basically what Okudah's 2019 tape at Ohio State was.
 
Cowboyny said:
Highly unlikely both are gone, just do the math, just so many offensive players rated ahead both the prospects.
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Agree. I really am liking the idea of a corner in the first and then maybe Richie Grant in the second. Corner and Safety right off the bat. If we could trade down a bit and pick up some more draft ammo it would be nice....but can't go down very far if we want Surtain or Horn. A lot of people keep talking about the Bears (makes sense because their might be a QB still available at 10) but that then rules out the first two. Maybe at 20 you roll the dice on Farley if he is supposed to be healthy or go with Moehrig there and then consider corner in the second.
 
The Surtain comparison to Byron Jones is ridiculous. It’s lazy and a disservice to Surtain. Surtain is a far better prospect than Jones ever was. In fact, he’s better than Byron Jones now. And it’s not even close.
 
How was the front 4 in detroit? Just another reason we should be focusing on the defensive line instead of DBs. For what it's worth I like Horn more than Surtain.
 
various:
Okudah was a local DFW kid who played FS before going to OSU. He was a 5 star athlete that was always going to be raw when he entered the NFL just from lack of experience.

Surtain was a 5 star CB that has been trained by his Pro Bowl CB father/coach before going to the best DB coach in NCAA football in Saban.

Horn is a freak of all freaks. Rated 1out of the last 1788 DBs tested athletically... BUT he had 5 penalties this year and 5 PBU in under 500 snaps.He's very grabby.
Surtain had 9 PBU and 0 penalties on over 900 snaps.

Okudah has insane speed and hips. He can shadow anyone. He will be fine imho.

Surtain is one of the 5 safest picks of this draft. What he can do is NOT in doubt in any way. He tested out 9th out of those same 1788 DBs the last 5 seasons athletically and put together the highest graded PFF season ever by a college DB.
And the stretchhhhh Horn stuff about competition is kinda hilarious because Surtain has faced Jeudy, Ruggs, Waddle, D Smith and Metchie in practice every day for the past couple seasons.

Horn is a dog and the Cowboy draft him it'll be easy to like that guy. But he could draw a lot of flags year 1 as a grabber.
 
...and yet some that post her don't think he is worthy of our 10th overall pick in the draft. They'd rather trade down. o_O
 
https://www.nfl.com/news/2021-nfl-d...hase-headline-next-gen-stats-can-t-miss-prosp

Found this article interesting from NFL Next Gen Stats...They gave Surtain the slight edge as an overall prospect, but Horn with a very high chance to make a Pro Bowl. What was most interesting is that Horn only got a 72 for production grade compared to 87 for Surtain (Tied with Stokes for #1). So apparently they are putting a whole lot of stock in Horn’s athletic ability despite not grading his actual play very well.
 
tm1119 said:
https://www.nfl.com/news/2021-nfl-d...hase-headline-next-gen-stats-can-t-miss-prosp

Found this article interesting from NFL Next Gen Stats...They gave Surtain the slight edge as an overall prospect, but Horn with a very high chance to make a Pro Bowl. What was most interesting is that Horn only got a 72 for production grade compared to 87 for Surtain (Tied with Stokes for #1). So apparently they are putting a whole lot of stock in Horn’s athletic ability despite not grading his actual play very well.
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He gave up 10 receptions all season ie 1 per game and he is barely in the top third productionwise?
 
Malhavoc said:
The Surtain comparison to Byron Jones is ridiculous. It’s lazy and a disservice to Surtain. Surtain is a far better prospect than Jones ever was. In fact, he’s better than Byron Jones now. And it’s not even close.
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I think the comparison is due to the low INT totals...but no one gets a lot of them anymore....they aren't allowed to play without risking a flag.

That's why trying to get the best of the best isn't the way I would prefer to cover those spots.

I mean seriously...anytime you see a nice breakup by a DB.....what happens three seconds later? Flying yellow. It's beyond predictable these days.

Get some serviceable guys at CB and spend your premium picks getting to the passer.

Tough to say if a guy who hasn't played a snap yet is better at the moment, but I expect he will eventually be....for whatever that is worth in todays fantasy football extravaganza aka NFL.
 
Its easy to see why teams love Horn,he is ultra aggressive and teams want that the most in a CB,him being a great athlete just solidifies this ranking.
 
tm1119 said:
https://www.nfl.com/news/2021-nfl-d...hase-headline-next-gen-stats-can-t-miss-prosp

Found this article interesting from NFL Next Gen Stats...They gave Surtain the slight edge as an overall prospect, but Horn with a very high chance to make a Pro Bowl. What was most interesting is that Horn only got a 72 for production grade compared to 87 for Surtain (Tied with Stokes for #1). So apparently they are putting a whole lot of stock in Horn’s athletic ability despite not grading his actual play very well.
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This is the thing.
CB is hard to adjust for players generally as each level you have diff base techniques.

HS: You teach a kid to sit 7-8 yards off the ball, watch the QB then attack it. Picks go for 6 so be aggressive.

College: You teach guys to grab and hold because it is allowed and you flat tackle dudes if they are about to beat you deep because 15 is better than 40+.


PS2 was training like a pro. That's his advantage. The worry is he is a bigger dude and while a beast athletically he's not as phone booth quick as a guy like DeVonta Smith. He may give up some separation.
But he will be physical, can get guys on the ground and won't be bullied by physical WRs. PS2 has perfect technique. What they taught at Bama he does, every play. Dallas can use that. Day 1 he is their CB1 if he is drafted.

But it's far to say Horn and Farley MAY have higher upsides. Farley has a Deion-type athletic profile. All the twitch and quickness you could ever ask for on his best days. But he has very few good days to show.
Horn has his Dad's attitude. He is a pitbull of a CB and will fight you every play. If he and prime Dez were int he same football camp you;'d have to separate them every day because he will keep coming.
But he'd flat grab and hold every play rather than give up a completion and in the NFL that gets hairy as refs pick and choose when to call the foul and it can sink you on a key 3rd down.
So there is a legit concern there with Horn being grabby day 1 and then Farley or Newsome being healthy much over 4 years.
 
CATCH17 said:
I have him as my #1 corner.

Surtain is just too safe for me. I want something that has potential to boom and I don't see that with Surtain.
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Same reasoning for me. I don't want Horn on the Eagles.
 
cnuball21 said:
Wheres DeVonta Smith?

Watch his tape against Alabama...it ain’t pretty and that’s the biggest test he’s had.
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you cant pick 1 game and say the player sucks and that too from 2019,teams look to see how the player has improved too.
 
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