What do the candidates truly think of Dak?

CouchCoach

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Don't you think part of the requirement of this job is to accept Prescott as the future? Do you think any candidate not on board with that is getting considered? This is not a case where the Cowboys have the 1st pick and it's Prescott or Burrow, they have limited options and the needs list could be long depending on what happens once FA shows up.
 

CouchCoach

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Ah, OK. was thinking Bear Bryant for some reason, but Shula also make a lot of sense. Thanks for the history lesson! :thumbup:
Ain't history, I lived it. Shula was considered Belichick before there was Belichick and his ability to evaluate film and get the matchups he wanted was ahead of his time.

The same thing that did him in did Johnson in, the inability to deal with Marino and his realtionship with the owner.
 

Philmonroe

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Only moronic fans have an issue with Dak.

ALL coaches would love to have Dak and this roster as a base to build from.
The ole if you don’t agree with me you’re _______ (insert negative term) routine. Yeah Dak isn’t some super awesome qb that everybody agrees on Zo
 

LandryFan

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Ain't history, I lived it. Shula was considered Belichick before there was Belichick and his ability to evaluate film and get the matchups he wanted was ahead of his time.

The same thing that did him in did Johnson in, the inability to deal with Marino and his realtionship with the owner.
I was around for that era, as well. Like Sula, Landry was also ahead of his time. IMO, that was kind of the "golden era" of coaching which is a part of the reason I referred to it as "history"...Landry, Shula, Knoll, Lombardi. They don't make them like that anymore.
 

LandryFan

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Could it have been both? What I mean is, could the original quote have referred to Bryant and then Bum borrowed it to refer to Shula? Guess I can answer my own question and go look it up. :)

OK, looked it up...it was used in reference to multiple coaches, the second of which was Bear Bryant and later by Bum in reference to Shula.

https://www.barrypopik.com/index.php/new_york_city/entry/he_can_take_hisn
 

SackMaster

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Not a great analogy since there are no fixed salary caps in business. All 32 teams have the exact same size pie. From the NFLPA's perspective, the trend toward fewer guys getting bigger checks is the exact opposite of what was intended.
EVERY business has a budget, and it has far more dangerous for a business to not adhere to it's budget than an NFL Team having an unbalanced Salary Cap.

As far as which players are paid and which ones are not, I may have missed it, but the last major "salary re-balancing" that the CBA addressed was limiting the salary of rookies so that Veterans could sign larger contracts.

If the NFLPA was THAT worried about QBs taking up "20% of the Salary Cap", then why don't they step in and try to curb the contracts QBs sign every time they reset the market? After all, why allow Russell Wilson to sign for 18.6% AAV for the 2019 Salary Cap in the first place?

I haven't seen or heard of them attempting to limit any Veteran's pay for Salary Cap purposes. And rightfully so as the Salary Cap is COMPLETELY at the Team's discretion and any attempt to limit a player's pay is not good for the NFLPA anyways. If anything, single players taking up more of the salary cap gives the NFLPA ammo to fight for increases in the entire Salary Cap so that the other members of the union can make more as well.

Historically unions use the these types of cases (high performance outliers like with QBs) to justify an increase in pay for everyone in the union.

So I may be wrong about the NFLPA specificially, as I am not a insider or have any evidence to back it up, but I can't imagine ANY union trying to limit a member's salary. They are not there to manage business budgets or a team's salary caps. They are there to negotiate the most they can for all of their members, to include compensation, benefits and working conditions.

I'm more than willing to hear any evidence to the contrary, but I have a hard time believing the NFLPA cares about any QB getting paid 20% of a team salary cap, as I believe it is quite the opposite. But if that's the case, I can't wait for Mahomes new contract and see if the NFLPA trie and limit what Mahomes can make.
 

OmerV

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Only moronic fans have an issue with Dak.

ALL coaches would love to have Dak and this roster as a base to build from.
The reality is some may not view Dak as the perfect QB, but they understand that coaching isn't about having the perfect player in every position. They know there aren't in their primeTom Brady and Aaron Rodgers type players ready to be picked up at the local QB Mart. And, ultimately, they realize a quality QB, even if not at that in their prime Brady/Rodgers level, they have a better chance to succeed with a guy like Prescott than be left with an unknown QB situation. They also know that no draft pick is a sure thing, and they would rather hitch their wagon to a guy they know can play than have their career hinge on whether a draft pick yields a Pat Mahomes instead of a Marcus Mariota or Jake Locker or EJ Emanuel.
 

atlantacowboy

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EVERY business has a budget, and it has far more dangerous for a business to not adhere to it's budget than an NFL Team having an unbalanced Salary Cap.

As far as which players are paid and which ones are not, I may have missed it, but the last major "salary re-balancing" that the CBA addressed was limiting the salary of rookies so that Veterans could sign larger contracts.

If the NFLPA was THAT worried about QBs taking up "20% of the Salary Cap", then why don't they step in and try to curb the contracts QBs sign every time they reset the market? After all, why allow Russell Wilson to sign for 18.6% AAV for the 2019 Salary Cap in the first place?

I haven't seen or heard of them attempting to limit any Veteran's pay for Salary Cap purposes. And rightfully so as the Salary Cap is COMPLETELY at the Team's discretion and any attempt to limit a player's pay is not good for the NFLPA anyways. If anything, single players taking up more of the salary cap gives the NFLPA ammo to fight for increases in the entire Salary Cap so that the other members of the union can make more as well.

Historically unions use the these types of cases (high performance outliers like with QBs) to justify an increase in pay for everyone in the union.

So I may be wrong about the NFLPA specificially, as I am not a insider or have any evidence to back it up, but I can't imagine ANY union trying to limit a member's salary. They are not there to manage business budgets or a team's salary caps. They are there to negotiate the most they can for all of their members, to include compensation, benefits and working conditions.

I'm more than willing to hear any evidence to the contrary, but I have a hard time believing the NFLPA cares about any QB getting paid 20% of a team salary cap, as I believe it is quite the opposite. But if that's the case, I can't wait for Mahomes new contract and see if the NFLPA trie and limit what Mahomes can make.

The NFL is not a single business. It is actually 32 separate businesses that agree to spend a minimum amount on players wages in order to form a competitive balance. This isn't the teamsters.

So, lets take your position to its logical conclusion. There is no internal positional caps but there is a team cap. Whats to keep QBs from eventually taking 50% or 75% of the cap leaving their teammates to divide up whats left over? Thats fair in a team sport?

When the NFLPA limited rookie wages, it set a precedent it could easily follow to do that with certain positions. The intent of the rookie wage cap was to get more money to veteran players. Rookies were getting too big a piece of the pie. However, the unintended consequence was that it freed up money that mostly went to veteran QBs. If I was the NFLPA, i'd raise the veteran minimum wage, shorten rookie contracts, and limit individual salaries as a % of the cap. Thats fair for everyone.........accept the agents who represent Qbs
 
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CouchCoach

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Could it have been both? What I mean is, could the original quote have referred to Bryant and then Bum borrowed it to refer to Shula? Guess I can answer my own question and go look it up. :)

OK, looked it up...it was used in reference to multiple coaches, the second of which was Bear Bryant and later by Bum in reference to Shula.

https://www.barrypopik.com/index.php/new_york_city/entry/he_can_take_hisn
Isn't this great? Everybody is right. This happens so little, OK, group hug.
 

LandryFan

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Isn't this great? Everybody is right. This happens so little, OK, group hug.
I initially recalled that Bum was referring to Bear Bryant with his your'n/;his'n quote, but then you chimed in (correctly) that Bum was referring to Shula. Another poster then came in and said that Bum's quote was, indeed, referring to Bryant. At some point, out of curiosity, I looked up who was quoting whom and came up with how it all broke down. Wasn't trying to do anything but let another poster know how it came about. But go ahead and feel better with your snarky little "group hug" comments...:confused:
 

SackMaster

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The NFL is not a single business. It is actually 32 separate businesses that agree to spend a minimum amount on players wages in order to form a competitive balance. This isn't the teamsters.

So, lets take your position to its logical conclusion. There is no internal positional caps but there is a team cap. Whats to keep QBs from eventually taking 50% or 75% of the cap leaving their teammates to divide up whats left over? Thats fair in a team sport?

When the NFLPA limited rookie wages, it set a precedent it could easily follow to do that with certain positions. The intent of the rookie wage cap was to get more money to veteran players. Rookies were getting too big a piece of the pie. However, the unintended consequence was that it freed up money that mostly went to veteran QBs. If I was the NFLPA, i'd raise the veteran minimum wage, shorten rookie contracts, and limit individual salaries as a % of the cap. Thats fair for everyone.........accept the agents who represent Qbs
Well, first off, a team would have to propose a contract that paid 50% of the Cap for a QB to be able to sign one. That is highly doubtful.

If I interviewed you and loved you as a potential employee, you can ask for $250K a year for non-skilled labor and I would tell you I appreciate your time but I will have to consider another applicant. Then you are completely free to see if someone else will pay you $250K for something most other people can do.

Or you can take the $15 an hour I am willing to pay and do the job to the best of your ability.

It's not like Dak, or any player, can FORCE a team to sign them. But if a team is willing to give a QB 50% of the Cap, well I would say the best of luck to them and would be interested to see if they could put together a competitive team afterwords.

As far as the NFLPA, if it was to negotiate the % stipulation for any position, I would be shocked.

But I have yet to see ANYTHING suggesting that would be the case, and again, it is completely against the Union's best interest to do so.

As a fan, I would love it because it would make signing players much simpler. "Hey top-tier QB, you can make the MAX of 10% of the salary cap." So simple, so easy.

But that is also very much anti-American and I do not want to live in a society that can set a limit to how much I can make. If I have special skills, I should be paid accordingly. And if I can only perform non-skilled labor, I better learn a new trait if I want to make more.

But in a free market, like free agency, you are able to maximize your earning potential by being in high demand. That is EXACTLY why players and the NFLPA fought for it in the first place.

And for that, I say good for the players.

It's up to the teams and businesses to do what is best for them. If they feel paying 50% of their budget to one person, well, they better be worth it. Otherwise find someone with a similar skill set that will play/work for what you are willing to pay.
 

atlantacowboy

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Well, first off, a team would have to propose a contract that paid 50% of the Cap for a QB to be able to sign one. That is highly doubtful.

If I interviewed you and loved you as a potential employee, you can ask for $250K a year for non-skilled labor and I would tell you I appreciate your time but I will have to consider another applicant. Then you are completely free to see if someone else will pay you $250K for something most other people can do.

Or you can take the $15 an hour I am willing to pay and do the job to the best of your ability.

It's not like Dak, or any player, can FORCE a team to sign them. But if a team is willing to give a QB 50% of the Cap, well I would say the best of luck to them and would be interested to see if they could put together a competitive team afterwords.

As far as the NFLPA, if it was to negotiate the % stipulation for any position, I would be shocked.

But I have yet to see ANYTHING suggesting that would be the case, and again, it is completely against the Union's best interest to do so.

As a fan, I would love it because it would make signing players much simpler. "Hey top-tier QB, you can make the MAX of 10% of the salary cap." So simple, so easy.

But that is also very much anti-American and I do not want to live in a society that can set a limit to how much I can make. If I have special skills, I should be paid accordingly. And if I can only perform non-skilled labor, I better learn a new trait if I want to make more.

But in a free market, like free agency, you are able to maximize your earning potential by being in high demand. That is EXACTLY why players and the NFLPA fought for it in the first place.

And for that, I say good for the players.

It's up to the teams and businesses to do what is best for them. If they feel paying 50% of their budget to one person, well, they better be worth it. Otherwise find someone with a similar skill set that will play/work for what you are willing to pay.

I get what you are saying. Hell, the salary cap itself is un-american. Why shouldn't more successful teams be able to spend as much money as they want on players? But we aren't dealing with an open, free market. This is the NFL. We have a salary cap. If the objective of the players unions is to get as many guys paid as possible, positional caps make a lot of sense. I doubt it happens too, but it makes as much sense as a rookie salary cap.
 

Rockport

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Whoever the next coach is, they have to be ok with Dak Prescott as the quarterback.

That's got to be a big part of the interview process. Some coaches are really hard on their quarterbacks. They need a certain type to run their offense. Otherwise, they have to strip it down, which castrates them as effective playcallers.

If Dallas chooses an offensive guy, he's got to believe Dak can run what he wants. That is crucial.

That's why a defensive-minded coach is likely the ticket. Let Kellen Moore stay as OC and handle that. Get a tough defensive motivator type. LSU took that approach when Coach O hired the Saints passing coordinator for Joe Burrow.

If you go offensive, the new guy has to accept Dak. How many if them might want another option, such as a first-round pick to compete? Would Jerry tolerate that?

I wonder what Riley, Meyer, or any other candidates think about that situation.

It makes a strong case for the Ron Rivera type. He knows what it's like to have a limited passer at QB. If course, Cam could run.

That wouldn't excite me, but it makes sense.

This is an intricate hire coming.
Any coach will be thrilled to have Dak as their QB so your thread is moot which is the norm for you.
 

BleedinBlue

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Didn't Parcells and Jerry have an agreement that Parcells would at least give Carter a fair shot? Try and make it work? I see them franchising Dak and the new HC gives it a shot.
 

jnday

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Passing for what looks to be 5K yards in a season does not equate to a "limited" passer.
Subtract those garbage time numbers and it is not nearly as impressive. He would be the main topic of any QB conversation that the talking heads discussed if his yards were as meaning for as some of the other QBs.
 

jnday

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Didn't Parcells and Jerry have an agreement that Parcells would at least give Carter a fair shot? Try and make it work? I see them franchising Dak and the new HC gives it a shot.
I would expect Jerry to ask any incoming coach give Dak every chance possible .
 

America's Cowboy

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Subtract those garbage time numbers and it is not nearly as impressive. He would be the main topic of any QB conversation that the talking heads discussed if his yards were as meaning for as some of the other QBs.
Just like when Romo passed for 4,900 yards, eh?

Yeah, I thought so.
 

dckid

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Whoever the next coach is, they have to be ok with Dak Prescott as the quarterback.

That's got to be a big part of the interview process. Some coaches are really hard on their quarterbacks. They need a certain type to run their offense. Otherwise, they have to strip it down, which castrates them as effective playcallers.

If Dallas chooses an offensive guy, he's got to believe Dak can run what he wants. That is crucial.

That's why a defensive-minded coach is likely the ticket. Let Kellen Moore stay as OC and handle that. Get a tough defensive motivator type. LSU took that approach when Coach O hired the Saints passing coordinator for Joe Burrow.

If you go offensive, the new guy has to accept Dak. How many if them might want another option, such as a first-round pick to compete? Would Jerry tolerate that?

I wonder what Riley, Meyer, or any other candidates think about that situation.

It makes a strong case for the Ron Rivera type. He knows what it's like to have a limited passer at QB. If course, Cam could run.

That wouldn't excite me, but it makes sense.

This is an intricate hire coming.
If this is your thinking then we are forever doomed as a franchise.
Does Jerry finally want to win? Or does he want to further tarnish the Keystone Franchise of the league.
 
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