Bellecheat screwed up

[Miller]

And Peyton Manning keeps winning 10 plus games every year. Good QB's tend to do that

You are actually making a better point for the Patriots as a whole. Cassell won 11 without Brady a couple years back. Manning has had Harrison, Wayne, Dallas Clark and a host of other talented WRs. They also have some guys that play pretty good D by rushing the passer and this has netted them 1 SB. The Pats have had no one at WR, except Moss, backup RBs and other issues yet as a whole they have done everything discussed here and beat above Colt offense in doing it most of the time. That isn't just Brady. That is their team concept. Brady is great but you can't have him being Dan Marino and putting up stats while everyone else sucks to have the sustained success they have had. Sorry.

 

[MarionBarberThe4th]

And the chiefs won a division w/ Matt Cassell.......

 

[realtick]

And Peyton Manning keeps winning 10 plus games every year. Good QB's tend to do that

Then Troy Aikman freakin' sucked, because as I remember it, the Cowboys didn't win much of anything after '96.

Logic shot... thanks for playing.

 

[Miller]

And the chiefs won a division w/ Matt Cassell.......

Yes, a guy the Patriots drafted in the 7th round and groomed. You are looking silly.

 

[realtick]

What's funny is for some this is really just a "I hate the Patriots" agenda that is underlying the entire thinking going on here.

Right now, all the credit is being lumped onto Tom Brady's shoulders. Ironically, you can bet your bottom dollar that if this was a thread about Brady's greatness, some of these same posters would then revert to saying that Brady was just a product of the system.

 

[MarionBarberThe4th]

I was livid someone gave a MVP vote to Favre in Bradys epic season. That was amazing. Half his games people were pissed they were running up the score. Against pros in the 3rd quarter!

They definitely were running up the score in some of those, but that really is amazing dominance.

Whats my point? The Pats get too cute, now they arent winning Super Bowls anymore when in fact, they probably should be b/c their QB is so good. Dez, Clay, Julio Jones....put 1 or all of them on the Pats and they probably are winning Super Bowls again.

 

[InmanRoshi]

They can pride themselves on being "kings of the draft" to console themselves on not winning a playoff game in the last 3 seasons. Also, their defense finished 26th in the NFL in yards allowed last year. If they were really drafting all these All Pros, couldn't they do better than that?

As pointed out above, Brady will be 34 by the time the season starts. And unlike Manning, who rarely gets hit much less sacked, that's been a hard 34. He's been beaten up and injured pretty badly by the end of the year in the last two seasons. I think the Patriots got a 2 year window to win another Superbowl (it's been 7 seasons since they won their last one in 2004) with Brady, and then it's game on. They had all this ammo at this disposal for this amazing draft where they could have a last hurrah Superbowl run in the Brady era and they had a lot of needs ...a big play WR, a dynamic RB, someone to provide some pass rush to their defense. And they come away with .... a project left tackle?

I respect what Belichick has done in the past, but he does really give off the impression that he's bought into all the hype that he's so much smarter than everyone else in the NFL, and he's gotten way too cute for his own good IMHO.

 

[realtick]

They can pride themselves on being "kings of the draft" to console themselves on not winning a playoff game in the last 3 seasons. Also, their defense finished 26th in the NFL in yards allowed last year. If they were really drafting all these All Pros, couldn't they do better than that?

Lol, yet despite all these supposed draft failings they've found themselves in the playoffs the past three seasons and 8 of the last 10.

But, "why can't they do better?"

The curtain falls on every dynasty, there is an ebb and flow to it. It's hilarious that Cowboy fans question the Patriots greatness when our team has won just one playoff game in what, 15 years?


I swear no truer analogy fits: some people can't see the forest through the trees.

 

[MarionBarberThe4th]

Lol, yet despite all these supposed draft failings they've found themselves in the playoffs the past three seasons and 8 of the last 10.

But, "why can't they do better?"

The curtain falls on every dynasty, there is an ebb and flow to it. It's hilarious that Cowboy fans question the Patriots greatness when our team has won just one playoff game in what, 15 years?


I swear no truer analogy fits: some people can't see the forest through the trees.

Youre missing the point. They are pushing back all these prime picks and by the time they cash them in it will be pointless b/c they will be on the hunt for a new QB.

Hey, congrats on stock piling picks, Im definitely jealous I love the 2nd round. But the time is now, you have the 2nd best player in the league and he wont be around forever. He was cool enough to take a pay cut you can do good by him and get players now. Not for when its time to replace him

11 wins, 12 wins, 11 wins.....all great. You should be doing that w/ Brady! Again, look at the Colts. The cupboard is getting bare but they are still a factor in the AFC.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I think the New England franchise is terrific. Certainly one of the best.

I don't think the drafting has been good or bad... Somewhere in between. Yes, I do think they drafted better the early part of the decade.

Make no mistake, but New England has greatly benefitted from the division they play in. You put them in the NFC East and they wouldn't have anywhere near as good a winning percentage over the last 10 years. They've greatly benefitted from the ineptitude of the other franchises that make up that division.

 

[realtick]

I think the New England franchise is terrific. Certainly one of the best.

I don't think the drafting has been good or bad... Somewhere in between. Yes, I do think they drafted better the early part of the decade.

Make no mistake, but New England has greatly benefitted from the division they play in. You put them in the NFC East and they wouldn't have anywhere near as good a winning percentage over the last 10 years. They've greatly benefitted from the ineptitude of the other franchises that make up that division.

I don't know if that's really a fair criticism for a couple of reasons.

1) Saying "well, if they were in the NFC East...." is a hypothetical.

2) Of recent history, the NY Jets have been one of the league's best teams and they are in the same division.

3) Regardless of any division's perceived strengths or weaknesses, we do know that 7 of the last 10 Super Bowl winners this past decade were from the AFC. In other words, New England has still had to run into the Ravens, Steelers, Colts and Jets on the way to the Super Bowl.

 

[btcutter]

Has anyone considered that New England with all the 1st and 2nd rounds pick maybe able to maneuver up to take Andrew Luck or the next franchise QB in the next few years?

That may not be a bad move.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I don't know if that's really a fair criticism for a couple of reasons.

1) Saying "well, if they were in the NFC East...." is a hypothetical.

2) Of recent history, the NY Jets have been one of the league's best teams and they are in the same division.

3) Regardless of any division's perceived strengths or weaknesses, we do know that 7 of the last 10 Super Bowl winners this past decade were from the AFC. In other words, New England has still had to run into the Ravens, Steelers, Colts and Jets on the way to the Super Bowl.

I don't think anyone could realistically argue that the Pats haven't benefited from a soft division. A weak division offers a nice road to the home field in the playoffs.

The Jets have been 6 games over .500 over the past 11 seasons. That's better than average... But not "one of the league's best teams".

No matter how you slice it, getting 6 games a year vs Miami, Buffalo and the Jets is an advantage.

 

[InmanRoshi]

Has anyone considered that New England with all the 1st and 2nd rounds pick maybe able to maneuver up to take Andrew Luck or the next franchise QB in the next few years?

That may not be a bad move.

It may not be a bad move in theory, but I doubt any GM has the brass ones to be forever known as the guy who traded away the rights to Andrew Luck when they could have had him for themselves. Any team drafting in the #1 spot typically is coming off a season where they had awful QB play and finished 2-14.

 

[realtick]

I don't think anyone could realistically argue that the Pats haven't benefited from a soft division. A weak division offers a nice road to the home field in the playoffs.

The Jets have been 6 games over .500 over the past 11 seasons. That's better than average... But not "one of the league's best teams".

No matter how you slice it, getting 6 games a year vs Miami, Buffalo and the Jets is an advantage.

Right, and these same Jets have been to the AFC championship game the past two seasons.

You can parse regular season records all you want. What do those teams do when they play the best of the best in the playoffs.

Regardless, what you do in the regular season doesn't really matter as long as you get to the show (the playoffs). What you do from from that point is what seperates the wheat from the chaff.

How do you wanna slice it? The Patriots record with Belichek is 116-45 (.720) and 15-4 in the postseason (.789).

Playing in a "weak" division doesn't make you win the playoffs.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Right, and these same Jets have been to the AFC championship game the past two seasons.

You can parse regular season records all you want. What do those teams do when they play the best of the best in the playoffs.

Regardless, what you do in the regular season doesn't really matter as long as you get to the show (the playoffs). What you do from from that point is what seperates the wheat from the chaff.

How do you wanna slice it? The Patriots record with Belichek is 116-45 (.720) and 15-4 in the postseason (.789).

Playing in a "weak" division doesn't make you win the playoffs.

Hey, gaining home field throughout the playoffs by "fattening" on a weak division works.

 

[hornitosmonster]

Hey, gaining home field throughout the playoffs by "fattening" on a weak division works.

Exactly. The recent success for the Jets makes all the years before that much more miserable. The Pats have benefited from having the Jets, Miami, and Buffalo in their division. I will go as far to say that there is no 16-0 season playing in the NFC East. FYI, the Giants got them the 2nd time out...