Is Gender-Neutral Use of the Word "Guys" Harmful to Women?

[Outlaw Heroes]

I was listening to a talk-radio program on the way in to work this morning. The program host read out an email from a listener who was a "parent and an educator". The substance of the email was that the program host should stop referring to guest panels comprised of both men and women as "guys". The claim was that the term fails to take account of the differences between men and women and therefore is harmful to the healthy development of womens' gender identity and self-esteem.

Any views on this? I must confess that I, like the program host, found this to be a bit much. Are women really harmed when a group made up of both men and women (or even a group made up entirely of women) are referred to as "guys"?

 

[Signals]

I would like to make a suggestion. Rather than try to change to behavior of 6 billion people on the planet who already have a habit of using the word "guys," how about changing the definition of the word to be gender neutral. That way all the women are happy and men don't have to change a thing.

Sincerely,

Solomon

 

[Cowboy Brian]

Why does it matter? It's just a word....

 

[VietCowboy]

guys is gender neutral to me. Most romances refer to male-only and mixed gender using the masculine plural words.

If it is a group of girls only, I say gals.

 

[big dog cowboy]

"What do you guys..." and "What do all of you..." mean the same thing to me.

 

[Phoenix]

Can't count how many times I've heard women refer to their women friends as "guys"

 

[ScipioCowboy]

Because the English language lacks a true gender neutral singular pronoun, it defaults to the masculine form wherever the gender is unspecified. This is the proper method of handling unspecified genders. (Please refrain from the Bob Sacamano jokes. I'm talking to you, BBgun.)

However, according to one of my graduate English professors, this method has a negative psychological impact on female readers and listeners. It makes them feel marginalized.

Consequently, whenever I'm writing and the gender is unspecified, I take one of two approaches:

1) Substitute plural nouns such as "people" and "they" for gender-specific singular pronouns.

2) Alternate gender-specific singular pronouns when possible (i.e. "he" and "she").

 

[Wimbo]

i would file this under the heading of "hypersensative (insert human sub-catagory title here) straw-grasping".

 

[MonsterD]

This must be a generational thing. Have you ever heard kids/teens talking to each other informally? If you have, I know you heard them even refer singularly to a female friend as "bro" or "dude". Now a group is different if you are not familiar with all of them, but ce la vie. As someone just outside of the younger generations, I have to admit I kinda perk up w/ a WTH? face when they talk like that. I get older women (30ish more 40s and so forth) getting a little bent out of shape from that.

 

[Faerluna]

I'm 40 and I've been called one of the guys, dude and even bro by one friend. It doesn't bother me in the least.

 

[Hostile]

In most languages the plural of a group of people is masculine as long as there is at least one male present in the group.

For example in Spanish "Ellos" and "Ellas." Both words mean "them" as in "that group of people."

"Ellas" is feminine and is used to describe that group of people if they are all females. It is the exact same as saying "gals" in English. If there was one male in the group "gals" would most likely not be used and instead another word would be chosen and "guys" might be one of the chosen words.

"Ellos" is masculine and would be used to describe any group that has at least one male. This is very similar in French, Italian, Portugese, German, and I am sure many other languages as well.

I suppose all languages and cultures need to be forced to change due to political correctness because a gigantic minority are offended by one word?

Open your real eyes and realize the real lies.

 

[ScipioCowboy]

In modern times, authors tend to resolve the problem by using their own gender. Female authors use "she." Male authors use "he."

 

[Cowboy Brian]

This must be a generational thing. Have you ever heard kids/teens talking to each other informally? If you have, I know you heard them even refer singularly to a female friend as "bro" or "dude". Now a group is different if you are not familiar with all of them, but ce la vie. As someone just outside of the younger generations, I have to admit I kinda perk up w/ a WTH? face when they talk like that. I get older women (30ish more 40s and so forth) getting a little bent out of shape from that.

Oh how I love to call my girl friends bro, always get a what the hell reaction

 

[urface59]

I don't know about you guys but this is the stupidest thing I've ever heard

 

[Outlaw Heroes]

To me, the fundamental issue is whether it really is harmful to the healthy development by women of gender identity and self-esteem. If it is, I'd be all for changing the language (just as we've changed it, for example, by curtailing our use of the offensive term "******" to refer to people who face mental development challenges). I just struggle with the notion that it is harmful.

 

[MonsterD]

I think you should ask these Canadian parents, they seem to believe in it.

[youtube]k0PZHX8heNw[/youtube]

 

[Outlaw Heroes]

I think you should ask these Canadian parents, they seem to believe in it.

[youtube]k0PZHX8heNw[/youtube]

Wow. I'd be interested to hear how this can be justified, if anyone in fact thinks that it can be. As some people in the piece suggested, this child is being conscripted into playing a role in the parents' radical social agenda.

 

[speedkilz88]

Country folk solved this problem long ago. Ya'll

 

[vta]

To me, the fundamental issue is whether it really is harmful to the healthy development by women of gender identity and self-esteem. If it is, I'd be all for changing the language (just as we've changed it, for example, by curtailing our use of the offensive term "******" to refer to people who face mental development challenges). I just struggle with the notion that it is harmful.

Yeah, humanity has made it to this point without sweating the senseless things in life, I'm pretty sure we can grow up and get over the wordings of other people.

 

[Faerluna]

Wow. I'd be interested to hear how this can be justified, if anyone in fact thinks that it can be. As some people in the piece suggested, this child is being conscripted into playing a role in the parents' radical social agenda.

The baby isn't going to be denied knowledge of gender, they just aren't spilling the beans now.

Frankly, who cares?

Is it vitally important for you, or anyone else, to know for certain whether the child is a girl or boy in their infancy?

Is it damaging the baby to not be wearing pink or blue?

Radical social agenda...I swear, mountains out of molehills on the grand scale.