4-3 defense > 3-4 defense

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Dak_Attack_09

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Cowboys don’t need to waste another year trying change a whole defensive scheme to fulfill a coaches’s ego. I understand if it’s a sub package but if it’s a entire scheme change not only will the run defense be worse than last, but the whole scheme will derail this season.

Strength of this defense is the DL 4 man front and LBs ability to freely flow to cover and stop the run NOT rush the passer. Even with the addition of Aldon Smith who is older and less agile will be less effective if he is trying to play 3-4 OLB majority of the snaps. He is a perfect fit for 4-3 DE that can go play OLB in packages.


There will be an IT issue during cowboys draft and McClay will needs to make the right decision not stroke egos.
 
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OmerV

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Cowboys don’t need to waste an another year trying change a whole defensive scheme to fulfill a coaches’s ego. I understand if it’s a sub package but if it’s a entire scheme change not only will the run defense be worse than last, but the whole scheme will derail this season.

Strength of this defense is the DL 4 man front and LBs ability to freely flow to cover and stop the run NOT rush the passer. Even with the addition of Aldon Smith who is older and less agile will be less effective if he is trying to play 3-4 OLB majority of the snaps. He is a perfect fit for 4-3 DE that can go play OLB in packages.


There will be an IT issue during cowboys draft and McClay will needs to make the right decision not stroke egos.
I agree with this for the most part, but McClay doesn't decide defensive schemes or make final draft decisions. He provides the scouting reports and recommendations.
 

Pantone282C

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Cowboys played a variety of schemes that called for the dime and nickel packages. That's the trend for most teams anyway. Gotta have hybrid players to fit that need.
 

John813

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Cowboys have run a 3 man line in the past. 3-3-5 nickel defense that gave the Cardinals fits back in 2017 for example.

Standard formation will be 4 DL. Wouldn't shock me if they had packages where a guy like Gregory may rush standing up here and there or have more exotic looks or blitz packages.
 

Dak_Attack_09

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I believe in Jerry

:omg::omg::omg:

Stepehen Jones is Egotisical?
Done correctly, a 3-4 is great and much easier to find personnel for.

We did NOT do it correctly.

Wrong 3-4 has the hardest personnel to scout, draft and develop. Especially the OLB which are taken with top 12 picks.

That’s why New England switched from 3-4 to 4-3 with little bit of 3-4 sprinkled in.
 

thunderpimp91

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I'm not sure that one is better than the other, but i agree to stick with what you have. Just make modifications and sub packages off the current 4-3. No need to take a full defensive rebuild year, or possibly more to make a switch.

I remember back when the Cowboys made the switch to the 3-4 under Parcells the argument was that it was easier to find players, and cheaper too. Now that seems to have switched. As the game progresses i'm sure it will change again.

I'm still confused as to why people think the Cowboys will play a 3-4 in 2020? It seems that it has been said time and time again that it will be a 4-3
 

ColoradoCowboy

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Stepehen Jones is Egotisical?


Wrong 3-4 has the hardest personnel to scout, draft and develop. Especially the OLB which are taken with top 12 picks.

That’s why New England switched from 3-4 to 4-3 with little bit of 3-4 sprinkled in.
I disagree.

I do agree that a true 3-4 Nose Tackle is a rare man. Tough to find those. However, the ends and LBers are much, MUCH easier to find. You don't need spectacular, you need competent.

In the 4-3, there are two spots that are tough to nail down. Those are MLB and Rush End. The attributes needed to be an above-average rush end in a 4-3 are EXTREMELY hard to find, and you really want 2 of them. I think that it was the Tuna who said that he could find 10 good 3-4 LBers to every 1 good 4-3 end because guys that are 290 pounds, strong as an ox, and as fast as a deer are hard to find. As for MLB, those in a 4-3 are your big, strong, fast run stuffers that can hit any gap with authority. Those have become RARE indeed. So you are searching for 3 rare dudes for a 4-3 and 1 rare dude for a 3-4. Every now and then, you stumble upon a HOFer. Your Reggie White's. Your Brian Urlacher's. Your Lawrence Taylor's. Your Vince Wilfork's.

The reason that the Cheatriots switched was Wilfork. If you recall, his contract expired after 2009 and he wanted, publicly, to get out. He eventually was resigned to a 4 year deal that was really a 2 year deal with an out for the team. So 2011, when the Cheats switched to a 4-3, was Wilfork's last "good" contract year for the team and they had just signed Albert Haynesworth too, so they had a glut of big bodies that year. Haynesworth flamed out spectacularly and the Cheats kept Wilfork all four years of that contract, but he liked playing in a position other than NT and it showed. He was 1st team All-Pro in 2012 as a DT, not a NT. The Cheats even sometimes played Vince EFFEN Wilfork at DE for cryin out loud, and it was NOT because he was the fastest guy they could get on the field. LOL

The beauty of the 3-4 is that the offense KNOWS that there are going to be at least four men coming on every play. But they only know 3 of them. To play a 3-4 correctly, you must have LBers that are equally capable rushing the passer and dropping into coverage, so that ANY one of them could possibly be the fourth rusher. When we last ran the 3-4, everyone and I mean EVERYONE, knew that when the chips were pushed into the middle of the table, Demarcus Ware was going to be the fourth rusher. No deception at all.

This is why taking OLB in the top 12 is a Fool's Errand unless you have TWO of them, or LT; who was a transcendent talent.

What made the Stealers so great at the 3-4 was that, on any given play even if the season were on the line, no one on the opposing offense knew for certain who the fourth rusher was going to be. They had total deception on every snap.

Anyway, I've droned on too long. In short, I disagree.
 

Big_D

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Didn't they waste enough time trying to 'find the right fit'. I see no issue going to some sort of hybrid D. Certainly gives them more flexibility than they cared to use in the past.
 

bigdnlaca

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nolan ran a 4-3 in atlanta if i recall correctly.
In the last year, depending on who they played against, i saw 3-4 with a dlineman being a standup rusher and 5-2. I rarely saw a 4-3 that year. They created a lot of turnovers but didnt get many sacks because they didnt disguise the blitzes. They did get great safety play until William Moore got hurt.
 

xwalker

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Stepehen Jones is Egotisical?


Wrong 3-4 has the hardest personnel to scout, draft and develop. Especially the OLB which are taken with top 12 picks.

That’s why New England switched from 3-4 to 4-3 with little bit of 3-4 sprinkled in.
Wrong.

They played a base 3-4 in 2019.

You are posting without knowing what Nolan has done in the past and without knowing what the Pats have been doing.

You also don't appear to know much about the differences in the 2 schemes.

Which alignment is stronger vs the run?
 

xwalker

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In the last year, depending on who they played against, i saw 3-4 with a dlineman being a standup rusher and 5-2. I rarely saw a 4-3 that year. They created a lot of turnovers but didnt get many sacks because they didnt disguise the blitzes. They did get great safety play until William Moore got hurt.
They played a big 4-3 when they wanted to stop the run. That was 4 DL plus the hybrid LB/DE plus 2 off-ball LBs. More like 4.5-2.5.
 

ondaedg

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I disagree.

I do agree that a true 3-4 Nose Tackle is a rare man. Tough to find those. However, the ends and LBers are much, MUCH easier to find. You don't need spectacular, you need competent.

In the 4-3, there are two spots that are tough to nail down. Those are MLB and Rush End. The attributes needed to be an above-average rush end in a 4-3 are EXTREMELY hard to find, and you really want 2 of them. I think that it was the Tuna who said that he could find 10 good 3-4 LBers to every 1 good 4-3 end because guys that are 290 pounds, strong as an ox, and as fast as a deer are hard to find. As for MLB, those in a 4-3 are your big, strong, fast run stuffers that can hit any gap with authority. Those have become RARE indeed. So you are searching for 3 rare dudes for a 4-3 and 1 rare dude for a 3-4. Every now and then, you stumble upon a HOFer. Your Reggie White's. Your Brian Urlacher's. Your Lawrence Taylor's. Your Vince Wilfork's.

The reason that the Cheatriots switched was Wilfork. If you recall, his contract expired after 2009 and he wanted, publicly, to get out. He eventually was resigned to a 4 year deal that was really a 2 year deal with an out for the team. So 2011, when the Cheats switched to a 4-3, was Wilfork's last "good" contract year for the team and they had just signed Albert Haynesworth too, so they had a glut of big bodies that year. Haynesworth flamed out spectacularly and the Cheats kept Wilfork all four years of that contract, but he liked playing in a position other than NT and it showed. He was 1st team All-Pro in 2012 as a DT, not a NT. The Cheats even sometimes played Vince EFFEN Wilfork at DE for cryin out loud, and it was NOT because he was the fastest guy they could get on the field. LOL

The beauty of the 3-4 is that the offense KNOWS that there are going to be at least four men coming on every play. But they only know 3 of them. To play a 3-4 correctly, you must have LBers that are equally capable rushing the passer and dropping into coverage, so that ANY one of them could possibly be the fourth rusher. When we last ran the 3-4, everyone and I mean EVERYONE, knew that when the chips were pushed into the middle of the table, Demarcus Ware was going to be the fourth rusher. No deception at all.

This is why taking OLB in the top 12 is a Fool's Errand unless you have TWO of them, or LT; who was a transcendent talent.

What made the Stealers so great at the 3-4 was that, on any given play even if the season were on the line, no one on the opposing offense knew for certain who the fourth rusher was going to be. They had total deception on every snap.

Anyway, I've droned on too long. In short, I disagree.

Good points. Always felt the best 3-4s had the freak of natures at NT, ILB and FS. The Casey Hamptons, Lavon Kirklkands, Ed Reids, etc. Those Steeler 3-4 defenses with their zone blitzing were pretty awesome.
 

DanA

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Furiously agreeing with what we've been explicitly told will be the plan. There's been no mention of a switch from 4-3 to 3-4. Just talk about a multiple front consistent with what you want.
 
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