Defensive positives and negatives and where improvement must come

Kwyn said:
The problem is when you’re shopping you can only buy what’s on the shelf.

Phillips is having a good start and Hendrickson is at least active, but they signed $30m/$28m deals. I don’t remember many fans pounding the table for them.

As far as trades, were there any real difference makers traded? Garrett for Verse? That wasn’t an option for us.

This off season has been different. The team has totally changed its approach to the cap and to risk taking. That’s undeniable.

That never meant it was going to pay off in results on the field, but at least the team is actually going for it instead of talking and then not doing anything different with taking risks.
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Kwyn I do agree with you that there probably isn’t much available in a trade now as far as impact pass rushers.

BUT - a good front office - especially one with 38 years of experience should have seen before the season started we had no pass rushers.

IMO they didn’t see it because they suck at roster evaluation. They believe in their own best case scenarios until it’s too late. Very reactionary crew. And the only accountability for will be getting rid of some coaches. Who may deserve it but they aren’t the biggest issue.
 
Bobhaze said:
Game 3 positive and negatives vs the ravens and more importantly where this defense MUST improve…
POSITIVES - honestly not many but here they are:
  • The ravens had 12 possessions and we forced 3 punts and two 4th down stops.
  • We had two red zone stops
  • Held Derrick Henry to less than 4 yds per carry.
NEGATIVES
  • 34 points on 387 yds; 7 splash plays (20 yards or more)
  • Lamar Jackson had no pressure and had a 9.2 yards per attempt passing, well above leave avg.
  • Gave up nearly 200 yds rushing
  • No sacks
  • Zero turnovers
Btw - interesting stat from Bob Sturm on Cowboys defense the last decade: We are 0-10 in games where we get no sacks and no turnovers. The defense that led the NFL in TOs during the Dan Quinn era is long gone, at least at the moment.

WHERE WE MUST IMPROVE TO HAVE A SHOT AT BEING A PLAYOFF TEAM
  • We must start getting some sacks and TOs) No sacks or to’s mean we have no chance. (Again we are 0-10 in last decade when we get no sacks and no TOs)
  • Stop giving up so many big plays.
  • Stop the run. (Where have we heard this before?)
One reason I’m a little “meh” on the Joey Porter trade - he won’t pressure the QB. It’s hard to get picks when there’s no pass rush.

So I will be watching to see if we can manufacture any kind of pass rush the next few weeks. Through 18% of the season, our defense has to blitz to get pressure which puts it all on the secondary. Maybe Porter helps in coverage some. Time will tell.
Click to expand...
BULLET!!!
Somebody wake up Von Van Winkle Miller
 
Bobhaze said:
Game 3 positive and negatives vs the ravens and more importantly where this defense MUST improve…
POSITIVES - honestly not many but here they are:
  • The ravens had 12 possessions and we forced 3 punts and two 4th down stops.
  • We had two red zone stops
  • Held Derrick Henry to less than 4 yds per carry.
NEGATIVES
  • 34 points on 387 yds; 7 splash plays (20 yards or more)
  • Lamar Jackson had no pressure and had a 9.2 yards per attempt passing, well above leave avg.
  • Gave up nearly 200 yds rushing
  • No sacks
  • Zero turnovers
Btw - interesting stat from Bob Sturm on Cowboys defense the last decade: We are 0-10 in games where we get no sacks and no turnovers. The defense that led the NFL in TOs during the Dan Quinn era is long gone, at least at the moment.

WHERE WE MUST IMPROVE TO HAVE A SHOT AT BEING A PLAYOFF TEAM
  • We must start getting some sacks and TOs) No sacks or to’s mean we have no chance. (Again we are 0-10 in last decade when we get no sacks and no TOs)
  • Stop giving up so many big plays.
  • Stop the run. (Where have we heard this before?)
One reason I’m a little “meh” on the Joey Porter trade - he won’t pressure the QB. It’s hard to get picks when there’s no pass rush.

So I will be watching to see if we can manufacture any kind of pass rush the next few weeks. Through 18% of the season, our defense has to blitz to get pressure which puts it all on the secondary. Maybe Porter helps in coverage some. Time will tell.
Click to expand...
Good post, young man!
The no sacks is disturbing.
 
positives:
dt ogbonnia
lb barham
cb bland
cb revell
s downs
they are starting to get pressures.
they are showing a knack for getting the ball loose...even starting to recover some.

negstives:
dt qw
dt kc
edges gary and eze are not generating sacks.
both gotta play better
the rest of our LBs and DBs have been crapola.
struggle getting teams off the field.
run defense is crapola tho better vs henry...a pleasant surprise.
we have no idea how to use hofer von miller.

to do:
downs and barham should not come off the field.
von miller...malachi lawrence and overton all need more snaps.
bland...porter...and revell when healthy should be our cbs.
downs/hooker our s's.
experiment with overshown at safety.
switch back to a 4-3 alignment...maybe hands in the dirt will ignite gary and eze at de spots.

what they are doing now is not working.
cp should ask tom landry,jr for any of his dad's old playbooks and USE THEM.
please and thank you.
 
Bobhaze said:
Game 3 positive and negatives vs the ravens and more importantly where this defense MUST improve…
POSITIVES - honestly not many but here they are:
  • The ravens had 12 possessions and we forced 3 punts and two 4th down stops.
  • We had two red zone stops
  • Held Derrick Henry to less than 4 yds per carry.
NEGATIVES
  • 34 points on 387 yds; 7 splash plays (20 yards or more)
  • Lamar Jackson had no pressure and had a 9.2 yards per attempt passing, well above leave avg.
  • Gave up nearly 200 yds rushing
  • No sacks
  • Zero turnovers
Btw - interesting stat from Bob Sturm on Cowboys defense the last decade: We are 0-10 in games where we get no sacks and no turnovers. The defense that led the NFL in TOs during the Dan Quinn era is long gone, at least at the moment.

WHERE WE MUST IMPROVE TO HAVE A SHOT AT BEING A PLAYOFF TEAM
  • We must start getting some sacks and TOs) No sacks or to’s mean we have no chance. (Again we are 0-10 in last decade when we get no sacks and no TOs)
  • Stop giving up so many big plays.
  • Stop the run. (Where have we heard this before?)
One reason I’m a little “meh” on the Joey Porter trade - he won’t pressure the QB. It’s hard to get picks when there’s no pass rush.

So I will be watching to see if we can manufacture any kind of pass rush the next few weeks. Through 18% of the season, our defense has to blitz to get pressure which puts it all on the secondary. Maybe Porter helps in coverage some. Time will tell.
Click to expand...
Porter will allow CP to send more pressure as he can hold up in single matchups. They are going to need another veteran pass rusher at some point though
 
Bobhaze said:
Kwyn I do agree with you that there probably isn’t much available in a trade now as far as impact pass rushers.

BUT - a good front office - especially one with 38 years of experience should have seen before the season started we had no pass rushers.

IMO they didn’t see it because they suck at roster evaluation. They believe in their own best case scenarios until it’s too late. Very reactionary crew. And the only accountability for will be getting rid of some coaches. Who may deserve it but they aren’t the biggest issue.
Click to expand...
On that we definitely agree. The only thing our front office is good at is making Jerry and Stephen feel like geniuses.
 
75boyz said:
No doubt.
At least the interior first line run defense finally showed somewhat of a pulse along with Barham doing his best at the 2nd level.
Now as far as the edges...
They cant seem to set the edge to save their life.
Nor get home on the pass rush for that matter but that's a different discussion.
Click to expand...
Gary sets the edge very well and is getting hate for it!!!!!
 
Bobhaze said:
Game 3 positive and negatives vs the ravens and more importantly where this defense MUST improve…
POSITIVES - honestly not many but here they are:
  • The ravens had 12 possessions and we forced 3 punts and two 4th down stops.
  • We had two red zone stops
  • Held Derrick Henry to less than 4 yds per carry.
NEGATIVES
  • 34 points on 387 yds; 7 splash plays (20 yards or more)
  • Lamar Jackson had no pressure and had a 9.2 yards per attempt passing, well above leave avg.
  • Gave up nearly 200 yds rushing
  • No sacks
  • Zero turnovers
Btw - interesting stat from Bob Sturm on Cowboys defense the last decade: We are 0-10 in games where we get no sacks and no turnovers. The defense that led the NFL in TOs during the Dan Quinn era is long gone, at least at the moment.

WHERE WE MUST IMPROVE TO HAVE A SHOT AT BEING A PLAYOFF TEAM
  • We must start getting some sacks and TOs) No sacks or to’s mean we have no chance. (Again we are 0-10 in last decade when we get no sacks and no TOs)
  • Stop giving up so many big plays.
  • Stop the run. (Where have we heard this before?)
One reason I’m a little “meh” on the Joey Porter trade - he won’t pressure the QB. It’s hard to get picks when there’s no pass rush.

So I will be watching to see if we can manufacture any kind of pass rush the next few weeks. Through 18% of the season, our defense has to blitz to get pressure which puts it all on the secondary. Maybe Porter helps in coverage some. Time will tell.
Click to expand...
They are getting some pressures. But no one can finish. Hopefully the young pups can take the next step and start closing the deal.

Porter is helpful in that he can be like Mitchell in Philly’s D and take away the short side of the field, travel with an opponent’s #1 option, and allow Parker to send help to cover other priorities.

Right now, they clearly have a long way to go. But the D is young, beat up, learning the 4th new scheme in as many years, and is being led by a green DC.

The floor is low, but the ceiling is high. Qunnen, Barham, Downs, and Porter look to be all dawgs. Bland, Hooker, Thompson, Durant, Clark, Eze, Lawrence, Locke are all serviceable with some upside.

Gary and Miller looked absolutely washed up at the moment. It sucks that we are getting nothing from these overlaid vets. They are now just progress stoppers— but we have zero depth for the front 7.

If we win the next couple of games, maybe JJ swings for another trade that adds a true pass rusher— but in the end— this D is just a work in progress and is gonna take some time to turn it all around.

If we can get to a top 20 D by the stretch run and our offense stays on it’s trajectory, we may be able to peak at the right time.

The trouble is we are still so prone to self inflicted wounds on offense. Schotty is a liability as a game manager and we are still regularly out coached and we are also getting hurt on special teams.

We are not a well run or well coached team.
 
The most improvement needs to come from the people in charge, the people the players trust, to make the right call, the right decision, at the right time,
 
They need to fix the run defense. They are ninth in passing yards/game with 215. They are 31st in rushing yards per game with 180.
 
Bobhaze said:
Game 3 positive and negatives vs the ravens and more importantly where this defense MUST improve…
POSITIVES - honestly not many but here they are:
  • The ravens had 12 possessions and we forced 3 punts and two 4th down stops.
  • We had two red zone stops
  • Held Derrick Henry to less than 4 yds per carry.
NEGATIVES
  • 34 points on 387 yds; 7 splash plays (20 yards or more)
  • Lamar Jackson had no pressure and had a 9.2 yards per attempt passing, well above leave avg.
  • Gave up nearly 200 yds rushing
  • No sacks
  • Zero turnovers
Btw - interesting stat from Bob Sturm on Cowboys defense the last decade: We are 0-10 in games where we get no sacks and no turnovers. The defense that led the NFL in TOs during the Dan Quinn era is long gone, at least at the moment.

WHERE WE MUST IMPROVE TO HAVE A SHOT AT BEING A PLAYOFF TEAM
  • We must start getting some sacks and TOs) No sacks or to’s mean we have no chance. (Again we are 0-10 in last decade when we get no sacks and no TOs)
  • Stop giving up so many big plays.
  • Stop the run. (Where have we heard this before?)
One reason I’m a little “meh” on the Joey Porter trade - he won’t pressure the QB. It’s hard to get picks when there’s no pass rush.

So I will be watching to see if we can manufacture any kind of pass rush the next few weeks. Through 18% of the season, our defense has to blitz to get pressure which puts it all on the secondary. Maybe Porter helps in coverage some. Time will tell.
Click to expand...
Excellent post, as usual, I’m just venting still lol
 
Bobhaze said:
One reason I’m a little “meh” on the Joey Porter trade - he won’t pressure the QB. It’s hard to get picks when there’s no pass rush.

So I will be watching to see if we can manufacture any kind of pass rush the next few weeks. Through 18% of the season, our defense has to blitz to get pressure which puts it all on the secondary. Maybe Porter helps in coverage some. Time will tell.
Click to expand...

As you said, sacks and turnovers are indeed huge. But, everything works together. There are plenty of "coverage sacks" in the NFL so this could help that category you stressed in your post as being important a little.

Then better coverage from one player "in theory" would indeed lead to more turnovers in many ways. On any given pass play as it minimizes the number of wide open options a QB has: both due to Porter's better coverage on his man than the CB he replaces and the ability we have to shade a safety to the other side to help out and let Porter lock down his side. Better coverage also leads to more 3rd and long situations which again in theory leads to more sacks and turnovers. A lot of "in theory" so time will tell. We certainly are better on the field this year and next than before the trade. We shall see if that offsets the loss of a draft pick we might have screwed up anyway...
 
Why I am beginning to doubt CP is one simple reason:
when you have a QB as dangerous with his legs as Lamar Jackson is,
WHY DID WE NOT HAVE A SPY DEDICATED TO HIM?
 
The troubling part is I cannot remember a play where the Cowboys defense even came close to an INT. It just seems like every time the opposing QB throws the football, the receiver is open by multiple yards. I am sure there must be one or two plays I am forgetting but even so, it is a pretty miserable situation.
 
Bobhaze said:
Game 3 positive and negatives vs the ravens and more importantly where this defense MUST improve…
POSITIVES - honestly not many but here they are:
  • The ravens had 12 possessions and we forced 3 punts and two 4th down stops.
  • We had two red zone stops
  • Held Derrick Henry to less than 4 yds per carry.
NEGATIVES
  • 34 points on 387 yds; 7 splash plays (20 yards or more)
  • Lamar Jackson had no pressure and had a 9.2 yards per attempt passing, well above leave avg.
  • Gave up nearly 200 yds rushing
  • No sacks
  • Zero turnovers
Btw - interesting stat from Bob Sturm on Cowboys defense the last decade: We are 0-10 in games where we get no sacks and no turnovers. The defense that led the NFL in TOs during the Dan Quinn era is long gone, at least at the moment.

WHERE WE MUST IMPROVE TO HAVE A SHOT AT BEING A PLAYOFF TEAM
  • We must start getting some sacks and TOs) No sacks or to’s mean we have no chance. (Again we are 0-10 in last decade when we get no sacks and no TOs)
  • Stop giving up so many big plays.
  • Stop the run. (Where have we heard this before?)
One reason I’m a little “meh” on the Joey Porter trade - he won’t pressure the QB. It’s hard to get picks when there’s no pass rush.

So I will be watching to see if we can manufacture any kind of pass rush the next few weeks. Through 18% of the season, our defense has to blitz to get pressure which puts it all on the secondary. Maybe Porter helps in coverage some. Time will tell.
Click to expand...
That’s a pretty low bar for positives, pointing out things that an average defense should do. That’s not what a good defense does, but now they’re getting credit for forcing punts and making some 4th-down stops. I get it, that’s improvement, and while I wouldn’t call it a true positive, it is a step in the right direction.

One consistent factor, though, is their physical play. Even against the Giants, they were aggressive, yes, they got beat up, but they nearly forced five turnovers, punching at the ball and swarming to it. I understand it hasn’t been a good game for the defense, nor a good year, but they are playing hard and physical.

We wanted them to be more physical, and they’re delivering on that.

That’s why players like Trayvon Diggs are no longer here, and more will likely be moved off the team. Some may be making mistakes or missing assignments, but they’re playing full speed, downhill, and giving their all.

I believe that effort will pay off as the season progresses, especially once they cut down on mental errors. If they can improve to around the 20th-ranked defense by midseason, that would be a nice step forward. But keeping points allowed low is crucial, giving up 34 points is the worst possible outcome because points are what matter most.

When the offense can put up 30 against almost anyone and the defense allows 34, it’s just disappointing. I hope things keep moving in the right direction.


Then the injuries and a lot of guys should be back by the Buccaneers game, on a short week, fresh legs, yes Joey Porter junior,

I hope this helps, since we're not really that far down but like 2018, we started out 3-8 And completely flipped the season around, and ended up in the second round of the playoffs,

At least he did this earlier, I mean Jerry Jones been making moves for two years now, offseason, before the trade deadlines, maybe soon it will click.
 
Bobhaze said:
One reason I’m a little “meh” on the Joey Porter trade - he won’t pressure the QB. It’s hard to get picks when there’s no pass rush.

So I will be watching to see if we can manufacture any kind of pass rush the next few weeks. Through 18% of the season, our defense has to blitz to get pressure which puts it all on the secondary. Maybe Porter helps in coverage some. Time will tell.
Click to expand...
regarding this...I wonder if there's a stat about how long opposing QB has to throw.

I simply MUST develop some stat digging skills! (I know I KNOW...just ask internet!)

If the QB has been able to throw pretty quick...maybe some tighter coverage will give the line some time?
 
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