The real cause of a lot of our problems - bad drafts

reddyuta

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is bad drafting. this past season and all the injuries and losses to room, dez and loss of murray showed how thin this team was as opposed to deep.

and a lot of that falls on the shoulder of scouting. and some will argue with coaches developing players. or both.

for what ever reason dallas has done well in the first round. hitting on most players. 2nd round is 50/50 so far. with Lawrence seemingly a hit, but book is out on Crawford. lee is good but often injured. carter was a bust. Gregory was top 10 talent but risky and it shows with him being suspended for 4 games in his second season in the league.

I would venture to say that scouting is good on first round type talent, including lee who dropped because of injury concerns and same with Gregory. dallas has shown they will take risks on top talent in the 2nd round if nothing else.

past 2nd round our draft record is awful. the only player of significance is Murray. we haven't drafted a player of significance in the past 5 years past 2nd round. and that's where you build depth and have to hit on one or two to ake it over the top, given that the 1st and 2nd round talent resource is pretty much the same for all NFL teams.



so is that the fault of scouting dept? or coaching? I think we just haven't done a good job of scouting in recent years under mcclay. prior to him we found an Orlando scandrick and James "Rat" ratlieff, doug free....

good points about Oscan and even Free,we havent hit on a quality starter in late RDs under Mcclay at all,part of the problem is we spend a lot of our scouting resources on top 50 guys (most of the VR visits this years are top 50 guys) and just mail it in the later RDs.The 4th RD really annoys me,we have had some horrendous picks their for a long while and you can still find starters there if you draft well.
 

NEODOG

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We hit on talent because of just that.... 1st is full of talent, what else would you expect?
We find contributers after that.... If they're lucky.

This regime couldn't hold Landry/Tex jock after the game...... Absolutely terrible! BUT they put out a GREAT MARKETING scheme off those original Pokes

SHAME
 

Everson24

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Bad coaching is the real problem.

Teams like Pittsburgh, NE and Seattle coach up their draft picks and teach them techniques that enable them to succeed at the next level. Our coaching staff has been weak in this area for quite some time. Just think about the corners that we draft. They start out playing the ball and making plays but the longer they are here the worse they seem to get.
 

Insomniac

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I did a draft study last year to get an idea what the value of draft picks is. I looked at a number of criteria but the simplest one was just seeing how many games each pick played.I used the draft years 2002-2005. My standard for a successful pick was at least 80 games played. Enough time had gone by that it's unlikely anyone who hadn't met the standard would. (could be wrong)

The results of picks that met the standard in each round:
1st round 73.4%
2nd round 57.8%
3rd round 41.7%
4th round 36.2%
5th round 22.9%
6th round 17.3%
7th round 11.4%
 

CCBoy

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Rocket science. Draft bad players have a bad team amazing insight

ripple2.jpg
 

CCBoy

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I did a draft study last year to get an idea what the value of draft picks is. I looked at a number of criteria but the simplest one was just seeing how many games each pick played.I used the draft years 2002-2005. My standard for a successful pick was at least 80 games played. Enough time had gone by that it's unlikely anyone who hadn't met the standard would. (could be wrong)

The results of picks that met the standard in each round:
1st round 73.4%
2nd round 57.8%
3rd round 41.7%
4th round 36.2%
5th round 22.9%
6th round 17.3%
7th round 11.4%

Nice contribution, guy...just a question, how is Claiborne progressing along a projection line now?
 

Section446

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Absolutely, after the first round, we leave so much to be desired. Thank goodness we lucked out with Romo so many years ago... and we didn't eve draft the guy!
 

CCBoy

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Absolutely, after the first round, we leave so much to be desired. Thank goodness we lucked out with Romo so many years ago... and we didn't eve draft the guy!

Quick reality check...go back and check the success rates for the undrafted players that Dallas brought in, within the past six years. See how many of them are actually achievers.
 

Vinnie2u

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Teams like Pittsburgh, NE and Seattle coach up their draft picks and teach them techniques that enable them to succeed at the next level. Our coaching staff has been weak in this area for quite some time. Just think about the corners that we draft. They start out playing the ball and making plays but the longer they are here the worse they seem to get.

And when they leave they play better..
 

jnday

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Most posters on this board could hit on the 1-2 round picks , not a problem. After those rounds , some posters could hit on just as many, if not more picks than the team. Jerry could save the money he is spending on scouts and buy a draft guide or two and he would hit on just as many picks as they do now.
 

DogFace

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We should have just coached around it. That's what everybody else does.

You'll never hear me take up for this staff, especially Garrett, but not many teams would recover from losing their QB and possibly the best receiver in the league for almost the whole season. I'd venture to say none would make the payoffs.

We lost many close games and were flat out robbed on at least one--The Bucs game. I get the feeling of we did win some of them and had the 15 pick many would be even more upset.

The coaching does need to improve and I'm not sure it will.
 

Vinnie2u

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You'll never hear me take up for this staff, especially Garrett, but not many teams would recover from losing their QB and possibly the best receiver in the league for almost the whole season. I'd venture to say none would make the payoffs.

We lost many close games and were flat out robbed on at least one--The Bucs game. I get the feeling of we did win some of them and had the 15 pick many would be even more upset.

The coaching does need to improve and I'm not sure it will.

Pittsburg lost RuthlessRaper and Vick, Laveon Bell, deangelo williams, and Antonio Brown at the end. Still made it to the playoffs. No excuses.
 

DogFace

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Pittsburg lost RuthlessRaper and Vick, Laveon Bell, deangelo williams, and Antonio Brown at the end. Still made it to the playoffs. No excuses.

Go many games did they miss? How many did they miss together. No excuses sounds good but, it's not realistic.

I like that ruthlessraper though.
 

Insomniac

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Nice contribution, guy...just a question, how is Claiborne progressing along a projection line now?

4 years 40 games. If he stays healthy he could do it. OTOH generally players who are injury prone tend to remain injury prone.
 

Frosty

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Most posters on this board could hit on the 1-2 round picks , not a problem. After those rounds , some posters could hit on just as many, if not more picks than the team. Jerry could save the money he is spending on scouts and buy a draft guide or two and he would hit on just as many picks as they do now.

Bingo.... The Scouts are stealing Jerry's money....they are paid good money to find talent in the late rounds.... Good thing, they don't get paid for results..the scouts would be broke
 

Idgit

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You'll never hear me take up for this staff, especially Garrett, but not many teams would recover from losing their QB and possibly the best receiver in the league for almost the whole season. I'd venture to say none would make the payoffs.

We lost many close games and were flat out robbed on at least one--The Bucs game. I get the feeling of we did win some of them and had the 15 pick many would be even more upset.

The coaching does need to improve and I'm not sure it will.

I was being sarcastic. I think our game day coaching is fine at this point. Not great, but it's ok.
 

Yakuza Rich

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Whether people like it or not, Jerry has the highest % of Pro Bowlers drafted of any GM in the league. And that doesn't count the UDFA's where I think Dallas is likely the best in the league at hitting big-time on UDFA's (Romo, Beasley, Miles Austin, etc).

Where we have struggled is in the 2nd round. It used to be that 2nd round picks were the best picks to have because their cost was far less than 1st round picks and therefore the potential rewards of the pick (many 2nd rounders turn into great players) greatly outweighed the risk (cost of the pick). For some reason we can never quite hit the 2nd round pick. If we do, they are oft-injured. Part of the issue is that we've gone after TE in the 2nd round despite having Witten. And we're not exactly the best organization at finding TE's. Fasano is an NFL quality JAG, Bennett was a coach-killer and Escobar is a representation of the problem with TE's these days.
The other issue I see is that we don't know how to draft DB's. We have looked for cover corners that can't tackle and don't play zone well in a league where you have to play zone (and play man as well). Opposing offenses know when we are playing man or zone and the QB knows where to go with the ball and it becomes a question if the opposing offense can make the play instead of getting the opposing offense to make a mistake in recognizing the defense and capitalizing on that defense.

And we are really poor at safety. I think we still like the idea of the traditional SS role where the SS plays in the box and is responsible for stuffing the run, blitzing occasionally and playing short and intermediate coverage. That really doesn't work these days unless you have a great FS like an Earl Thomas that can do so many things that the SS can play a limited role. Most teams have the FS and SS playing basically the same roles and there's a lot to be asked from them which is why it's so important to have good safeties. We have failed to find the safety talent and we have failed to find a quality safety in FA and we have failed to find an assistant coach that can coach these safeties. And it's not by coincidence that most of your great safeties are going to be found in the 2nd round which is where the team struggles in the draft.

As far as Crawford goes, when healthy he's far better than Lawrence. He was really a dynamic player in 2014. It didn't show up in the stat sheet, but watching him o All-22 you couldn't deny his ability to consistently disrupt plays and opposing teams couldn't prevent him from doing that. This past year basically played on 1 arm and was still better than average. Lawrence came along nicely in the 2nd half of this past season and showed some real promise as a run defender in the first half, but I don't see that disruptive, lead dog type of force.

The main issue for Crawford, besides health, is that his tackling is horrendous. It's another issue with this team...we can't stay healthy and we don't tackle well.

Such is life.




YR
 

DogFace

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I was being sarcastic. I think our game day coaching is fine at this point. Not great, but it's ok.

I'm not sure exactly how I feel about the coaching. Fine seems like a pretty good discriotion. It could be better but, we do always seem to play hard. Strategically, it seems we could do better.
 

Irvin88_4life

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I think if you compare the NFL as a whole we're probably in the middle when it comes to drafting. Some are better. Pittsburg Seattle Carolina.. Bad coaching is the real problem.

Actually Dallas is the best. ......if we go by the stats that Dallas has drafted more pro bowl talent then any other team going back to 2000. It's coaching period, that has been the problem not the talent
 
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