The real cause of a lot of our problems - bad drafts

[BigStar]

Teams routinely do this. They'll pass on a higher-rated player in the late rounds that they think is more likely to go undrafted for whatever physical or personal background reasons and they'll take guys they have lower rankings on that they link are less likely to make it to CFA. Steven Jones talked about it, I think it was after the Ken Bishop draft when they had Davon Coleman as the higher rated player (I may have the players mixed up, but you get the idea). It's a chess game.

Either way, dogunwo is obviously correct, and it's a point I've made several times. Same scouts, same scouting trip, same effort, same ranking, same process. To pretend they're different somehow to make the haul look worse is silly. The only difference is that Dallas probably has a benefit when it comes to attracting FA because we're a very popular franchise with a history of actually playing UDFAs.

I'll take the 3-5th rounders to contribute as well. Hitchens and Crawford...I know of this above practice too but that excuse is being convoluted to explain away the 2nd-5/6th rounds.

 

[Idgit]

I'll take the 3-5th rounders to contribute as well. Hitchens and Crawford...

Hitchens and Crawford are both significant contributors. But there are other players you can pick from those rounds that make your case better. I agree, they need more contributions from those guys.

 

[BigStar]

Hitchens and Crawford are both significant contributors. But there are other players you can pick from those rounds that make your case better. I agree, they need more contributions from those guys.

UDFAs: Leary, Beasley (1 trick pony as we found out last season), Church (slower than some DL), Collins (really?; that happens once in a lifetime). Give them credit for scoring Bailey and Leary. The others are JAGS passed off as starters/niche players. Hitchens is an ok pick and will give you that he has stuck on as a role player/decent starter, but doesn't make big plays yet either. Crawford has been paid to be an 8-10 sack guy. He was injured last year so will give him some slack, but that's what he's paid for as a starting 3 tech in this D.

 

[DandyDon52]

Whether people like it or not, Jerry has the highest % of Pro Bowlers drafted of any GM in the league. And that doesn't count the UDFA's where I think Dallas is likely the best in the league at hitting big-time on UDFA's (Romo, Beasley, Miles Austin, etc).

Where we have struggled is in the 2nd round. It used to be that 2nd round picks were the best picks to have because their cost was far less than 1st round picks and therefore the potential rewards of the pick (many 2nd rounders turn into great players) greatly outweighed the risk (cost of the pick). For some reason we can never quite hit the 2nd round pick. If we do, they are oft-injured. Part of the issue is that we've gone after TE in the 2nd round despite having Witten. And we're not exactly the best organization at finding TE's. Fasano is an NFL quality JAG, Bennett was a coach-killer and Escobar is a representation of the problem with TE's these days.
The other issue I see is that we don't know how to draft DB's. We have looked for cover corners that can't tackle and don't play zone well in a league where you have to play zone (and play man as well). Opposing offenses know when we are playing man or zone and the QB knows where to go with the ball and it becomes a question if the opposing offense can make the play instead of getting the opposing offense to make a mistake in recognizing the defense and capitalizing on that defense.

And we are really poor at safety. I think we still like the idea of the traditional SS role where the SS plays in the box and is responsible for stuffing the run, blitzing occasionally and playing short and intermediate coverage. That really doesn't work these days unless you have a great FS like an Earl Thomas that can do so many things that the SS can play a limited role. Most teams have the FS and SS playing basically the same roles and there's a lot to be asked from them which is why it's so important to have good safeties. We have failed to find the safety talent and we have failed to find a quality safety in FA and we have failed to find an assistant coach that can coach these safeties. And it's not by coincidence that most of your great safeties are going to be found in the 2nd round which is where the team struggles in the draft.

As far as Crawford goes, when healthy he's far better than Lawrence. He was really a dynamic player in 2014. It didn't show up in the stat sheet, but watching him o All-22 you couldn't deny his ability to consistently disrupt plays and opposing teams couldn't prevent him from doing that. This past year basically played on 1 arm and was still better than average. Lawrence came along nicely in the 2nd half of this past season and showed some real promise as a run defender in the first half, but I don't see that disruptive, lead dog type of force.

The main issue for Crawford, besides health, is that his tackling is horrendous. It's another issue with this team...we can't stay healthy and we don't tackle well.

Such is life.




YR

good post,
"The main issue for Crawford, besides health, is that his tackling is horrendous" in the GB game last year, rodgers broke his tackle
on way to a key 1st down run. lol
And he has been injured his whole time here, and yet they paid him what 40 mil for 4 years ?

 

[fortdick]

Well as of right now its Cowboys day, 4 and 12 outta 16

I hear the Broncos need more fans.

 

[DEA_dad]

I hear the Broncos need more fans.

Sorry, I bleed silver and blue, there are better times ahead, im absolutely sure. The numbers just happened to work out today

 

[Yakuza Rich]

good post,
"The main issue for Crawford, besides health, is that his tackling is horrendous" in the GB game last year, rodgers broke his tackle
on way to a key 1st down run. lol
And he has been injured his whole time here, and yet they paid him what 40 mil for 4 years ?

I don't think I've ever seen a player like Crawford. He completely disrupts plays (when healthy) time after time, but then can't make the tackle.

I can understand why they paid him what they did after 2014. He really was spectacular at disrupting plays and you would think that he would learn to tackle better after a while.





YR

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

Of course, there is Tony Romo and La'el Collins as well. Quite a lot of contributors from non drafted sources. And that includes starters. A pretty good return when considering contributions lower in the draft or afterwards. You can add Lucky Whitehead as well.

But let's go ahead and to Church, add in Ronald Leary and Lance Dunbar as well.

I was wrong about Wilcox, sorry, he was drafted in the 3rd round.

As to Dwayne Harris, he was in deed drafted by Dallas in the 6th round...but at least he was a low range player contributing. But I think the recently current Dallas roster reflects a pretty strong tend in due diligence in the lower rounds and undrafted players added.

This training camp will determine actual percentages of success, but that is a competitive process, and not just selective.

that's a good point. for some reason we are decent in finding UDFAs and developing them. but can't do the same for players in round 2-7. not sure what gives. with that said. Lael Collins was a projected first round pick. he didn't get drafted because of off field issues. same with Gregory. a top 10 talent that dropped and now we know why. so I go back to my original post. we are good in evaluating first round talent. 2nd round we take risks on players that dropped for one reason or another. after that we are average.

now in UDFA we have done decent...certainly Romo. Miles Austin who had a flash. the rest are role players that won't wow you. but fill a role and that's fine. no impact players.

we just need to hit on couple of mid to low round picks that become prenial pro-bowlers, impact players. then we can probably get over the hump. this is assuming that all teams have pretty much similar hit rate on their 1st round talents and similar set of assets. so that levels the playing field. the ability/luck to hit a grand slam with mid round assets is going to help set teams apart.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

is bad drafting. this past season and all the injuries and losses to room, dez and loss of murray showed how thin this team was as opposed to deep.

and a lot of that falls on the shoulder of scouting. and some will argue with coaches developing players. or both.

for what ever reason dallas has done well in the first round. hitting on most players. 2nd round is 50/50 so far. with Lawrence seemingly a hit, but book is out on Crawford. lee is good but often injured. carter was a bust. Gregory was top 10 talent but risky and it shows with him being suspended for 4 games in his second season in the league.

I would venture to say that scouting is good on first round type talent, including lee who dropped because of injury concerns and same with Gregory. dallas has shown they will take risks on top talent in the 2nd round if nothing else.

past 2nd round our draft record is awful. the only player of significance is Murray. we haven't drafted a player of significance in the past 5 years past 2nd round. and that's where you build depth and have to hit on one or two to ake it over the top, given that the 1st and 2nd round talent resource is pretty much the same for all NFL teams.



so is that the fault of scouting dept? or coaching? I think we just haven't done a good job of scouting in recent years under mcclay. prior to him we found an Orlando scandrick and James "Rat" ratlieff, doug free....

There is no one "real cause"...
We have 3-6 issues... Easily..

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

There is no one "real cause"...
We have 3-6 issues... Easily..

very true. there is almost never one reason. but I think this contributes greatly. if you have talent, its easy to win. last year was a great evidence

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

very true. there is almost never one reason. but I think this contributes greatly. if you have talent, its easy to win. last year was a great evidence

You can easily dwindle talent away.

We've wasted Witten, Ware and Romo's talent... Etc...
(Ware lucked out)

 

[CanadianCowboysFan]

is bad drafting. this past season and all the injuries and losses to room, dez and loss of murray showed how thin this team was as opposed to deep.

and a lot of that falls on the shoulder of scouting. and some will argue with coaches developing players. or both.

for what ever reason dallas has done well in the first round. hitting on most players. 2nd round is 50/50 so far. with Lawrence seemingly a hit, but book is out on Crawford. lee is good but often injured. carter was a bust. Gregory was top 10 talent but risky and it shows with him being suspended for 4 games in his second season in the league.

I would venture to say that scouting is good on first round type talent, including lee who dropped because of injury concerns and same with Gregory. dallas has shown they will take risks on top talent in the 2nd round if nothing else.

past 2nd round our draft record is awful. the only player of significance is Murray. we haven't drafted a player of significance in the past 5 years past 2nd round. and that's where you build depth and have to hit on one or two to ake it over the top, given that the 1st and 2nd round talent resource is pretty much the same for all NFL teams.



so is that the fault of scouting dept? or coaching? I think we just haven't done a good job of scouting in recent years under mcclay. prior to him we found an Orlando scandrick and James "Rat" ratlieff, doug free....

water is wet