Ranking an incredibly talented roster

[Diehardblues]

That offense was better but I will take this D, sight unseen in 2019, over that one.

I really do believe that this defense could be the most talented one we've had since the glory days of the 90's. That 90's team had it's stars too but I like the potential of this overall team with this D. And the 90's team could still have depth before FA showed up.

How can you rank a team before seeing it?

Sounds like Jerry hype. Lol

 

[QuincyCarterEra]

I'd flip Zeke and Martin but not a bad list erod.

This isn't a positional value thing, you think Zeke is a better overall player than Zach Martin?

 

[xwalker]

2012 Baltimore Ravens. Lots of star power but Flacco wasn’t elite, just had a good playoff run. Ray Rice had to carry the offense.

They won the ring with Ray Lewis, Haloti Ngata And Ed Reed on D, but they were 12th in total D during the regular season, and that was bloated because they played the Browns, Bengals, and Steelers 6 times in a down year for the division. No Antonio Brown yet, Steelers went 8-8, Bengals won 10 games with their D.

They were talented, had big names but not a lot of position cohesion, at least until the AFCCG/SB. Marshal Yanda, Matt Birk Vontae Leach, Michael Oher, Terrell Suggs... they had plenty of names.

The 2011 Giants barely squeezed into those parameters (top 5 defense, top 10 offense or Elite QB).

Offense
Points Scored: 9th
Yards: 8th

Defense
Points Allowed: 25th
Yards Allowed: 27th

I've never really considered Eli as an "Elite" QB.

 

[Diehardblues]

2012 Baltimore Ravens. Lots of star power but Flacco wasn’t elite, just had a good playoff run. Ray Rice had to carry the offense.

They won the ring with Ray Lewis, Haloti Ngata And Ed Reed on D, but they were 12th in total D during the regular season, and that was bloated because they played the Browns, Bengals, and Steelers 6 times in a down year for the division. No Antonio Brown yet, Steelers went 8-8, Bengals won 10 games with their D.

They were talented, had big names but not a lot of position cohesion, at least until the AFCCG/SB. Marshal Yanda, Matt Birk Vontae Leach, Michael Oher, Terrell Suggs... they had plenty of names.

Yep but more of the exception not the rule. Thanks

 

[Diehardblues]

Was there a parade for that major accomplishment? Guess I missed it.

Haven’t you heard. We’re hanging divisional banners now like other teams do. Lol

We aren’t a Super Bowl or Bust franchise Anymore.

 

[Diehardblues]

This isn't a positional value thing, you think Zeke is a better overall player than Zach Martin?

Pretty close.. an argument could be made for both.

 

[QuincyCarterEra]

Pretty close.. an argument could be made for both.

Zeke is really good, but has a couple holes in his game and isn't elite in other areas. I.E. receiving, fumbling, long speed

Zach Martin is the perfect guard that is elite in every aspect.

I don't see any plausible argument, and the two really aren't remotely close.

Martin at a position with twice as many starters is the undisputed best guard in the league, while Zeke at a position with one starter per team is hotly debated as 3-5 by the masses.

 

[Diehardblues]

Some members here will argue that the team IS winning.... as long as you will consider regular season accomplishments as 'winning'.

The Bar has been lowered whether we all want to accept or not. Although there are still some SB or Bust mentalities out there which comes with a franchise with our illustrious history.

But there’s never any guarantees we’ll ever win another championship. It doesn’t make us a bad franchise just not one-of the best anymore. Tough to hold to that Bar when our owner isn’t doing everything within his power to win.

 

[slick325]

This isn't a positional value thing, you think Zeke is a better overall player than Zach Martin?

I do there isn't anything he can't do on a football filefield. He can block, he can catch, he obviously can run the ball with toughness, agility and speed. The dude is special.

In saying that, I am not demeaning Martin who is head and shoulders the best at his position in the League and the best lineman on his team. Martin is a bad boy.

If both remain healthy, both make the HOF first ballot IMO.

 

[xwalker]

I'll believe that when I see it. Austin still looks like the top candidate to handle punt returns and I will have to see Pollard show the on-field speed that Austin does.

But I do concede this, I think if Austin gets hurt and misses time during the preseason, he's a goner. He has to be available.

I had forgotten until somebody mentioned it recently but Austin didn't miss many games before last season. When I think of him I think injury prone, but he really wasn't with the Rams. He is 29 now and missed 9 of 18 last season.

• 14 missed of 99 (career)
• 5 missed of 81 (prior to 2018)

 

[Diehardblues]

Zeke is really good, but has a couple holes in his game and isn't elite in other areas. I.E. receiving, fumbling, long speed

Zach Martin is the perfect guard that is elite in every aspect.

I don't see any plausible argument, and the two really aren't remotely close.

Martin at a position with twice as many starters is the undisputed best guard in the league, while Zeke at a position with one starter per team is hotly debated as 3-5 by the masses.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. It’s a subjective argument.

Is Zach one of the best pass blocking Guards in the league? I’ve read some concerns on this aspect.

 

[CouchCoach]

How can you rank a team before seeing it?

Sounds like Jerry hype. Lol

You must have missed the words "could be"? Everything is on paper, for every team, until it gets real.

With this D, I take what I've seen, and yes I saw it in Indy and LA, consider another year for the young guys like both Woods, Awuzie, Lewis, Smith, Vander Esch and the addition of Quinn, Iloka and Hill and I like what I see better than I have seen in two decades. Of courser, that cam come undone, injuries, guys not living up to my expectations and coaching blunders.

But for this thread, Erod is all about what it looks like on paper and it's not that we haven't seen most of it on the field.

 

[Diehardblues]

I had forgotten until somebody mentioned it recently but Austin didn't miss many games before last season. When I think of him I think injury prone, but he really wasn't with the Rams. He is 29 now and missed 9 of 18 last season.

• 14 missed of 99 (career)
• 5 missed of 81 (prior to 2018)

It wasn’t just his injuries which were a concern. Remember he was a 1st round pick who’s under achieved this far regardless of injuries.

 

[Diehardblues]

You must have missed the words "could be"? Everything is on paper, for every team, until it gets real.

With this D, I take what I've seen, and yes I saw it in Indy and LA, consider another year for the young guys like both Woods, Awuzie, Lewis, Smith, Vander Esch and the addition of Quinn, Iloka and Hill and I like what I see better than I have seen in two decades. Of courser, that cam come undone, injuries, guys not living up to my expectations and coaching blunders.

But for this thread, Erod is all about what it looks like on paper and it's not that we haven't seen most of it on the field.

Yea I missed the could be. But still difficult to rank the unknowns which serve no purpose in an accurate comparison. Like predicting futures to results.

My take on Erods is based on what he’s seen thus far not as much futures. But like anything we can interpret differently .

 

[Parcells4Life]

If Maliek Collins is better than Dak this is a 5-11 team

 

[QuincyCarterEra]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. It’s a subjective argument.

Is Zach one of the best pass blocking Guards in the league? I’ve read some concerns on this aspect.

Amongst guards with 1,500 snaps over the last five years Martin is 2nd in run blocking and 3rd in pass blocking.

No concerns here.

 

[Diehardblues]

Amongst guards with 1,500 snaps over the last five years Martin is 2nd in run blocking and 3rd in pass blocking.

No concerns here.

Where are these rankings found?

 

[QuincyCarterEra]

Where are these rankings found?

PFF

His run blocking is only behind Marshall Yanda, doesn't say he's behind in pass blocking.

 

[Teague31]

Still don’t get the Chido love. Dude has been abused on a regular basis

 

[Parcells4Life]

My top 30 would be

1) Martin
2) Zeke
3) DLaw
4) Frederick
5) Cooper
6) Tyron
7) LVE
8) Dak
9) Byron
10) Jaylon
11) Quinn
12) Chido
13) Gallup
14) Cobb
15) X Woods
16) La’El
17) T Crawford
18) M Collins
19) Connor Williams
20) Lee
21) Witten
22) A Woods
23) Pollard
24) Chris Jones
25) Maher
26) Heath
27) Hill
28) LP Ladoceur
29) Jarwin
30) A Brown