The long-term future of the RE position

Cowboyny · Jun 20, 2020

The right defensive end position seems to be a revolving door on a yearly basis; Greg Hardy, Randy Gregory, Taco Charlton, Robert Quinn, Aldon Smith. The front office has tried to address the position via the draft with zero success. Taco we are all are aware of, but the likes of Charles Tapper, Ben Gardner, Ryan Russell, Dorance Armstrong. Rod Marinelli was considered prior to coming to the Cowboys as one of the best in developing young DL Talent. Outside of Lawrence and maybe Crawford, very little success at the position.

This year many like the idea of drafting Chaisson from LSU as he would finally address the need long-term. However, he did come attached with legitimate question marks with production. Edge rushers are always in high demand, they are often overdrafted and come with a high bust rate. It's also a position in which there is a lot of development on this level, as they can no longer just rely on their athletic abilities against NFL caliber Tackles.

Many will argue this position is more important then any other on the entire unit. The best defensive teams are the ones who can generate a pass rush without the need to blitz. It puts way too much pressure on the back end and no team can be successful if a NFL QB has the time.

conner01 · Jun 20, 2020

It’s a very hard position to draft. The Dline as a whole is pretty tough to draft. Its kinda odd because the guys in front of them tend to live up to the draft spot at a much higher rate
I think most of that is teams over draft the Dline because they under appreciate the oline
It’s considered “not a sexy pick” to draft a RT but not the guy in front of him
The long term solution at RE is not on this roster most likely
I like what we did in the draft, I think smith is a low risk high reward possibility short term. I think we took some shots at it but we missed with taco and looking at the Dline as a whole we missed most likely with hill
And while at DT we added two really nice additions they aren’t long term solutions either
I like chaisson myself and I would have taken him at 17 in a heartbeat. But once lamb fell you really couldn’t pass on him

JoeKing · Jun 20, 2020

Cowboyny said:
The right defensive end position seems to be a revolving door on a yearly basis; Greg Hardy, Randy Gregory, Taco Charlton, Robert Quinn, Aldon Smith. The front office has tried to address the position via the draft with zero success. Taco we are all are aware of, but the likes of Charles Tapper, Ben Gardner, Ryan Russell, Dorance Armstrong. Rod Marinelli was considered prior to coming to the Cowboys as one of the best in developing young DL Talent. Outside of Lawrence and maybe Crawford, very little success at the position.

This year many like the idea of drafting Chaisson from LSU as he would finally address the need long-term. However, he did come attached with legitimate question marks with production. Edge rushers are always in high demand, they are often overdrafted and come with a high bust rate. It's also a position in which there is a lot of development on this level, as they can no longer just rely on their athletic abilities against NFL caliber Tackles.

Many will argue this position is more important then any other on the entire unit. The best defensive teams are the ones who can generate a pass rush without the need to blitz. It puts way too much pressure on the back end and no team can be successful if a NFL QB has the time.

We didn't even draft Chaisson so there is no point in mentioning his name. He was never going to be the long term stability we need at that position anyway. I don't think year to year continuity with the same guy at that position really matters all that much in the first place as long as the guy there is good enough to have the job.

Cowboyny · Jun 20, 2020

conner01 said:
It’s a very hard position to draft. The Dline as a whole is pretty tough to draft. Its kinda odd because the guys in front of them tend to live up to the draft spot at a much higher rate
I think most of that is teams over draft the Dline because they under appreciate the oline
It’s considered “not a sexy pick” to draft a RT but not the guy in front of him
The long term solution at RE is not on this roster most likely
I like what we did in the draft, I think smith is a low risk high reward possibility short term. I think we took some shots at it but we missed with taco and looking at the Dline as a whole we missed most likely with hill
And while at DT we added two really nice additions they aren’t long term solutions either
I like chaisson myself and I would have taken him at 17 in a heartbeat. But once lamb fell you really couldn’t pass on him

-Outside of Lawrence, the whole DL is a question mark for the long-term future. They are hoping either Gallimore or Hill hits at DT. McCoy and Poe are just short-term fixes at this juncture.

-Aldon, Gregory, Crawford are all playing on 1 yr deals at this time. I don't believe any of the 3 are long-term answers. If 1 breaks out, he probably will be playing elsewhere next season due to the price.

-I agree we couldn't pass up Lamb as he was 6th on their board. However, Chaisson had the potential to become a long-term starter at the position. He was a raw prospect that needed development. Very rarely can you find an impact pass rusher past the top 10 in the draft.

-The front office has to keep pushing to land a legitimate, long-term starter at the position.

CalPolyTechnique · Jun 20, 2020

There was zero doubt in my mind Chaisson was the pick had Lamb not dropped. Jerruh has said as much.

Cowboyny · Jun 20, 2020

JoeKing said:
We didn't even draft Chaisson so there is no point in mentioning his name. He was never going to be the long term stability we need at that position anyway. I don't think year to year continuity with the same guy at that position really matters all that much in the first place as long as the guy there is good enough to have the job.

Chaisson would of been the pick if Lamb didn't fall in their laps. This tells us that the Front Office wants to fill this area with a legitimate prospect at the position, that they know they don't have such a player on their current roster. Aldon/Gregory even Crawford are more bridge type players at this time. They have to start developing, young, affordable talent at the position or have to pay on the open market. The likes of Gregory/Aldon playing on such low level deals will change if they show any sort of production.

CowboyRoy · Jun 20, 2020

Cowboyny said:
The right defensive end position seems to be a revolving door on a yearly basis; Greg Hardy, Randy Gregory, Taco Charlton, Robert Quinn, Aldon Smith. The front office has tried to address the position via the draft with zero success. Taco we are all are aware of, but the likes of Charles Tapper, Ben Gardner, Ryan Russell, Dorance Armstrong. Rod Marinelli was considered prior to coming to the Cowboys as one of the best in developing young DL Talent. Outside of Lawrence and maybe Crawford, very little success at the position.

This year many like the idea of drafting Chaisson from LSU as he would finally address the need long-term. However, he did come attached with legitimate question marks with production. Edge rushers are always in high demand, they are often overdrafted and come with a high bust rate. It's also a position in which there is a lot of development on this level, as they can no longer just rely on their athletic abilities against NFL caliber Tackles.

Many will argue this position is more important then any other on the entire unit. The best defensive teams are the ones who can generate a pass rush without the need to blitz. It puts way too much pressure on the back end and no team can be successful if a NFL QB has the time.

I think a part of this year at RDE is finding out if Gregory can be the future there. Heck if Aldon can have a 8-10 sack season and play the run well then he can play 2 or 3 more years.

We are going to be hard pressed to find a pass rusher drafting in the late 20's for the next couple years.

Hennessy_King · Jun 20, 2020

Chaisson is going to be a bust. Just watch his tape most of his sacks are based off stunts ways to get him free. I think he had only 2 sacks just beating his man. He got dominated by Georgia's thomas I think maybe winning 1 rep where he got a pressure and caused an incomplete pass.

The last RE we should have drafted was in 2017 which was carl lawson. who was the best d lineman in the class and went in the 4th round to the bengals.

Stash · Jun 20, 2020

Seems to me that the Cowboys have made bad decisions at the RDE spot for years. And to make up for those mistakes, they've taken character risks and gotten burned again and again. In between, it's been a myriad of patches and quick fixes. But when great options have presented themselves, (Danielle Hunter, TJ Watt), the Cowboys made the wrong choice and drafted guys like Gregory and Taco Charlton instead.

They've been poor in their evaluations there.

RandyOh · Jun 20, 2020

CowboyRoy said:
I think a part of this year at RDE is finding out if Gregory can be the future there. Heck if Aldon can have a 8-10 sack season and play the run well then he can play 2 or 3 more years.

We are going to be hard pressed to find a pass rusher drafting in the late 20's for the next couple years.

This. We may need to trade a a 1st and couple 2nds one year to move up for a RE even trade a 1st and/or a 2nd round pick for a good DE still young enough to give a good 6 to 8 years of pro bowl level production. The Jags wanting to trade away Yannick Ngakoue this offseason would be the type of trade for a DE i have in mind.

Stash · Jun 20, 2020

RandyOh said:
This. We may need to trade a a 1st and couple 2nds one year to move up for a RE even trade a 1st and/or a 2nd round pick for a good DE still young enough to give a good 6 to 8 years of pro bowl level production. The Jags wanting to trade away Yannick Ngakoue this offseason would be the type of trade for a DE i have in mind.

Two defensive ends being paid $21 million a year-plus?

big dog cowboy · Jun 20, 2020

CowboyRoy said:
We are going to be hard pressed to find a pass rusher drafting in the late 20's for the next couple years.

Or at 32.

charron · Jun 20, 2020

By the time we find a good long term solution at RDE Dlaw will be on his way out. Stephen needs to continue to bring in guys like Quinn, Smith, Mayowa while also trying to develop some of these long shots into atleast a solid rotational piece of the Dline.

RandyOh · Jun 20, 2020

stasheroo said:
Two defensive ends being paid $21 million a year-plus?

I mean at one point our payroll had Tyron Smith as the highest paid OT in football, Travis Frederick the highest paid Center in football, and Zach Martin the highest paid OG and 2nd highest paid OL in all of football. If we can invest that much money as well as continued support of high draft picks towards the Offensive line, then I see no reason why we can't have 2 highly paid Defensive linemen. Both line just as important as the other and I wasnt saying to go after Ngakoue specifically but if a young talent like that becomes available then i see no reason why not. Better then investing huge contracts into the defensive back field that rely on pressures and sacks to be truly useful in todays league where they call pass interference for any little thing.

Oz-of-Cowboy-Country · Jun 20, 2020

Hennessy_King said:
Chaisson is going to be a bust. Just watch his tape most of his sacks are based off stunts ways to get him free. I think he had only 2 sacks just beating his man. He got dominated by Georgia's thomas I think maybe winning 1 rep where he got a pressure and caused an incomplete pass.

The last RE we should have drafted was in 2017 which was carl lawson. who was the best d lineman in the class and went in the 4th round to the bengals.

I was hoping we didn't draft K'Lavon because he seemed to be more of a 3-4 OLB than a 4-3 DE. Putting him at DE would be a waste, IMO.

But I wanted us to sign Preston Smith instead of re-signing DLaw at LDE. And I wanted us to draft Maxx Crosby last year to start at RDE. Having those two guys for the next four years would have been great.

AbeBeta · Jun 20, 2020

Cowboyny said:
-Outside of Lawrence, the whole DL is a question mark for the long-term future. They are hoping either Gallimore or Hill hits at DT. McCoy and Poe are just short-term fixes at this juncture.

-Aldon, Gregory, Crawford are all playing on 1 yr deals at this time. I don't believe any of the 3 are long-term answers. If 1 breaks out, he probably will be playing elsewhere next season due to the price.

-I agree we couldn't pass up Lamb as he was 6th on their board. However, Chaisson had the potential to become a long-term starter at the position. He was a raw prospect that needed development. Very rarely can you find an impact pass rusher past the top 10 in the draft.

-The front office has to keep pushing to land a legitimate, long-term starter at the position.

Right. Gregory or Smith break out and they choose to go elsewhere?

Very unlikely as both wouldn't want to a different environment.

Also, Gregory's rights are ours for at least another year after next season since he was suspended in 19. Possibly even 2 since he was also suspended in 17

CalPolyTechnique · Jun 20, 2020

Hennessy_King said:
Chaisson is going to be a bust. Just watch his tape most of his sacks are based off stunts ways to get him free. I think he had only 2 sacks just beating his man. He got dominated by Georgia's thomas I think maybe winning 1 rep where he got a pressure and caused an incomplete pass.

The last RE we should have drafted was in 2017 which was carl lawson. who was the best d lineman in the class and went in the 4th round to the bengals.

Four tackles, 1 sack, and 1 PD thrown in against a quality tackle.

That's a good game for DE.

What are people thinking?

75boyz · Jun 20, 2020

Cowboyny said:
The right defensive end position seems to be a revolving door on a yearly basis; Greg Hardy, Randy Gregory, Taco Charlton, Robert Quinn, Aldon Smith. The front office has tried to address the position via the draft with zero success. Taco we are all are aware of, but the likes of Charles Tapper, Ben Gardner, Ryan Russell, Dorance Armstrong. Rod Marinelli was considered prior to coming to the Cowboys as one of the best in developing young DL Talent. Outside of Lawrence and maybe Crawford, very little success at the position.

This year many like the idea of drafting Chaisson from LSU as he would finally address the need long-term. However, he did come attached with legitimate question marks with production. Edge rushers are always in high demand, they are often overdrafted and come with a high bust rate. It's also a position in which there is a lot of development on this level, as they can no longer just rely on their athletic abilities against NFL caliber Tackles.

Many will argue this position is more important then any other on the entire unit. The best defensive teams are the ones who can generate a pass rush without the need to blitz. It puts way too much pressure on the back end and no team can be successful if a NFL QB has the time.

Nice post. I share in both your historical and present opinion regarding this position.

I am rather shocked at the contrast in drafting/acquiring of all of the OL positions and how well the team has done. Almost a night and day difference in my eyes.

Plasticman had a great post about the lack of corners who actually intercept the ball dating way back and of course, the ever present "Franchise or Game Manager" conundrum at QB.

For all the SPARQ science, research and resources that goes into drafting, it's still a crap shoot roll of the dice.

Again, nice post.

conner01 · Jun 20, 2020

Cowboyny said:
-Outside of Lawrence, the whole DL is a question mark for the long-term future. They are hoping either Gallimore or Hill hits at DT. McCoy and Poe are just short-term fixes at this juncture.

-Aldon, Gregory, Crawford are all playing on 1 yr deals at this time. I don't believe any of the 3 are long-term answers. If 1 breaks out, he probably will be playing elsewhere next season due to the price.

-I agree we couldn't pass up Lamb as he was 6th on their board. However, Chaisson had the potential to become a long-term starter at the position. He was a raw prospect that needed development. Very rarely can you find an impact pass rusher past the top 10 in the draft.

-The front office has to keep pushing to land a legitimate, long-term starter at the position.

I was very high on chaisson myself
He has potential to be very good
I like gallimore and I think he will be good but not likely a McCoy type good
I like the DE we took but he’s not likely to be elite
There are few elite pass rushers and as you said they go early

Hennessy_King · Jun 20, 2020

CalPolyTechnique said:
Four tackles, 1 sack, and 1 PD thrown in against a quality tackle.

That's a good game for DE.

What are people thinking?

His one sack was against the right tackle. The one pressure was his PD. He was on a stacked team and still didnt ball out

The long-term future of the RE position

Cowboyny

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