2011 Draft- Go OL or DL?

funkytown

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Constant months of going over scouting reports, senior bowl/combine notes, mock drafts, etc.....I am having a huge internal question for this years draft....

With their first two picks, should the boys fix the OL, DL, or a combo of both?????


Its clear that the talent on both sides of the line is real heavy in the first two rounds. You could actually fix either problem with the first two picks if you double up. For example: (and these are just examples-Sub in/out who u want)

Round 1 (9): Tyron Smith OT USC
Round 2 (40) Danny Watkins OG/OT Baylor

or
Round 1 (9): Cameron Jordan DE California
Round 2 (40) or Trade up: Phil Taylor NT Baylor

Or you could mix them and take OL/DL with your first two picks...

Either of the scenarios should be the way to go in this years draft. I'm all for "beefing up" in this years draft...Of course the secondary has issues, and needs to be fixed. But i think free agency and mid round picks can help shore up the secondary. (Unless we can get Patrick Peterson)...


What does everyone else think????
 
As bad as this defense is (horrible), I really think they are going to draft Smith if he is there unless somebody unexpected drops. I think ultimately Smith ends up a shut down LT. Even if he doesnt there are plenty of edge rushers on the right side, and he can get out and block on the second level, opening up the offense for guys like Felix Jones. In 09 the offense played its best with Free at RT because he could get out and block in space.
 
RS12;3882326 said:
As bad as this defense is (horrible), I really think they are going to draft Smith if he is there unless somebody unexpected drops. I think ultimately Smith ends up a shut down LT. Even if he doesnt there are plenty of edge rushers on the right side, and he can get out and block on the second level, opening up the offense for guys like Felix Jones. In 09 the offense played its best with Free at RT because he could get out and block in space.

I agree on the Free comment.

Personally i'm not for drafting Smith at 9. I used him in the scenario because he's the popular pick right now.

If no one slides, and the Boys are willing to draft Smith at 9, then why not move down (Pick up a 3rd).. and draft Carimi or Castonzo.

I know Smith's upside is what everyone loves, but Carimi or Castonzo can step in right now.
 
I honestly don't believe Smith is worthy of a Top 10 pick, I think he plays with too much finesse and it's going to take some time for him to get used to NFL strength.

That being said, hard to validate a 3-4 DE with a Top 10 pick as well.

I do like Watkins though, although his age worries me a tiny bit.
 
TheCount;3882352 said:
I honestly don't believe Smith is worthy of a Top 10 pick, I think he plays with too much finesse and it's going to take some time for him to get used to NFL strength.

That being said, hard to validate a 3-4 DE with a Top 10 pick as well.

I do like Watkins though, although his age worries me a tiny bit.

I agree with both points: Dont want Smith at 9, and would not want to draft a 3-4 end at 9( Unless its Dareus or Fairley).

But i think the Boys are in a bad position this year. No available guys at positions of need(CB, S, OL, DL), that are worth the 9 pick.

Which leads to the point that a trade down, or possibly up could be the route most likely taken in the first this year. Or draft best player availble, regardless of need.
 
TheCount;3882352 said:
I honestly don't believe Smith is worthy of a Top 10 pick, I think he plays with too much finesse and it's going to take some time for him to get used to NFL strength.

That being said, hard to validate a 3-4 DE with a Top 10 pick as well.

I do like Watkins though, although his age worries me a tiny bit.

I'd rather have a guy 26 Y/O who can play, rather than a 25 Y/O like Brewster who cant.
 
RS12;3882363 said:
I'd rather have a guy 26 Y/O who can play, rather than a 25 Y/O like Brewster who cant.

I like the comment from Rob Rang at CBS Sportsline.. That says Watkins is the meanest, nastiest interior offensive lineman to come out this year...I like that alot.
 
Go O-Line unless Fairley is there which I doubt he will be
 
RS12;3882326 said:
As bad as this defense is (horrible), I really think they are going to draft Smith if he is there unless somebody unexpected drops. I think ultimately Smith ends up a shut down LT. Even if he doesnt there are plenty of edge rushers on the right side, and he can get out and block on the second level, opening up the offense for guys like Felix Jones. In 09 the offense played its best with Free at RT because he could get out and block in space.


Exactly. Well stated and short and to the point, too.

I think you fix the offense first and concentrate on the offensive line.

I don't think Doug Free is anything special at LT. He isn't as good as Adams was for sure, not even close. Let's hope the Cowboys don't over rate him.

Passing on a blue chip player like Tyron Smith due to a serviceable LT like Doug Free, who may give you 4 or 5 serviceable years at LT if you are lucky, would be crazy.

Tyron Smith is 20 years old, with big time upside, and Dallas has lost playoff games at RT, due to the fact that they couldn't block the other team's LDE. The Giants and Eagles have pass rushers all over the place (high draft picks), and Clay Matthews is Green Bay. Dallas can't continue to try and block these teams with scrubs playing RT. The Commanders will consider Smith at 10. He's too good of a player, they have to block the Cowboys, Giants, and Eagles on both sides.

Vela put out his trade down/trade back up game, and I hate it. I realize that you have to entertain and do your thinking, but drafting Smith is the safe, conservative, smart move. It isn't as sexy as all the moving around, but it's smart. Smith could be the cornerstone of your offensive line for the next 12 years. Plus, Eric Williams and Rayfield Wright were pretty dang good at RT.

IMO, it would also be crazy to trade down and watch the Commanders or Vikings or Lions draft Smith and you get stuck with J.J. Watt or Cameron Jordan. By all means, go ahead and draft J.J. Watt and see how that works out for you. I'm talking to the Cowboys...;) Jordan could help Dallas' defense for sure, but he will not save them or make Dallas' offensive line much better.

Plus, Tyron Smith is the better player and offensive line is the number 1 need, imso. An investment in Smith is like putting money in Tony Romo's and Felix Jones' and Dez Bryant's and Jason Witten's and Miles Austin's bank account. Smith is going to put them in a better position to succeed. The offense will determine this team's fate, not the defense. If that offense is humming (run and pass), the defense will benefit on multiple fronts.

Dallas isn't going to be able to fix both lines in one draft, so they better come out of the gate fast and start fixing the mess on that offensive line, because the value is going to be there at 9 (if Smith gets by Arizona). Smith is a cornerstone player, and J.J. Watt, Cameron Jordan, and Gabe Carimi are not cornerstone players.

Look at the Jets' offensive line and look at their playoff success. Smith compares favorably to D'Brickashaw Ferguson. Smith is the protype, new age NFL left tackle, and the Cowboys should take him and not think twice about it.

Dallas took 7 defensive players in the 2009 draft and blew that entire draft, including passing on 5 starting offensive linemen. So, if any scout or front office, defensive draft happy person wants J.J. Watt/Cameron Jordan or Carimi (in a trade back into round 1), I'd tell them that we are taking the best player, a player better than all three of them. Tyron Smith

Blue Chip players win Championships. Watt and Carimi are not blue chip players. Smith is a better player than Jordan and has way more upside and the film to back it up.

Tyron Smith>>>>>>>>>>>>>Watt/Jordan and Carimi or a lower tiered OT.

I would much rather have a blue chip player like 20 year old Tyron Smith, than Cameron Jordan/J.J. Watt or Gabe Carimi. I'd rather have Smith over the combination of Jordan/Watt and Carimi. Smith has the size, athletic ability, feet, balance, and physical build to be a dominant LT or RT.

Quality trumps quantity, and the last time the Cowboys passed on a very good value at OT, it was Phil Loadholt. They traded into the third and ended up with Jason Williams and Robert Brewster. They got cute and got burned, bad. Real bad...We all saw how that worked out in the playoffs. They way over rated Mark Colombo, and they better not over rate a serviceable LT like Free (who will play at 27) and get two inferior players, instead of securing one blue chip player. I'll take one blue chip player over two good to average players, every single time.

Again, Cameron Jordan and Gabe Carimi are as good as they are going to get. Smith's film against Jordan should end that horizontal debate, because Smith took care of Jordan in the run game, especially. Plus, Smith more than held his own with Jordan overall, when Smith needed to get bigger and stronger, which he is in the process of doing. Smith was a 19 year old junior, and Jordan was a more mature senior.

Back to the question.

I would take the first choice of Smith and Watkins, but Watkins probably isn't going to make it to 40. He's a good, cheap plug and play interior player, and you will get your money's worth on his rookie contract.

Some people may not think Smith is worthy of that 9th pick, but his pro day will most likely silence his critics. Bunting reported him up to 315. Smith is a freak athlete.

Not only does drafting Smith strengthen the Cowboys, it's hurts the Eagles and Giants, who are looking to draft an OT. By taking the best one, it pretty much insures that those teams will not get Smith, Solder, and perhaps Castanzo. Let one of them take Carimi, so he can get blown by on the edge by Ware or Spencer.

Tyron Smith can do for Dallas (on it's offensive line), what B.J. Raiji did for Green Bay's defensive line. The Packers sat at 9 and took Raiji.
 
trade back and get a OT in the 1st. No reason to stay at 9 and get Smith. He isn't worth a top 10 pick. Trade back and get an extra 2nd. If smith is there then pick him, if not then get Carimi. Then with the two 2nds draft Harris/Williams and a DE/OG in the 2nd and 3rd.

I like Taylor but I don't think All those 3-4 teams at the both of the 1st or early 2nd will let him get by. I haven't read anything that says Dallas has any interest in him. I have read about the team having interest in Ellis, Ian Williams, and Neild.
 
I say O-Line with a trade back. If we get into the mid-late teens, Garimi/Costanzo. Then, take a DE with the pick we get for trading back.
 
I say trade back to late teens...get an extra 2 and 4...maybe Gabbert or Newton falls to #9 and a team really wants one of them.

Take (1) Carimi-OT at say 19 then get (2) Taylor-NT and (2) Watkins-G with extra picks by moving back up.#
 
TheFinisher;3882658 said:
They need to take Prince at 9, he's got shutdown potential.

I kind of agree, Prince probably should be the pick at 9. At the very least he's a capable cover corner that doesn't shy away in run support. We could definitely use one of those.
 
I want the Cowboys to draft the guy most likely to be a 5-10 year starter. I don't think Smith is that guy. He's being overrated entirely based on measurables and "potential" and he'll likely end up like Mike Williams, Reggie Bush, Matt Leinhart, Kenchi Udeze, or any one of another dozen USC busts. You've got to find a guy at the top 10 that is absolutely dedicated to football, and you don't find those guys at USC, not currently anyway. I say get a guy who's as close to a sure thing as possible, not the next Darko Milicic or Derrius Heyward Bey.
 
41gy#;3882531 said:
Exactly. Well stated and short and to the point, too.

I think you fix the offense first and concentrate on the offensive line.

I don't think Doug Free is anything special at LT. He isn't as good as Adams was for sure, not even close. Let's hope the Cowboys don't over rate him.

Passing on a blue chip player like Tyron Smith due to a serviceable LT like Doug Free, who may give you 4 or 5 serviceable years at LT if you are lucky, would be crazy.

Tyron Smith is 20 years old, with big time upside, and Dallas has lost playoff games at RT, due to the fact that they couldn't block the other team's LDE. The Giants and Eagles have pass rushers all over the place (high draft picks), and Clay Matthews is Green Bay. Dallas can't continue to try and block these teams with scrubs playing RT. The Commanders will consider Smith at 10. He's too good of a player, they have to block the Cowboys, Giants, and Eagles on both sides.

Vela put out his trade down/trade back up game, and I hate it. I realize that you have to entertain and do your thinking, but drafting Smith is the safe, conservative, smart move. It isn't as sexy as all the moving around, but it's smart. Smith could be the cornerstone of your offensive line for the next 12 years. Plus, Eric Williams and Rayfield Wright were pretty dang good at RT.

IMO, it would also be crazy to trade down and watch the Commanders or Vikings or Lions draft Smith and you get stuck with J.J. Watt or Cameron Jordan. By all means, go ahead and draft J.J. Watt and see how that works out for you. I'm talking to the Cowboys...;) Jordan could help Dallas' defense for sure, but he will not save them or make Dallas' offensive line much better.

Plus, Tyron Smith is the better player and offensive line is the number 1 need, imso. An investment in Smith is like putting money in Tony Romo's and Felix Jones' and Dez Bryant's and Jason Witten's and Miles Austin's bank account. Smith is going to put them in a better position to succeed. The offense will determine this team's fate, not the defense. If that offense is humming (run and pass), the defense will benefit on multiple fronts.

Dallas isn't going to be able to fix both lines in one draft, so they better come out of the gate fast and start fixing the mess on that offensive line, because the value is going to be there at 9 (if Smith gets by Arizona). Smith is a cornerstone player, and J.J. Watt, Cameron Jordan, and Gabe Carimi are not cornerstone players.

Look at the Jets' offensive line and look at their playoff success. Smith compares favorably to D'Brickashaw Ferguson. Smith is the protype, new age NFL left tackle, and the Cowboys should take him and not think twice about it.

Dallas took 7 defensive players in the 2009 draft and blew that entire draft, including passing on 5 starting offensive linemen. So, if any scout or front office, defensive draft happy person wants J.J. Watt/Cameron Jordan or Carimi (in a trade back into round 1), I'd tell them that we are taking the best player, a player better than all three of them. Tyron Smith

Blue Chip players win Championships. Watt and Carimi are not blue chip players. Smith is a better player than Jordan and has way more upside and the film to back it up.

Tyron Smith>>>>>>>>>>>>>Watt/Jordan and Carimi or a lower tiered OT.

I would much rather have a blue chip player like 20 year old Tyron Smith, than Cameron Jordan/J.J. Watt or Gabe Carimi. I'd rather have Smith over the combination of Jordan/Watt and Carimi. Smith has the size, athletic ability, feet, balance, and physical build to be a dominant LT or RT.

Quality trumps quantity, and the last time the Cowboys passed on a very good value at OT, it was Phil Loadholt. They traded into the third and ended up with Jason Williams and Robert Brewster. They got cute and got burned, bad. Real bad...We all saw how that worked out in the playoffs. They way over rated Mark Colombo, and they better not over rate a serviceable LT like Free (who will play at 27) and get two inferior players, instead of securing one blue chip player. I'll take one blue chip player over two good to average players, every single time.

Again, Cameron Jordan and Gabe Carimi are as good as they are going to get. Smith's film against Jordan should end that horizontal debate, because Smith took care of Jordan in the run game, especially. Plus, Smith more than held his own with Jordan overall, when Smith needed to get bigger and stronger, which he is in the process of doing. Smith was a 19 year old junior, and Jordan was a more mature senior.

Back to the question.

I would take the first choice of Smith and Watkins, but Watkins probably isn't going to make it to 40. He's a good, cheap plug and play interior player, and you will get your money's worth on his rookie contract.

Some people may not think Smith is worthy of that 9th pick, but his pro day will most likely silence his critics. Bunting reported him up to 315. Smith is a freak athlete.

Not only does drafting Smith strengthen the Cowboys, it's hurts the Eagles and Giants, who are looking to draft an OT. By taking the best one, it pretty much insures that those teams will not get Smith, Solder, and perhaps Castanzo. Let one of them take Carimi, so he can get blown by on the edge by Ware or Spencer.

Tyron Smith can do for Dallas (on it's offensive line), what B.J. Raiji did for Green Bay's defensive line. The Packers sat at 9 and took Raiji.

I couldn’t agree more and what’s more you at least put a coherent argument for Smith as opposed to others who liken him to former USC players or claiming he’s not big/strong enough while ignoring the fact he weighed in at 307 at the combine and did 29 reps.

Half the problem is that many people on this board assume the defense can only be improved by a first round pick (and judging by our picks over the last 10 – 15 years, the Cowboys organization too).

They claim that the OL play improved under Garrett so we don’t need to draft an OL in the first but somehow Ryan can’t do the same for the DL?

Our biggest need on defense is at safety and since none at worthy of a first round pick, I think we should try to get at least one in free agency (if it happens at all) and concentrate on fixing the OL as far as possible in the draft.
 
IrishAnto;3883375 said:
I couldn’t agree more and what’s more you at least put a coherent argument for Smith as opposed to others who liken him to former USC players or claiming he’s not big/strong enough while ignoring the fact he weighed in at 307 at the combine and did 29 reps.

Half the problem is that many people on this board assume the defense can only be improved by a first round pick (and judging by our picks over the last 10 – 15 years, the Cowboys organization too).

They claim that the OL play improved under Garrett so we don’t need to draft an OL in the first but somehow Ryan can’t do the same for the DL?

Our biggest need on defense is at safety and since none at worthy of a first round pick, I think we should try to get at least one in free agency (if it happens at all) and concentrate on fixing the OL as far as possible in the draft.

I would go with T Smith at 9 (assuming Peterson and Darius are gone). Maybe even get him with a small trade down.

I think we will get at least 1 Safety in FA (whenever that begins), and we should be able to get one more decent one in Rounds 3 or 4.

I think we could land a solid CB or DL in Round 2.
 
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