2016-17 Dallas Defense will be improved and good enough

[Verdict]

I don't understand why people seem the pass rush HAS to come from the defensive ends. If you look at the really good defensive teams the interior pressure is above average getting pressure and sacks from the inside as well as outside. Often times the defensive ends on strong defensive teams end up getting a lot of sacks when the pocket collapses from the inside out.

 

[Verdict]

Haden was no star on the Dline, but to call him a non factor in the run game is incorrect.

Actually, Hayden sucked King Kong sized balls. He wasn't a factor at all in the pass rush, and he got blocked out of running plays far too often. We spent some money this year keeping the band together, even resigning the far too often bashed Jeff Heath to a 4 year deal. Yet we didn't resign Hayden. That should tell you more than you need to know about his lack of effectiveness.

 

[waldoputty]

I don't understand why people seem the pass rush HAS to come from the defensive ends. If you look at the really good defensive teams the interior pressure is above average getting pressure and sacks from the inside as well as outside. Often times the defensive ends on strong defensive teams end up getting a lot of sacks when the pocket collapses from the inside out.

I think FO agrees with you,
They targeted a decent 3Tech candidate and also signed Thornton, who is going to generate much more push than what we had.
But they are not Suh, though Suh costs $20 million a year.

FO was smart in improving DL by upgrading 1tech instead of RDE.
Thornton was really good value for his $4 million - 5X less than Suh.

Think of it this way, the added pass rush from Thornton over Hayden may be similar to an upgrade from Crawford to Suh!

Hopefully, the improvement in DT compensates (or more) for loss of Hardy and Gregory...

 

[wileedog]

I think FO agrees with you,
They targeted a decent 3Tech candidate and also signed Thornton, who is going to generate much more push than what we had.
But they are not Suh, though Suh costs $20 million a year.

FO was smart in improving DL by upgrading 1tech instead of RDE.
Thornton was really good value for his $4 million - 5X less than Suh.

Think of it this way, the added pass rush from Thornton over Hayden may be similar to an upgrade from Crawford to Suh!

Hopefully, the improvement in DT compensates (or more) for loss of Hardy and Gregory...

Except Thornton has 4 career sacks in 4 years and is known primarily for his run-stopping abilities.

But other than that, yeah sure he's completely and totally just a cheaper Suh.

 

[Scandri100]

Don't think it will even with the addition of scandrick...we need to replace wilcox.

 

[KingintheNorth]

I think you are basing this on hopes and wishes.


Which is okay because it's the exact same strategy this Front Office is currently using.

 

[waldoputty]

Except Thornton has 4 career sacks in 4 years and is known primarily for his run-stopping abilities.

But other than that, yeah sure he's completely and totally just a cheaper Suh.

his tapes seem to be 10x better than hayden, who poses no issue whatsoever to the D.
absolutely not saying he is a cheaper suh.
i am saying his improvement over hayden may be similiar to the difference between suh and crawford.

 

[wileedog]

his tapes seem to be 10x better than hayden, who poses no issue whatsoever to the D.
absolutely not saying he is a cheaper suh.
i am saying his improvement over hayden may be similiar to the difference between suh and crawford.

But neither he nor Hayden are very good at rushing the passer, so I have no idea where this idea comes from that because Thornton doesn't constantly get blown off the LOS every play we are going to magically have a better pass rush.

And Suh and Crawford don't even belong in the same sentence. The gap between them is miles larger than between Hayden and Thornton.

This is all twisted thinking to try and get around the fact that we don't have a bona fide proven pass rusher on this team. Sorry, no, replacing Hayden with Thornton doesn't really change that.

 

[Verdict]

But neither he nor Hayden are very good at rushing the passer, so I have no idea where this idea comes from that because Thornton doesn't constantly get blown off the LOS every play we are going to magically have a better pass rush.

And Suh and Crawford don't even belong in the same sentence. The gap between them is miles larger than between Hayden and Thornton.

This is all twisted thinking to try and get around the fact that we don't have a bona fide proven pass rusher on this team. Sorry, no, replacing Hayden with Thornton doesn't really change that.

Who is the Demarcus Ware of Seattle? There isn't one. They are a stout run stuffing team that gets uniform pressure every year. I think that is the direction that we are trying to go. It was a smart move since it is much cheaper, more effective and really it was the only viable way to approach it this off season without breaking the bank. That is solid on the Cowboys part.

 

[Seven]

The defense overall was ok last year. some of the games that turned into blowouts were due to them being gassed in the second half after the offense was pathetic the entire game.

We need to force more turnovers and pressure the QB. That's the #1 and 2 priority IMO. Hopefully Jones can be a difference maker at safety. Maybe Carr can luck into an interception or two. One would be fine. lol

Think Lawrence can turn into a good DE. Need to hope we see the 2014(healthy) T. Crawford and we can get some decent pass rush out of the rest of the ends.

/End thread.

A lot of losses were close, albeit losses.

AND the offense could NOT score points.

 

[wileedog]

Who is the Demarcus Ware of Seattle? There isn't one. They are a stout run stuffing team that gets uniform pressure every year. I think that is the direction that we are trying to go. It was a smart move since it is much cheaper, more effective and really it was the only viable way to approach it this off season without breaking the bank. That is solid on the Cowboys part.

And they can get away with that because they have a fantastic secondary that can buy them more time. They don't need a premiere edge rusher (although I would certainly take Bennett in a heartbeat).

Us? Not so much.

 

[JoeKing]

"Good enough" isn't good enough unless they win it all.

 

[LocimusPrime]

Who is the Demarcus Ware of Seattle? There isn't one. They are a stout run stuffing team that gets uniform pressure every year. I think that is the direction that we are trying to go. It was a smart move since it is much cheaper, more effective and really it was the only viable way to approach it this off season without breaking the bank. That is solid on the Cowboys part.

Fair points. Seattle was terrible at pass rush last year. They registered 37 sacks only 5 more than the cowboys and they tied for 17th in the league in sacks. No bueno

In regards to their DEs, Avril and Bennett are 8-11 sacks guys manning the LDE and RDE positions. They are looking to improve. They are a poormans version of denvers dynamic DEs.

 

[BAT]

For this D to be successful it needs a War Daddy or 2 on the DL, 3 tech and RDE preferably.

There are zero War Daddies on current roster only a lot if Daddy wannabes.

 

[Manster68]

So we're trusting our middle to Thornton and the rookie Collins, and we didn't invest our second round pick on a defensive player who is going to start, but one who may never play, and we're going to be better?

Oh, I forgot, we drafted Zeke, and he plays defense.

Well, seeing how the defensive coaches were all in on the Elliott pick, and the defensive coaches know more than message board GM's, I'll go out on a limb and trust the coaching staff.

I'll even trust the Dallas doctor that did the surgery on Jaylen Smith also.

 

[RJ_MacReady]

Close..very close. Lost are also Bruce carter, Henry Melton, Justin durant, sterling moore, and bw Webb.

 

[waldoputty]

But neither he nor Hayden are very good at rushing the passer, so I have no idea where this idea comes from that because Thornton doesn't constantly get blown off the LOS every play we are going to magically have a better pass rush.

And Suh and Crawford don't even belong in the same sentence. The gap between them is miles larger than between Hayden and Thornton.

This is all twisted thinking to try and get around the fact that we don't have a bona fide proven pass rusher on this team. Sorry, no, replacing Hayden with Thornton doesn't really change that.

Multiple articles talk about his penetration.
"DEs Fletcher Cox and Cedric Thornton didn’t get their usual penetration against the run but they weren't getting knocked back either."
Yes most are against the run, but that is probably when he plays more.
So we no longer have a total 0 in one DT position that makes 3tech's life a lot easier.

From highlights (acknowledge these are highlights), he looks 10X better than Hayden.
Here is Thornton sacking Romo.
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-...agles-Cedric-Thornton-sacks-Cowboys-Tony-Romo
Here is Thornton getting a safety against Chicago
http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/v...e-Safety/4c250141-6ca4-4e03-8fec-78d9ebd2b6cb

 

[tyke1doe]

Well, seeing how the defensive coaches were all in on the Elliott pick, and the defensive coaches know more than message board GM's, I'll go out on a limb and trust the coaching staff.

I'll even trust the Dallas doctor that did the surgery on Jaylen Smith also.

I was being sarcastic.

 

[LocimusPrime]

I would like us to build a line similar to the 2007 Giants
LDE - Strahan ( 9 sacks)
RDE - Osi Umenyiora ( 13 sacks)
Back up DE - Justin Tuck ( 10 sacks)

Berry Cofield and Fred Robbins - defensive tackles combined for 6.5 sacks
Kiwanika and Mitchell - lbs combined for 8 sacks.

Now that's how it's done. That will mess qbs up especially in the playoffs.

 

[reddyuta]

The Defense is subpar,we dont have difference makers here yet.The one thing i hope improves is getting more TOs,If our Offense can resemble 2014 then that would greatly help the Defense with TOs.