A Backup Depth need...

[tskyler]

Wade also has a big say on players we bring in. Do you think old Wade players Brooking and Olshansky being signed was a coincidence? Wade also speaks up when he really wants to draft a player, like Spencer, Brandon Williams, and Alan Ball. He campaigned for Felix, too.

I think this actually emphasizes my point about a Strong Coordinator system vs. a Strong Head coach better than some of my other examples. I agree Wade has input on players. Yes, Igor, Brooking, Spencer, Lee.. All Wade guys. However, most of the special teams guys now seem to have Decamillis' stamp on them. The offense looks JG with a sprinling of Jerry's need for 'wow'. Yes, Wade did like Felix but I see that was a Jerry + Offensive decision mainly. I just don't see Wade as a head coach who has much influence outside of his coordinators space. Even on the defense, it seems to me with folks like Jenkins, Scandrick, AOA, M. Hamlin, etc. these are Campo's guys...

Is Wade powerless? A Jerry puppet? Obviously no. But it looks like to me that he has less broad influence outside of his sphere of influence. All coordinators look more powerful than a traditional team. I think its just an interesting way to look at the Cowboy's vs. a monolithic head coach. Compare to Jimmy with Wannstadt and Turner. In that system both of the coordinators had influence but their needs were filtered by Jimmy and Jimmy and Jerry negotiated Coaching vs. GM needs. This system looks more like everyone of them has a seat at the personnel table without a Wade filter.

Skyler

 

[CowboyMike]

I think this actually emphasizes my point about a Strong Coordinator system vs. a Strong Head coach better than some of my other examples. I agree Wade has input on players. Yes, Igor, Brooking, Spencer, Lee.. All Wade guys. However, most of the special teams guys now seem to have Decamillis' stamp on them. The offense looks JG with a sprinling of Jerry's need for 'wow'. Yes, Wade did like Felix but I see that was a Jerry + Offensive decision mainly. I just don't see Wade as a head coach who has much influence outside of his coordinators space. Even on the defense, it seems to me with folks like Jenkins, Scandrick, AOA, M. Hamlin, etc. these are Campo's guys...

Is Wade powerless? A Jerry puppet? Obviously no. But it looks like to me that he has less broad influence outside of his sphere of influence. All coordinators look more powerful than a traditional team. I think its just an interesting way to look at the Cowboy's vs. a monolithic head coach. Compare to Jimmy with Wannstadt and Turner. In that system both of the coordinators had influence but their needs were filtered by Jimmy and Jimmy and Jerry negotiated Coaching vs. GM needs. This system looks more like everyone of them has a seat at the personnel table without a Wade filter.

Skyler

Well, I'd argue that Jenkins isn't really a Campo guy. Plus, Campo really didn't seem all that enthusiastic when he spoke about AOA. Wade, on the other hand, seemed rather excited about him.

Remember it was Wade that didn't want to play Tashard Choice until he was forced to, by the way. It wasn't JG holding him out of the offense. It was also Wade's decision to start Colombo in the playoffs over Free. It was Wade deciding to start Austin permanently after his breakout game against KC over Crayton.

Like I said in a previous post, Jerry has been adamant about the fact that Wade has the same power that Jimmy and Bill had. He said it was pretty much the same contract with all of them. I'm inclined to think it is actually true and that it is a matter of perception and just how Wade likes to run his team. Where Parcells had a suffocating hold on his assistant coaches, Wade seems to trust his staff more and delegate much better.

 

[hra8700]

I think this actually emphasizes my point about a Strong Coordinator system vs. a Strong Head coach better than some of my other examples. I agree Wade has input on players. Yes, Igor, Brooking, Spencer, Lee.. All Wade guys. However, most of the special teams guys now seem to have Decamillis' stamp on them. The offense looks JG with a sprinling of Jerry's need for 'wow'. Yes, Wade did like Felix but I see that was a Jerry + Offensive decision mainly. I just don't see Wade as a head coach who has much influence outside of his coordinators space. Even on the defense, it seems to me with folks like Jenkins, Scandrick, AOA, M. Hamlin, etc. these are Campo's guys...

Is Wade powerless? A Jerry puppet? Obviously no. But it looks like to me that he has less broad influence outside of his sphere of influence. All coordinators look more powerful than a traditional team. I think its just an interesting way to look at the Cowboy's vs. a monolithic head coach. Compare to Jimmy with Wannstadt and Turner. In that system both of the coordinators had influence but their needs were filtered by Jimmy and Jimmy and Jerry negotiated Coaching vs. GM needs. This system looks more like everyone of them has a seat at the personnel table without a Wade filter.

Skyler

If they all get along, sounds like the ideal system, to me. I hate loud mouthed egotists.

 

[tskyler]

Well, I'd argue that Jenkins isn't really a Campo guy. Plus, Campo really didn't seem all that enthusiastic when he spoke about AOA. Wade, on the other hand, seemed rather excited about him.

Remember it was Wade that didn't want to play Tashard Choice until he was forced to, by the way. It wasn't JG holding him out of the offense. It was also Wade's decision to start Colombo in the playoffs over Free. It was Wade deciding to start Austin permanently after his breakout game against KC over Crayton.

On, Tashard... Hadn't heard that.
On Columbo... Hadn't heard that either.
AOA, Jenkins and Campo. I seem to remember some Campo enthusiasm on both but maybe I'm wrong.

All these certainly bolster your point and make mine less valid

Like I said in a previous post, Jerry has been adamant about the fact that Wade has the same power that Jimmy and Bill had. He said it was pretty much the same contract with all of them. I'm inclined to think it is actually true and that it is a matter of perception and just how Wade likes to run his team. Where Parcells had a suffocating hold on his assistant coaches, Wade seems to trust his staff more and delegate much better.

Meant to comment on that before. I just saw that comment from Jerry as the only thing he could say about it. Didn't put any stock in it. I think we both agree that the parcell's hold on assistants was unusual. I just see Wade as the opposite extreme. I guess the question is.. is Wade granting the autonomy to the coordinators and assistants or is Jerry doing it? Your points above make a persuasive case that it is Wade. Still, my gut tells me it's Jerry's system that does it and Wade just fits it well.

Skyler

 

[BAT]

Herring as a Wade successor does not really excite me. Decamilis on the other hand would be interesting, but his specialty is ST not D.

One guy I really want to see signed is Dennis Thurman. I would love to see the synthesis of Rex Ryan's 3-4, Wade's 3-4 (2 systems which actually have a lot of similarity) and Landry's Flex. Plus Thurman teaches opportunistic play in the secondary_something that has been sorely lacking since Jimmy's time in Dallas.

 

[Alexander]

QuarterbackCoach gave Decamillus an earful.

And rightfully so! A JanSport backpack! Embarassing! Did he use a bullhorn to give him the business? Tell me he used a bullhorn!

 

[Alexander]

Herring as a Wade successor does not really excite me. Decamilis on the other hand would be interesting, but his specialty is ST not D.

I am not overly impressed with Herring either. But he's fiery.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

So, tskyler, in other words you're ignoring much of the evidence because you've already decided that Wade is less powerful than other head coaches. I mean, why would you say all those DBs are "Campo guys" other than the fact that Campo is the DB coach and naturally would be asked to comment on them?

Every HC is one of two things: Your "monolith" like Jimmy or a Marty Schottenheimer who oversees the coordinator, or an outstanding coordinator who worked his way up and calls plays on his side of the ball. Why would Wade have less power than other HCs in his position like an Andy Reid or other OC/HC who calls plays on offense but has relatively little say in the defense?

And to Jon88... I remember QC's rant very well. But that was in 2008 when Lloyd Christmas was still our special teams coach. And still don't get the part about the Jansport backpack, but oh well.

 

[tskyler]

So, tskyler, in other words you're ignoring much of the evidence because you've already decided that Wade is less powerful than other head coaches. I mean, why would you say all those DBs are "Campo guys" other than the fact that Campo is the DB coach and naturally would be asked to comment on them?

Ummm..I think quite the opposite. My point was I had never heard the evidence presented. And said it definitely strengthend the case against me. I don't think I am ignoring anything. Think I am being intellectually honest.

 

[BAT]

I am not overly impressed with Herring either. But he's fiery.

j

:laugh2: