Are Airlines intentionally Defrauding Customers?

[RJ_MacReady]

Sorry I have a hard time following senseless babbling. That may be one of the worst posts I’ve seen or tried to follow. My BIL is not with Southwest. They also rolled out mandates and got great response from employees and the unions. Just saying I probably hear more legit airline news than you try and pretend to know. Not sure why you are so intense about it. Bizarre really. There really are pilot shortages and many of the airlines are trying various methods to recruit snd train. I just have a pretty normal response.

That's rich! Bud, I'm sitting here talking about what happened with Southwest airlines, posted a few articles and you're over there acting like a brat telling me "you don't know jack" and dismissing what I posted because "well, they're southwest..they suck".

It's an online discussion board. Act accordingly.

 

[Miller]

That's rich! Bud, I'm sitting here talking about what happened with Southwest airlines, posted a few articles and you're over there acting like a brat telling me "you don't know jack" and dismissing what I posted because "well, they're southwest..they suck".

It's an online discussion board. Act accordingly.

My response was about airlines in general which was the main thread and your response to airlines shortages. SW may have failed that way but not across the board industry wide.. Btw how am I a brat literally telling the truth about a segment of the industry? Done with it if ! Your opinion is great but your attitude needs help off a simple opinion

 

[RJ_MacReady]

My response was about airlines in general which was the main thread and your response to airlines shortages. SW may have failed that way but not across the board industry wide.. Btw how am I a brat literally telling the truth about a segment of the industry? Done with it if ! Your opinion is great but your attitude needs help off a simple opinion

Duly noted.

Allow me to try this a different way:

My contention is that the massive flight cancellations in the fall of 2021 by Southwest Airlines was caused by the vaccine mandate rollout and not "weather/air traffic issues" that they claimed.

Do you agree or disagree?

 

[Miller]

Duly noted.

Allow me to try this a different way:

My contention is that the massive flight cancellations in the fall of 2021 by Southwest Airlines was caused by the vaccine mandate rollout and not "weather/air traffic issues" that they claimed.

Do you agree or disagree?

I respectfully disagree. Part of those issues in October 2021 were Air Traffic control related and no one had walked out, according to the FAA. Also if my first premise was true then other airlines would have been in the same position with air traffic control issues. If your contention was it was due to pilots and other SW employees pushing back it makes some sense but I also can see their theories regarding it cascading over the weekend once cancellations started to happen. You may be right but I think this article hits it on the head. I’m assuming we will agree to disagree but that’s what the boards about. Btw how do you change your message where yours says “it’s all in the reflexes?” Just wondering

https://www.cnet.com/google-amp/new...-due-to-vaccine-mandate-what-you-should-know/

"On Friday evening, the airline ended the day with numerous cancellations, primarily created by weather and other external constraints, which left aircraft and crews out of pre-planned positions to operate our schedule on Saturday," Southwest Airlines said in a statement. "Unfortunately, the out-of-place aircraft and continued strain on our crew resources created additional cancellations across our point-to-point network that cascaded throughout the weekend and into Monday."

The FAA confirmed that weather and staff shortage issues as well as military training Friday near the Jacksonville Air Route Traffic Control Center in Hilliard, Florida, contributed to the cancellations.

This created a cascading effect for Southwest that continued into Monday, with more than 300 flights canceled, according to FlightAware.

In regard to the rumor of an air traffic controller walkout, flights in and out of the Jacksonville International Airport -- where many Southwest flights were canceled -- are handled by the Jacksonville Air Route Traffic Control Center. The FAA, which employees most air traffic controllers, said in a statement Monday there have been no staff shortages since Friday.


n a letter to the Jacksonville Aviation Authority board of directors received by WFOX on Sunday, Jacksonville Aviation Authority COO Tony Cugno said the air traffic controller staff issue at the Jacksonville Air Route Traffic Control Center was a combination of different factors. The first was approved leave for employees, and the second was a required 48-hour period when employees at the center have to stay home to self-monitor for any side effects after receiving a vaccine shot.

Another issue with the rumor: There would have been far more cancellations by other airlines if there was a walkout by air traffic controllers. According to FlightAware, Southwest canceled 1,124 flights on Sunday, while the US airline with the second-most cancellations was American Airlines with 167.

 

[RJ_MacReady]

I respectfully disagree. Part of those issues in October 2021 were Air Traffic control related and no one had walked out, according to the FAA. Also if my first premise was true then other airlines would have been in the same position with air traffic control issues. If your contention was it was due to pilots and other SW employees pushing back it makes some sense but I also can see their theories regarding it cascading over the weekend once cancellations started to happen. You may be right but I think this article hits it on the head. I’m assuming we will agree to disagree but that’s what the boards about. Btw how do you change your message where yours says “it’s all in the reflexes?” Just wondering

https://www.cnet.com/google-amp/new...-due-to-vaccine-mandate-what-you-should-know/

"On Friday evening, the airline ended the day with numerous cancellations, primarily created by weather and other external constraints, which left aircraft and crews out of pre-planned positions to operate our schedule on Saturday," Southwest Airlines said in a statement. "Unfortunately, the out-of-place aircraft and continued strain on our crew resources created additional cancellations across our point-to-point network that cascaded throughout the weekend and into Monday."

The FAA confirmed that weather and staff shortage issues as well as military training Friday near the Jacksonville Air Route Traffic Control Center in Hilliard, Florida, contributed to the cancellations.

This created a cascading effect for Southwest that continued into Monday, with more than 300 flights canceled, according to FlightAware.

In regard to the rumor of an air traffic controller walkout, flights in and out of the Jacksonville International Airport -- where many Southwest flights were canceled -- are handled by the Jacksonville Air Route Traffic Control Center. The FAA, which employees most air traffic controllers, said in a statement Monday there have been no staff shortages since Friday.


n a letter to the Jacksonville Aviation Authority board of directors received by WFOX on Sunday, Jacksonville Aviation Authority COO Tony Cugno said the air traffic controller staff issue at the Jacksonville Air Route Traffic Control Center was a combination of different factors. The first was approved leave for employees, and the second was a required 48-hour period when employees at the center have to stay home to self-monitor for any side effects after receiving a vaccine shot.

Another issue with the rumor: There would have been far more cancellations by other airlines if there was a walkout by air traffic controllers. According to FlightAware, Southwest canceled 1,124 flights on Sunday, while the US airline with the second-most cancellations was American Airlines with 167.

Thank you for the response. You brought up good points. I also don't believe the ATC were the cause. Weather? I just don't know. Now, you brought up a good point in that once flights start cancelling, it's a cascading effect. These aircraft are ran around the clock, swapping out crews at specific stops. If a flight is delayed getting into it's swap-out point, the new crew (if already alerted) has to go back into crew rest due to FAA requirements.

Anyway, to change your title, you click on your screenname at the very top right next to "inbox". Click personal details and then custom title.

 

[Miller]

Thank you for the response. You brought up good points. I also don't believe the ATC were the cause. Weather? I just don't know. Now, you brought up a good point in that once flights start cancelling, it's a cascading effect. These aircraft are ran around the clock, swapping out crews at specific stops. If a flight is delayed getting into it's swap-out point, the new crew (if already alerted) has to go back into crew rest due to FAA requirements.

Anyway, to change your title, you click on your screenname at the very top right next to "inbox". Click personal details and then custom title.

Thanks. Yes I feel like once one set of flights goes South then you have pilot breaks etc. But who knows. I’ve really tried to understand a lot more since joining this family but still don’t get a lot. My wife is now at Sabre..airline reservation system company…and they muck up a lot too.

Thanks for that. Weirdly I don’t have that option. Oh well. Have a great one man! Sorry if I came across harsh at first. I didn’t follow the convo specifics as I should have.

 

[CyberB0b]

The bigger scam is who is funding and fueling the planes that spray the skys, and they always run on time.

The last 3 days here, have been clear blue skys. I do not remember the last time I have seen 2 clear days in a row, or a couple days with normal looking clouds.

What?

 

[CyberB0b]

Thank you for the response. You brought up good points. I also don't believe the ATC were the cause. Weather? I just don't know. Now, you brought up a good point in that once flights start cancelling, it's a cascading effect. These aircraft are ran around the clock, swapping out crews at specific stops. If a flight is delayed getting into it's swap-out point, the new crew (if already alerted) has to go back into crew rest due to FAA requirements.

Anyway, to change your title, you click on your screenname at the very top right next to "inbox". Click personal details and then custom title.

I’m an airline pilot. It’s a confluence of all these factors. Management bit off more than they can chew with capacity, they’re working on shoring up contracts with various unions, and ATC has had staffing issues. South Florida has been hit really hard by weather and ATC issues. A few airlines, like mine, cancelled a lot of their schedule months ago to try to mitigate this.

 

[triplets_93]

For four days in a row in early July, Toronto Pearson International Airport - the busiest in Canada, with flights to 155 cities around the world - experienced the most delays of any airport globally.

Many airport employees, whether baggage handlers or custodians, left their jobs during the pandemic and have not returned.

"Airports are having a hard time getting people to come back to work," she said.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-62216557

 

[Longboysfan]

From my past 4 rides on American Airlines - yes.

 

[triplets_93]

Buttigieg promises action on airline delays

DOT secretary has proposed a series of rules intended to better protect airline consumers.

Just Google it...

 

[dsturgeon]

AOC's plan a few years ago talked about getting rid of air travel. Considering all the climate stuff being pushed it is interesting.