Dispelling draft "wisdom" Best player available

[cnuball21]

Yes, I think that is a fair point, and that's why I made this post to start with. What position do you think takes the longest to develop into a reliable starter, say 80% developed into of the players prime year in the league?

DT quickly comes to mind. Those guys rarely produce in year 1 or 2 unless they are a top 5 ish pick.

Heck it took Derrick Brown until year 3 to hit his potential and he was top 15 I think.

 

[Aerolithe_Lion]

Yes, I think that is a fair point, and that's why I made this post to start with. What position do you think takes the longest to develop into a reliable starter, say 80% developed into of the players prime year in the league?

CB IMO. The amount of rookies at every position in the pro bowl is reasonably high. Just in 2012 alone we had 3 or 4 rookie pro bowl QBs.

But in the last 20 years there’s been less than 10 rookie pro bowl CBs, despite every team starting 2-3. Sauce Gardner was the anomaly of anomalies. Usually it takes a few years before they start to bloom

 

[nathanlt]

CB IMO. The amount of rookies at every position in the pro bowl is reasonably high. Just in 2012 alone we had 3 or 4 rookie pro bowl QBs.

But in the last 20 years there’s been less than 10 rookie pro bowl CBs, despite every team starting 2-3. Sauce Gardner was the anomaly of anomalies. Usually it takes a few year before they start to bloom

I was suprised at the level of Diggs and Bland in year one. They're going to get better, and they've shown incredible progress. Pay Al Harris whatever he wants, I say.

 

[Malhavoc]

DT quickly comes to mind. Those guys rarely produce in year 1 or 2 unless they are a top 5 ish pick.

Heck it took Derrick Brown until year 3 to hit his potential and he was top 15 I think.

Meanwhile most here want to burn Mazi at the stake. Factor in you asked a naturally big kid to lose weight and drop down to around 300lbs. Mazi may turn out to be a bust, but what they are asking and expecting of that kid is insane.

 

[cnuball21]

Meanwhile most here want to burn Mazi at the stake. Factor in you asked a naturally big kid to lose weight and drop down to around 300lbs. Mazi may turn out to be a bust, but what they are asking and expecting of that kid is insane.

Yea, didn’t impress me as a rookie but you have to give him a chance.

 

[Malhavoc]

Yea, didn’t impress me as a rookie but you have to give him a chance.

If they are intent on making him a 300 lb 3T, he’s gonna have a rough time.

 

[cnuball21]

If they are intent on making him a 300 lb 3T, he’s gonna have a rough time.

I don’t know where and how that rumor started flying around…is there proof the team actually asked him to cut weight or did he just have trouble keeping it on in his first full season as part of a rookie wall?

 

[tyke1doe]

I wrote that 6 hours ago Tyke, how would I be able to remember something like that

No judgment.

 

[Chasing6]

1. Overshown will be returning from a ACL injury

2. lVE may retire

3. We only have Clark as a true LB if LVE leaves.

LB especially ones that fit the mold of current DC is a need.

1. Diggs is returning from an ACL
2. If we lose both Gilly and Lewis we are razor thin at CB.

CB is a need. They visited with some of the top CBs at combine I expect they are targeting one early

On TE if Bowers is there you have to think very long and hard on passing up on him. And who knows he may slip

Well hopefully we get involved in free agency before the draft starts. That should help clear up some of these questions.

I am not sure I trust our evaluations outside of OLine.

 

[plasticman]

The Cowboys under Schram almost always drafted the BPA and they had 20 consecutive winning seasons despite constantly drafting at the bottom 25% as a result of those winning seasons.

in fact, the Cowboys went to five Super Bowls during those 20 seasons which means that 25% of the time they had the last or second to last pick in the draft.

I did say they "almost always" drafted the BPA. Thee was this one significant time that they didn't.

During the 1979 draft, the Cowboys turn came up in the 3rd round and their board had a QB as the BPA. Well, the Cowboys had Staubach, Danny White and Glen Carrano. They felt set at QB. However, they were short on TE's and their 2nd best player was a TE.

Therefore they decided not to take the BPA. They took TE Doug Cosby, who had a pretty nice career.

A few picks later the 49ers selected the QB that had been the BPA when the Cowbosy were up, a guy by the name of Joe Montana.

A year later, Roger Staubach unexpectedly retired, citing his numerous concussions.

There were times when it seemed like a little overkill. During the four year span of 1969 to 1972, they drafted three RB's in the 1st round. In fact, during one of those drafts they selected a RB in the 1st and 2nd round.

It turns out that three of those four RB's played an importan trole in a Super Bowl championship season. Calvin Hill, Duane Thomas and Robert Newhouse all have Super Bowl rings.

Drafting for need?

Jerry would have stepped right over Micah Parsons to take Patrick Surtain Jr. had he been available.....just before the season in which Diggs made All Pro with 11 INT's. Micah graded out better than both CB's the Cowboys were considering. However, the "need" was for a quality CB which turned out to not be a need.

 

[beware_d-ware]

During the 1979 draft, the Cowboys turn came up in the 3rd round and their board had a QB as the BPA. Well, the Cowboys had Staubach, Danny White and Glen Carrano. They felt set at QB. However, they were short on TE's and their 2nd best player was a TE.

Therefore they decided not to take the BPA. They took TE Doug Cosby, who had a pretty nice career.

A few picks later the 49ers selected the QB that had been the BPA when the Cowbosy were up, a guy by the name of Joe Montana.

A year later, Roger Staubach unexpectedly retired, citing his numerous concussions.

There were times when it seemed like a little overkill. During the four year span of 1969 to 1972, they drafted three RB's in the 1st round. In fact, during one of those drafts they selected a RB in the 1st and 2nd round.

It turns out that three of those four RB's played an importan trole in a Super Bowl championship season. Calvin Hill, Duane Thomas and Robert Newhouse all have Super Bowl rings.

Drafting for need?

Jerry would have stepped right over Micah Parsons to take Patrick Surtain Jr. had he been available.....just before the season in which Diggs made All Pro with 11 INT's. Micah graded out better than both CB's the Cowboys were considering. However, the "need" was for a quality CB which turned out to not be a need.

That's why I don't like drafting for need. Once that rookie is up to speed in 2 or 3 years, your needs could look entirely different. You're shooting at a moving target.

If you really need a guy this year, sign a free agent. That shouldn't be the draft's job.

 

[cnuball21]

That's why I don't like drafting for need. Once that rookie is up to speed in 2 or 3 years, your needs could look entirely different. You're shooting at a moving target.

If you really need a guy this year, sign a free agent. That shouldn't be the draft's job.

Yea…for some reason the draft for needs crowd often forgets that these kids don’t make much of a year 1 impact usually. I know we’ve been spoiled by guys like Lamb, Parsons and Bland but that isn’t the norm.

 

[plasticman]

That's why I don't like drafting for need. Once that rookie is up to speed in 2 or 3 years, your needs could look entirely different. You're shooting at a moving target.

If you really need a guy this year, sign a free agent. That shouldn't be the draft's job.

Yea…for some reason the draft for needs crowd often forgets that these kids don’t make much of a year 1 impact usually. I know we’ve been spoiled by guys like Lamb, Parsons and Bland but that isn’t the norm.

That's right, so called "needs" can be very fluid. It could very well be that the position they are looking for can be filled by someone who is already on the team, he just hasn't been revealed yet.

We have three excellent examples just last season. Bland had his breakout season when we thought our pass defense was compromised. They reached for Schoonmaker in the 2nd round and Ferguson was at least the immediate answer and should only get better. And wasn't a reliable kicker one of the most pressing issues? All we had was this rookie who didn't look very good at first.

The worse that could happen with BPA is that the Cowboys possesses an elite squad with multiple capable starters. They will probably need both considering the length of the season. This practically makes the position injury-proof.