DMN: Blog: What would it cost to let Roy Williams go?

[sacase]

No matter how much some of you dislike roy he is still one of the top two safeties on the team

How quick you forget watkins getting beat multiple times on deep balls and then crying about it.

 

[Hoofbite]

Well when he played FS for the Browns he had 10INTs. Id take 10INTs any day.

Everyone keeps talking about Henry playing FS for the Browns but nobody has produced much of a backing to it. I looked at the gamebooks from NFL.com over his tenure in Cleveland and couldn't find a game that he started at FS. Granted, I didn't look at every game but I checked just about every 4 weeks and didn't see a single game where he started at FS.

 

[DallasDW00ds0n]

I have seen this mentioned several times, he was #3 CB for the browns his rookie year not FS

he actually played FS as well

 

[DallasDW00ds0n]

Everyone keeps talking about Henry playing FS for the Browns but nobody has produced much of a backing to it. I looked at the gamebooks from NFL.com over his tenure in Cleveland and couldn't find a game that he started at FS. Granted, I didn't look at every game but I checked just about every 4 weeks and didn't see a single game where he started at FS.

I mean you guys are right, its like impossible to find that old info I mean the best link I could come up with is
http://www.jt-sw.com/football/pro/rosters.nsf/Annual/2003-cle

 

[Hoofbite]

No matter how much some of you dislike roy he is still one of the top two safeties on the team

How quick you forget watkins getting beat multiple times on deep balls and then crying about it.

I just think people look for the bad in some players and then use a different standard for others. I saw a good number of posters suggest that Keith Davis' start in Carolina was a good performance. Many of them cited his play at the end of the game to knock away that pass in the endzone as an example of something a SS should be able to do and that Roy wouldn't have been able to. While it was a good play, none of them mentioned that the reason the Panthers were in that position was a good part because KD missed a tackled on Steve Smith that allowed Smith to run all the way down the field just a few plays prior. And that wasn't the only tackle that Keith missed. If I remember, he missed close to 3 or 4 pretty routine tackles. Had that been Roy, people would have put a hit out on him.

 

[RealCowboyfan]

Like it or not RW will be the starting SS this year. So people just needs to get use to it.

Really... I just hope people just get it. Roy will be back to normal with Dave Campo running the defensive back show. I believe since Campo has been gone, Roy has been a bit out of tune. Only thing I find wrong with Roy Williams is lately, meaning the last two or so seasons he's been taking bad positions on the ball, but he has been in the area of where the ball is thrown. I believe once he catches on to that and start making harder hits like he use to everybody even the columnist will cut out the "Getting Rid Of Roy Williams" articles and statements.

 

[Hoofbite]

I mean you guys are right, its like impossible to find that old info I mean the best link I could come up with is
http://www.jt-sw.com/football/pro/rosters.nsf/Annual/2003-cle

That website looks about as informative as a Bryant Gumbel play-by-play transcript.

No stats, no games played/started, no nothing. Just a positional listing from some random site. Good thing I went out and found out for myself that Henry has started only 1 game at FS.

I went and looked at every game he started while in Cleveland and only 1 game did he start at FS and that wasn't even the year he had 10 INTs. He only had 2 that year, coincidentally, they both came in that game.

You can check if you want. Personally, I would recommend just looking at Earl Little's games started. He was the FS for Cleveland during Henry's time there so just looking at his games started from 2001-2004 should give you a pretty good clue that Henry didn't have much of a chance of playing FS in Cleveland.

Is it safe to say that Henry didn't play FS in Cleveland? I guess we could get all technical but in the grand scheme of moving Henry to FS "because he has played there before", can you really say that he has the experience to take over that position? Not to mention he seems a little injury prone to take on a position that requires more contact.

 

[silverbear]

Sorry but strong safeties are needed less and less in a pass happy NFL. They are becoming a liability in 3,4, and 5 receiver sets. 5 years from now the position might be as rare as H-Backs.

And yet, every team still has a couple-three strong safeties... what, are you suggesting that the Cowboys line up Pat Watkins and Courtney Brown at safety, if Roy was traded or cut, and Hamlin got hurt??

I shudder to think what opposing offenses would do to THAT lineup...

 

[UVAwahoos]

No sense in doing anything unless we can UPGRADE the position. As bad as Roy has been playing, none of these guys seem to be an upgrade for the immediate future and so I don't think it's worth risking till we have a viable person who can take his spot.

 

[superpunk]

Is it safe to say that Henry didn't play FS in Cleveland? I guess we could get all technical but in the grand scheme of moving Henry to FS "because he has played there before", can you really say that he has the experience to take over that position? Not to mention he seems a little injury prone to take on a position that requires more contact.

This notion should have died long ago based on all of thoe things.

Henry doesn't have extensive experience at FS.

It is unlikely that Henry could handle the contact he would get at FS.

As a strictly coverage guy, yes Henry would fit in nicely at FS. He's got good ball skills and good anticipation. But he doesn't have the range, or the body to make plays down low and come up in run support, or take on big TEs consistently over the middle.

Die already.

 

[pgreptom]

Everyone keeps talking about Henry playing FS for the Browns but nobody has produced much of a backing to it. I looked at the gamebooks from NFL.com over his tenure in Cleveland and couldn't find a game that he started at FS. Granted, I didn't look at every game but I checked just about every 4 weeks and didn't see a single game where he started at FS.

His rookie year he played BOTH Nickel CB AND FS. Depending on the situation.

Go to the Watercooler if you would like. I did it myself the first year he was on the team. He didn't get all 10 of his INT's at Safety.. but I think they broke it down to 6cb/4fs.

I say if you can bring in S after June 1st who is somewhat decent - you let him go. I don't think he wants to be here, regardless. Hamlin can play SS, and I think (AS LONG AS PAC MAN MAKES IT TO CAMP), Henry could play FS.. with Watkins a little. Hamlin would be a better SS than a FS, especially as he gets older.

It depends on a few things IMO. 1) Does Roy want to go somewhere else? 2) Does PacMan get reinstated? 3) What can you get for Roy?

 

[khiladi]

I just think people look for the bad in some players and then use a different standard for others. I saw a good number of posters suggest that Keith Davis' start in Carolina was a good performance. Many of them cited his play at the end of the game to knock away that pass in the endzone as an example of something a SS should be able to do and that Roy wouldn't have been able to. While it was a good play, none of them mentioned that the reason the Panthers were in that position was a good part because KD missed a tackled on Steve Smith that allowed Smith to run all the way down the field just a few plays prior. And that wasn't the only tackle that Keith missed. If I remember, he missed close to 3 or 4 pretty routine tackles. Had that been Roy, people would have put a hit out on him.

Roy gets paid the big bucks. Davis didn't.

 

[khiladi]

No matter how much some of you dislike roy he is still one of the top two safeties on the team

How quick you forget watkins getting beat multiple times on deep balls and then crying about it.

His rookie year and seriously... those plays he got beat, the Philadelphia offense knew exactly what was coming... Plus, our pass rush was non-existent that year...

Did you see him get beat when he played his first year with Wade?

 

[sonnyboy]

According to NFLPA figures, Williams is scheduled to count $6.667 million against the cap in 2008. If the Cowboys chose to cut him, they would have to take on $7.387 million of proration from his $11.1 million signing bonus, so the move would cost them $720,000 against the cap.

I've extracted some interesting info from these bolded numbers and have a few questions for the board.

1) This was a 6 year deal and the first year was 2006.
2) Annual prorated signing bonus is $1.85 mil.
3) Since his 2008 cap number is $6.667 mil than his 2008 salary is
$4.187 mil.

Does anyone remember Roy signing this deal?

I follow the team very closely and can tell you the month and year each player under contract signed. But I cant remember this signing. Was it during or after the 2005 season?

I've supported Roy in the past and this is not revisionist history. But can someone tell me how the hell Roy commanded a 6 yr 40 mil deal after his 2005 season? Especially with an $11.1 mil signing bonus.

I'd like to know what his salaries were for each year of this deal.

What really bothers me about this whole Roy deal is that he wanted to come here. He was a life long Cowboy fan. Unlike most of these highly touted draft picks, with a lot of money at stake, Roy professed his strong desired to play for the Cowboys.

For me this made him the obvious best pick for us. This is a guy who was more likely to play above his contract, to play in pain and play his hardest.
Most impotantly he'd work his hardest to mainatin and improve his play.

Nothing could have been further from the reality. His level of play and dedication to this team is something I'd expect from a lifelong Commanders fan.

 

[Nightman]

IF we are going to cut or trade him we should do it after June 1st. That would give us $3.7M in cap space this year. If we need it for an emergency its there, if not, then use one of those LTBE incentives and get it back for 2009.

 

[Hoofbite]

Roy gets paid the big bucks. Davis didn't.

So if Roy wasn't making a good amount of money nobody would be calling for his job?

 

[DWhite Fan]

Roy needs to go, what a COMPLETE waste of signing bonus... Him going to the Pro Bowl the past couple of years was an absolute joke!

The Pro Bowl itself is an absolute joke

 

[TEK2000]

His rookie year and seriously... those plays he got beat, the Philadelphia offense knew exactly what was coming... Plus, our pass rush was non-existent that year...

Did you see him get beat when he played his first year with Wade?

Uhhh yes!

 

[bbgun]

Utterly pointless. We can't afford to cut him, and there's no one better than him on the bench. This shotgun marriage won't end 'til next February.

 

[DeaconBlues]

This is useless. JJ did not bring Campo back just to cut RW. Williams will start for Dallas this year, baring any horsecollar suspensions.

Get use to it.