News: ESPN: Archer Chat leftovers - 03/26/14

[TheDude]

I think Parcells was very fortunate in a lot of ways. He had a top 5 pick when he started, then he lucked out and had Witten fall to him in the 3rd. If he had his way, we would not have had Ware either. He had a good draft in 2005, but he missed on a lot too. His drafts surrounding that 2005 draft were pretty terrible.

He started w quincy carter. Garrett started w Romo. Making the playoffs in playoffs that first year was perhaps the coaching job of the millennium.

They scrambled for a QB in yr 2 due to QC drug issue that summer. That was the only year without a winning record

 

[Alexander]

then he lucked out and had Witten fall to him in the 3rd.

Golly, I sure would take that kind of luck over the outright skill Jerry Jones has shown without him taking Gavin Escobar a full round earlier.

 

[big dog cowboy]

Golly, I sure would take that kind of luck over the outright skill Jerry Jones has shown without him taking Gavin Escobar a full round earlier.

Please stop.

 

[Kevinicus]

He started w quincy carter. Garrett started w Romo. Making the playoffs in playoffs that first year was perhaps the coaching job of the millennium.

They scrambled for a QB in yr 2 due to QC drug issue that summer. That was the only year without a winning record

There certainly is no comparison between Parcells and Garrett as coaches. Garrett is worse than Campo IMO.

 

[casmith07]

These mailbags always elicit the same response from me.

 

[Hoofbite]

You're right. The team he left in 2007 was exactly like the team he took over after 2002.

It's almost hard to believe that people can buy into it even just a little bit.

 

[Nav22]

I'm talking about any talent acquisition post-Parcells. I'm talking about the team Parcells left vs. the team he took over.

If you don't see much difference in that maybe football is not the sport for you.

Let's see if the facts back up your implication that Parcells was solely responsible for our impressive talent acquisition during that time.

Of our infamous 13 Pro Bowlers after the 2007 season...

Pro Bowlers acquired while Parcells was on-hand that Parcells wanted: Tony Romo, Jason Witten, Marion Barber, Terence Newman

Pro Bowlers acquired while Parcells was on-hand that Parcells DID NOT want: Terrell Owens, DeMarcus Ware

Pro Bowlers acquired either pre-Parcells or post-Parcells: Flozell Adams, Leonard Davis, Andre Gurode, Greg Ellis, Ken Hamlin, Roy Williams, Nick Folk


Final tally: 6 Pro Bowlers acquired during Parcells' tenure (2 of which he didn't even want), 7 Pro Bowlers acquired independently of Parcells.

 

[CooterBrown]

Parcells was not a talent-acquisition guy, despite what he thought. Parcells was a talent maximizer. He got more out of less than almost any coach I've seen. The problem Parcells always had is that he knew his players' limitations, so he didn't trust them to play well, and that caused him to be too conservative in his game planning and game management.

 

[Dodger12]

Let's see if the facts back up your implication that Parcells was solely responsible for our impressive talent acquisition during that time.

Of our infamous 13 Pro Bowlers after the 2007 season...

Pro Bowlers acquired while Parcells was on-hand that Parcells wanted: Tony Romo, Jason Witten, Marion Barber, Terence Newman

Pro Bowlers acquired while Parcells was on-hand that Parcells DID NOT want: Terrell Owens, DeMarcus Ware

Pro Bowlers acquired either pre-Parcells or post-Parcells: Flozell Adams, Leonard Davis, Andre Gurode, Greg Ellis, Ken Hamlin, Roy Williams, Nick Folk


Final tally: 6 Pro Bowlers acquired during Parcells' tenure (2 of which he didn't even want), 7 Pro Bowlers acquired independently of Parcells.

No love for Miles Austin, Jay Ratliff or Jason Hatcher? And you don't believe that Parcells turned around Adams, Gurode and Ellis? You can argue that BP rejuvenated their careers.

 

[Nav22]

No love for Miles Austin, Jay Ratliff or Jason Hatcher? And you don't believe that Parcells turned around Adams, Gurode and Ellis? You can argue that BP rejuvenated their careers.

I was only referring to our 13 Pro Bowlers that year and we were only talking about talent acquisition.

 

[TheDude]

I was only referring to our 13 Pro Bowlers that year and we were only talking about talent acquisition.

Pro bowlers voted by the public?

 

[Nav22]

Pro bowlers voted by the public?

Fan votes only count for 1/3 of the final tally but you're right. I should've broken down all 53 players on that year's roster and shattered the CZ record for longest post. What was I thinking?

 

[Dodger12]

Fan votes only count for 1/3 of the final tally but you're right. I should've broken down all 53 players on that year's roster and shattered the CZ record for longest post. What was I thinking?

I agree with you regarding the Pro Bowl and while it may not be an end all to evaluate your talent, I think it's a good start and a decent indicator. One can argue that it's partly a popularity contest but the bigger point the Pro Bowl makes, in my opinion, is that you have a highly rated player at that position.

Where I disagree with you is throwing Adams, Davis, Gurode, Hamlin and Ellis on that list. When Parcells arrived, Adams and Gurode were on their way out and Ellis, while solid, was an underachiever who hadn't lived up to expectations for a #8 pick. He had a sort of renaissance when BP convinced him to switch to LB and all we heard was Ellis whining about the move. Adams was on his way out but BP wanted Adams signed/extended because left tackles didn't grow on trees. If BP wasn't hired, Adams wouldn't have been re-signed and he would have earned his multiple Pro-Bowl with another team.

I'd buy your argument even more if your list contained players identified in the lower rounds or UFA such as Austin, Romo, Hatcher, Ratlif, etc. Using 2 top 10 picks, two high priced Free Agents and a kicker to prove Jerry's talent evaluation skills is hardly a ringing endorsement for Jerry.

 

[cml750]

​

. As I see it, the problem is the Cowboys missed their window. They had pretty good shots in 2006-09 and won one playoff game. The one that hurts the most is the 2007 season. It was set up for them to take the NFC and they failed. Wade Phillips gave them the out late in the '07 season by letting up. The team did not react the right way, and I'm not talking about a trip to Cabo or anything like that. After the Cowboys beat the Green Bay Packers that year they lost their momentum and couldn't get it back, losing to the Giants at home. If they win that game -- or the Seattle playoff game the previous year -- and I think a lot of these narratives that have come about are entirely different. Since the Cowboys missed that window, they have been chasing it ever since without success and the personnel has not been as good the last three or four years, despite the proclamations from those far away that the Cowboys have one of the most talented rosters in the NFL. They haven't had that. They have had good 'name' players but spots 15-53 on the roster have been lacking.

...

Sigh..... If only the Cowboys had hired a real coach in 2007??? What a waste of talent!!! What could have been????