Fans Can Only Hope the Real Problem Is Wade?

Chuck 54

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Will Wade Phillips be fired after this season? I'd say it's 95% or better. Should he be fired? Maybe...hard call for me because I don't like firing coaches after one horrible season. I'm not sayng I'm right because I never would have fired Tom Landry after his 3 win season, which means no Jimmy Johnson.

Wade Phillips is the same coach who took the team to 13-3, but tanked in December just as they had under Parcells. Wade is the same coach who took the team to 11-5 last year with a successful December, two great wins over Philly, and the first playoff win in a long time.

Now Wade Phillips is the same coach whose team really sucks. Even when he and the players eliminated most of the dumb mistakes and turnovers and actually took the ball away 5 times, they were still embarrassed.

Fans believe the media hype that Dallas is one of, if not the most talented team in the NFL. NOT ME...I refuse to drink the media kool-aid. And I catch heck for it.

I don't see a talented team at all, and if the NY Giants didn't show you what we really are, if you still think a new head coach could take this bunch of players and win the way you want them to, then you, my friend, may be delusional and in denial.

The sad truth, whether you blame it on Wade, Jerry, Jason Garrett's offense, or the NFL gods, is that The Dallas Cowboys have become a finesse team with no toughness. Don't get me wrong...this isn't about heart or desire...I think some of our players have that...we just aren't tough enough. As Charles Haley said, we "don't have the guys willing to do the dirty work."

Our offensive line is poor, below average...weak at RT, weak up the middle, and inexperienced at LT. We're playing a rookie FB and lost our key blocking HB in the preseason. Physical defensive fronts like Minnesota and the Giants give us fits. When things start to go wrong, unlike the Giants last night, we can't simply slow things down, run the ball a bit, and let everyone calm down and settle in.

On defense, our NT is too light in the pants. I love Ratliff, but he's in the probowl because of his guts, his motor, and his ability to knife through gaps and rush the passer against weaker offensive lines, something most NT's can't do. The bottom line is that he can still be blown off the ball by a double team, and he cannot push the pocket back towards the QB...he has to rely on quickness, which is negated by a good OL. We need a mammoth, powerful NT who cannot be moved out of the gap and who can push the pocket back...QB's routinely have no problem stepping up against us to elude our speed rushers who don't give us much besides rushing upfield.

Our DE's aren't horrible, but they aren't special. As much as we all love Brooking (and I personally like Brady James), our ILBs are not big enough, strong enough, or tough enough to make us an elite defense. They don't make the big hits, create fumbles, or intimidate anyone...oh how I'd love to see a 250-260 Lb beast inside to stop the RBs, punish them, and blitz through the blocks of halfbacks...the type of ILB we really need is the type who has to come off the field in most passing situations...so what?

We are too thin at CB...only 3 guys, and while I'm not as down on Scandrick as most fans (he played that one TD exactly right...an all out blitz, he took away the inside, but the blitz didn't get there and Eli threw a perfect pass behind him...that's not supposed to happen on an all out blitz), but he's not suited to start in case of injury. We have no enforcer, not even a good tackler or ball hawk at FS...our SS is very good at covering TE's and RB's, but he's not a big hitter or enforcer either, not even a good tackler.

So where is this super-talented team that would be in the Super Bowl hunt if it weren't for Camp Cupcake? We have a franchise QB who is still growing; we quickly went from a team that started last year wondering if we had even 1 decent WR to a team this year that has that position as a bonafide strength and on the rise. We may have a RB, but a franchise RB? We don't really know what we have there thanks to Garrett. We have a great TE who suddenly can't remember the snap count, but still delivers.

On defense, we have a good set of starting CBs...we have two good OLBs, though neither one can get pressure on the QB consistently. DWare is not double-teamed as often as many think...he gets doubled when there's a weak OT because he eats them for breakfast, but last night he was blocked 1-1 for most of the night, and he made one play, but never really pressured the QB or hit him...really good OTs seem to control him.

The bottom line is we have some great and above average skill players, but we have no toughness...not one stud on the OL or the DL (I just can't count Ratliff because he's out of position imo...at NT, he's going to make some plays, but he just can't hold up against a good OL). I've been more and more impressed with Felix, but he's not a typical grinder in the NFC East.

Our team is soft because we're not big enough, strong enough, or tough enough where it counts...our OL is big and heavy, but old and playing more of a finesse game than a power game.

The Cowboys have become a finesse team that cannot stand toe to toe with a physical team. That's not about tougher coaching; we don't have the players needed on either line, at ILB, or at Safety.

Wade Phillips will be the first to go at the end of the season, and I won't argue that it's not fair...it is what it is...but what many fans thought was a super talented team with problems on the OL has been shown to be a below average team with just as many issues on defense. The Giants showed us that.

It doesn't take long to fix things in the NFL, but you have to commit to what type of team you want to be. And while the NFL is a passing league now, you'd better still be a tough team on the OL and have a defense that can stand up to a physical offense if you want to do what Cowboys fans want the team to do. It's time to rebuild on both sides of the ball, time to get bigger, stronger, and younger at the "tough" positions.
 
No... Wade isn't the only problem.

There are some assistants that are problems also.

And of course there are players who are underachieving or have lost it, who'll be gone also.

This mess isn't due to just one problem, but several.
 
I think the coaches are the biggest problem, but we need upgrades at the obvious positions (two or three OL spots, both safety spots, at least one ILB spot)

I doubt any of the coaches will be back from this staff, though Ray Sherman has a good shot to stick. He's coached in several different schemes and nobody can argue that he hasnt done his job with our WR's. DeCamillis is a maybe.
 
wayne motley;3652386 said:
Will Wade Phillips be fired after this season? I'd say it's 95% or better. Should he be fired? Maybe...hard call for me because I don't like firing coaches after one horrible season. I'm not sayng I'm right because I never would have fired Tom Landry after his 3 win season, which means no Jimmy Johnson.

Wade Phillips is the same coach who took the team to 13-3, but tanked in December just as they had under Parcells. Wade is the same coach who took the team to 11-5 last year with a successful December, two great wins over Philly, and the first playoff win in a long time.

Now Wade Phillips is the same coach whose team really sucks. Even when he and the players eliminated most of the dumb mistakes and turnovers and actually took the ball away 5 times, they were still embarrassed.

Fans believe the media hype that Dallas is one of, if not the most talented team in the NFL. NOT ME...I refuse to drink the media kool-aid. And I catch heck for it.

I don't see a talented team at all, and if the NY Giants didn't show you what we really are, if you still think a new head coach could take this bunch of players and win the way you want them to, then you, my friend, may be delusional and in denial.

The sad truth, whether you blame it on Wade, Jerry, Jason Garrett's offense, or the NFL gods, is that The Dallas Cowboys have become a finesse team with no toughness. Don't get me wrong...this isn't about heart or desire...I think some of our players have that...we just aren't tough enough. As Charles Haley said, we "don't have the guys willing to do the dirty work."

Our offensive line is poor, below average...weak at RT, weak up the middle, and inexperienced at LT. We're playing a rookie FB and lost our key blocking HB in the preseason. Physical defensive fronts like Minnesota and the Giants give us fits. When things start to go wrong, unlike the Giants last night, we can't simply slow things down, run the ball a bit, and let everyone calm down and settle in.

On defense, our NT is too light in the pants. I love Ratliff, but he's in the probowl because of his guts, his motor, and his ability to knife through gaps and rush the passer against weaker offensive lines, something most NT's can't do. The bottom line is that he can still be blown off the ball by a double team, and he cannot push the pocket back towards the QB...he has to rely on quickness, which is negated by a good OL. We need a mammoth, powerful NT who cannot be moved out of the gap and who can push the pocket back...QB's routinely have no problem stepping up against us to elude our speed rushers who don't give us much besides rushing upfield.

Our DE's aren't horrible, but they aren't special. As much as we all love Brooking (and I personally like Brady James), our ILBs are not big enough, strong enough, or tough enough to make us an elite defense. They don't make the big hits, create fumbles, or intimidate anyone...oh how I'd love to see a 250-260 Lb beast inside to stop the RBs, punish them, and blitz through the blocks of halfbacks...the type of ILB we really need is the type who has to come off the field in most passing situations...so what?

We are too thin at CB...only 3 guys, and while I'm not as down on Scandrick as most fans (he played that one TD exactly right...an all out blitz, he took away the inside, but the blitz didn't get there and Eli threw a perfect pass behind him...that's not supposed to happen on an all out blitz), but he's not suited to start in case of injury. We have no enforcer, not even a good tackler or ball hawk at FS...our SS is very good at covering TE's and RB's, but he's not a big hitter or enforcer either, not even a good tackler.

So where is this super-talented team that would be in the Super Bowl hunt if it weren't for Camp Cupcake? We have a franchise QB who is still growing; we quickly went from a team that started last year wondering if we had even 1 decent WR to a team this year that has that position as a bonafide strength and on the rise. We may have a RB, but a franchise RB? We don't really know what we have there thanks to Garrett. We have a great TE who suddenly can't remember the snap count, but still delivers.

On defense, we have a good set of starting CBs...we have two good OLBs, though neither one can get pressure on the QB consistently. DWare is not double-teamed as often as many think...he gets doubled when there's a weak OT because he eats them for breakfast, but last night he was blocked 1-1 for most of the night, and he made one play, but never really pressured the QB or hit him...really good OTs seem to control him.

The bottom line is we have some great and above average skill players, but we have no toughness...not one stud on the OL or the DL (I just can't count Ratliff because he's out of position imo...at NT, he's going to make some plays, but he just can't hold up against a good OL). I've been more and more impressed with Felix, but he's not a typical grinder in the NFC East.

Our team is soft because we're not big enough, strong enough, or tough enough where it counts...our OL is big and heavy, but old and playing more of a finesse game than a power game.

The Cowboys have become a finesse team that cannot stand toe to toe with a physical team. That's not about tougher coaching; we don't have the players needed on either line, at ILB, or at Safety.

Wade Phillips will be the first to go at the end of the season, and I won't argue that it's not fair...it is what it is...but what many fans thought was a super talented team with problems on the OL has been shown to be a below average team with just as many issues on defense. The Giants showed us that.

It doesn't take long to fix things in the NFL, but you have to commit to what type of team you want to be. And while the NFL is a passing league now, you'd better still be a tough team on the OL and have a defense that can stand up to a physical offense if you want to do what Cowboys fans want the team to do. It's time to rebuild on both sides of the ball, time to get bigger, stronger, and younger at the "tough" positions.

I agree with most of this but especially what's in red. I still think Wade is a big part of the problem and has to go, along with some of the problems you mentioned getting fixed.
 
That's the big problem with blaming everything on the head coach -- the players get to skate.

It's as if, hey, why shouldn't they lay down? They know the coach is going to eat the bullet, not them.
 
Chocolate Lab;3652463 said:
That's the big problem with blaming everything on the head coach -- the players get to skate.

It's as if, hey, why shouldn't they lay down? They know the coach is going to eat the bullet, not them.
But at the same time, a lot of players on this team were present for 2007/2009. So if it's in fact the players, what's the excuse for 2010? I think it's a little bit of everything.
 
Chocolate Lab;3652463 said:
That's the big problem with blaming everything on the head coach -- the players get to skate.

It's as if, hey, why shouldn't they lay down? They know the coach is going to eat the bullet, not them.

Thats clearly not going to be the case with this team though. Several guys are gonna be goners after this season (and a couple maybe before the end of it)
 
Problems start at the top. Jerry Jones has molded this team the way it is. So unless he hires a coach and gives him full power, the results will remain the same.
 
wayne motley;3652386 said:
Will Wade Phillips be fired after this season? I'd say it's 95% or better. Should he be fired? Maybe...hard call for me because I don't like firing coaches after one horrible season. I'm not sayng I'm right because I never would have fired Tom Landry after his 3 win season, which means no Jimmy Johnson.

Wade Phillips is the same coach who took the team to 13-3, but tanked in December just as they had under Parcells. Wade is the same coach who took the team to 11-5 last year with a successful December, two great wins over Philly, and the first playoff win in a long time.

Now Wade Phillips is the same coach whose team really sucks. Even when he and the players eliminated most of the dumb mistakes and turnovers and actually took the ball away 5 times, they were still embarrassed.

Fans believe the media hype that Dallas is one of, if not the most talented team in the NFL. NOT ME...I refuse to drink the media kool-aid. And I catch heck for it.

I don't see a talented team at all, and if the NY Giants didn't show you what we really are, if you still think a new head coach could take this bunch of players and win the way you want them to, then you, my friend, may be delusional and in denial.

The sad truth, whether you blame it on Wade, Jerry, Jason Garrett's offense, or the NFL gods, is that The Dallas Cowboys have become a finesse team with no toughness. Don't get me wrong...this isn't about heart or desire...I think some of our players have that...we just aren't tough enough. As Charles Haley said, we "don't have the guys willing to do the dirty work."

Our offensive line is poor, below average...weak at RT, weak up the middle, and inexperienced at LT. We're playing a rookie FB and lost our key blocking HB in the preseason. Physical defensive fronts like Minnesota and the Giants give us fits. When things start to go wrong, unlike the Giants last night, we can't simply slow things down, run the ball a bit, and let everyone calm down and settle in.

On defense, our NT is too light in the pants. I love Ratliff, but he's in the probowl because of his guts, his motor, and his ability to knife through gaps and rush the passer against weaker offensive lines, something most NT's can't do. The bottom line is that he can still be blown off the ball by a double team, and he cannot push the pocket back towards the QB...he has to rely on quickness, which is negated by a good OL. We need a mammoth, powerful NT who cannot be moved out of the gap and who can push the pocket back...QB's routinely have no problem stepping up against us to elude our speed rushers who don't give us much besides rushing upfield.

Our DE's aren't horrible, but they aren't special. As much as we all love Brooking (and I personally like Brady James), our ILBs are not big enough, strong enough, or tough enough to make us an elite defense. They don't make the big hits, create fumbles, or intimidate anyone...oh how I'd love to see a 250-260 Lb beast inside to stop the RBs, punish them, and blitz through the blocks of halfbacks...the type of ILB we really need is the type who has to come off the field in most passing situations...so what?

We are too thin at CB...only 3 guys, and while I'm not as down on Scandrick as most fans (he played that one TD exactly right...an all out blitz, he took away the inside, but the blitz didn't get there and Eli threw a perfect pass behind him...that's not supposed to happen on an all out blitz), but he's not suited to start in case of injury. We have no enforcer, not even a good tackler or ball hawk at FS...our SS is very good at covering TE's and RB's, but he's not a big hitter or enforcer either, not even a good tackler.

So where is this super-talented team that would be in the Super Bowl hunt if it weren't for Camp Cupcake? We have a franchise QB who is still growing; we quickly went from a team that started last year wondering if we had even 1 decent WR to a team this year that has that position as a bonafide strength and on the rise. We may have a RB, but a franchise RB? We don't really know what we have there thanks to Garrett. We have a great TE who suddenly can't remember the snap count, but still delivers.

On defense, we have a good set of starting CBs...we have two good OLBs, though neither one can get pressure on the QB consistently. DWare is not double-teamed as often as many think...he gets doubled when there's a weak OT because he eats them for breakfast, but last night he was blocked 1-1 for most of the night, and he made one play, but never really pressured the QB or hit him...really good OTs seem to control him.

The bottom line is we have some great and above average skill players, but we have no toughness...not one stud on the OL or the DL (I just can't count Ratliff because he's out of position imo...at NT, he's going to make some plays, but he just can't hold up against a good OL). I've been more and more impressed with Felix, but he's not a typical grinder in the NFC East.

Our team is soft because we're not big enough, strong enough, or tough enough where it counts...our OL is big and heavy, but old and playing more of a finesse game than a power game.

The Cowboys have become a finesse team that cannot stand toe to toe with a physical team. That's not about tougher coaching; we don't have the players needed on either line, at ILB, or at Safety.

Wade Phillips will be the first to go at the end of the season, and I won't argue that it's not fair...it is what it is...but what many fans thought was a super talented team with problems on the OL has been shown to be a below average team with just as many issues on defense. The Giants showed us that.

It doesn't take long to fix things in the NFL, but you have to commit to what type of team you want to be. And while the NFL is a passing league now, you'd better still be a tough team on the OL and have a defense that can stand up to a physical offense if you want to do what Cowboys fans want the team to do. It's time to rebuild on both sides of the ball, time to get bigger, stronger, and younger at the "tough" positions.



I always expect better from your posts, this didnt help. Ill sum up, I think a better coach could get more out of some of our players who arent horrible. There is some kind of talent in most of them. Not all.

I think the fans get a fan favorite to fast and want to hold on to it and hope to change turd into a polished turd. no helping these people.

Lets be real on offense, cept Ray Sherman who had done wonders with Austin, non drafted rookie, and now has Dez, first round pick, I WANT any guy who stands on the table in a draft room and believes in a player on my team if he knows what hes doing and throughout his career Sherman has proven he knows what he is doing.

Im not impressed with our runners this year, even with a bad line, some runners are doing well with bad lines.

Not impressed with anyone on defense and hated the guy we resigned back to the team. Nothing worth keeping here at all plain and simple.

We not only need new players installed on the defense, but someone who can see into the future and KNOWS when to cut guys.

We need a whole NEW scouting department, everyone can be fired now, no need to keep em.

but the biggest hinderance will come from the same problem that people forget about, the GM and this is vital and its not rammed into Jerrys head that claims to either be family and friend or worker in this organization. WHICH also gives me credence that people that are hoping for Stephen to take over are going to wait the years of disappoinment because if Stephen had any love for his father or this organization there would be NOT only words flying over this, but chairs as well because Stephen is just proving to be a yes man and not caring that this position isnt filled either by him or someone feels could make a difference there. Its just more evidence to myself that Stephen will be a bigger disappointment than Jerry himself whos GOING out of limb and tree to prove to us he doesnt care what he field as long as money is had.
 
This team has a much bigger problem than Wade Phillips. He is just the Defensive coordinator.
 
anava;3652480 said:
Problems start at the top. Jerry Jones has molded this team the way it is. So unless he hires a coach and gives him full power, the results will remain the same.


a better, kinder way of putting it and more direct to the point. Show off.:lmao2:
 
MichaelWinicki;3652440 said:
No... Wade isn't the only problem.

There are some assistants that are problems also.

And of course there are players who are underachieving or have lost it, who'll be gone also.

This mess isn't due to just one problem, but several.

The Giants abused Dallas on both sides of the ball, and that goes deep into coaching issues at least. They have done so for two years now...and the players still seem to be free lancing too much. Contrary from the hard work done during training camp by those same players. They don't play with the basics, and that has nothing but completely to do with the focus presented by that coaching staff and it's head. That is Wade, and not Jerry. As well as Jason Garrett on offense. They aren't handling intensities and really overcoming anything but reasonable amounts of catchup situations.
 
Part of the reason we've become 'too soft' is that the scheme and playcalling is designed that way. I don't think the defense is too soft, outside of Spencer. James is too slow, Brooking is too old, Newman is too old to be a consistent tackler given his size, Scandrick sucks. But I don't think outside of Spencer, that the defense is too soft.

O-Linemen, regardless of how big they are, would much rather run block than pass block. You may have a better chance of catching polio than find an O-Lineman that prefers to pass block. Yet are heavy passing scheme 'takes the punch' out of the offense.

I think we are a talented team. Went no worse than 9-7 from 2005 thru 2009. If Wade sucks so much, then how did this team play so well for 5 straight seasons (which is hard to do, only the Pats and Colts went no worse than 9-7 during that period).

I thought Steve Young brought up a good point, that I've brought up since 2006. We are basically every team's 'homecoming game' and that makes things very difficult. Obviously, we can win even with that 'homecoming opponent' factor, but we have to be a talented AND sound football team.

Right now we are talented, but not very sound.





YR
 
The players take a lot of the blame IMO. They gave up MOnday night. It was a pitiful thing to watch. Reminded me of the Campo years to be honest.

Although BP did not win anything he did change the culture a bit that has reverted back to what it was before. (hard nosed football)I don't think he did much otherwise.

Gruden and Cowher would do wonders for the mentality and culture of this team and that is where the biggest change needs to come.
 
I do want a change in HC and OC however I do think there needs to be several changes in Players too (or at least who starts) DL, OL, RB, MLB and Secondary. The DL needs Ratliff moved back to end and find a 330 lb run stuffer in the middle. I like Spears, Bigger NT and Ratliff up front. If they keep Oshansky than just a rotation guy.
 
CCBoy;3653396 said:
The Giants abused Dallas on both sides of the ball, and that goes deep into coaching issues at least. They have done so for two years now...and the players still seem to be free lancing too much. Contrary from the hard work done during training camp by those same players. They don't play with the basics, and that has nothing but completely to do with the focus presented by that coaching staff and it's head. That is Wade, and not Jerry. As well as Jason Garrett on offense. They aren't handling intensities and really overcoming anything but reasonable amounts of catchup situations.

Even longer...they've won 5 of the last 6 games.
 
Guess Cupcake isn't too blame for the his previous debacles in Denver and Buffalo either.

Face it, he has marshmellowed this team and it's over for him.
 
If you have no toughness, that's either one of two problems:

1. You're not developing toughness through mentality and in practice (and that's on the coach).
The way you learn toughness is to be put in tough situations and battle through those situations. That's what practice is for. I help coach 11-13 year olds, and the way we toughen them up is to make them hit in practice. Constantly hit. And go against guys bigger than they are. If they melt from the tough practices, they just don't have it in them, and they don't start or sit the bench unless we're up by 20.
I also have my guys hit me as hard as they can in the chest. I hit them in the shoulder pads to show them how they need to hit opposing players. I tell them football isn't a patty-cake game. When you go to block, you block to deliver a blow, not float your hands up to the guy's chest in a weak attempt to block. We go over this constantly. Some guys get it. The guys who don't won't start against the good teams.

2. You're not drafting tough players. Some players are geniunely passive. They don't have a mean streak. They don't play the game tough, yet they have immense talent. Maybe our draft approach is wrong. Maybe we need to draft more guys who out and out want to hurt you - provided of course they have some talent. Maybe we need to draft more overachievers than guys with talent who just need coaching ... cough, cough Martellus Bennett.

Either way, toughness on a football team is not about the players necessarily, but about coaching. Tough-minded coaches are either going to get their players to play tough or draft, acquire players who fit their style.

We're not tough because Wade's not tough. I guarantee you, if the Cowboys hire a tough coach, they will become tough also. There's a reason why Rex Ryan, Buddy Ryan, Chuck Noll, Bill Parcells and Jimmy Johnson - to name a few - had tough teams. That's because they were tough coaches.

This isn't really rocket science.
 
Yakuza Rich;3653416 said:
Part of the reason we've become 'too soft' is that the scheme and playcalling is designed that way. I don't think the defense is too soft, outside of Spencer. James is too slow, Brooking is too old, Newman is too old to be a consistent tackler given his size, Scandrick sucks. But I don't think outside of Spencer, that the defense is too soft.
:laugh2:

That's about half the starters. The D is way too soft. It's like night and day watching even less talented defenses like the Titans fly around compared to ours, much less an elite D like Pittsburgh.
 

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