FIRE ZIMMER - Part 2

[CoCo]

Okay, the other thread is 13 pages long and currently focused more on Burro discussion than the orginal topic - ironic isn't it

I actually read through much of that thread and it was a worthwhile debate amongst some pretty thoughtful people and yet it somehow failed to emphasize a simple point that I think is fairly obvious.

Some have argued that Parcells has 'demoted' Zimmer leaving him only to implement & direct Bill's scheme and plans, effectively firing him as DC.

But I sure heard a lot of people STILL blaming Zimmer in some of our losses or close calls THIS season thereby CLEARLY implying he was a major culprit in defensive shortcomings. Yet the defense now seems to be hitting its stride which prompted the initial thread of backlash against those claiming Zimmer to be unfit.

So whether he is a true DC or more of a figurehead in some peoples eyes, the fact remains that the early season criticism of Zimmer now appears unfounded in light of the D's recent success. Fair enough?

 

[Mike 1967]

Okay, the other thread is 13 pages long and currently focused more on Burro discussion than the orginal topic - ironic isn't it

I actually read through much of that thread and it was a worthwhile debate amongst some pretty thoughtful people and yet it somehow failed to emphasize a simple point that I think is fairly obvious.

Some have argued that Parcells has 'demoted' Zimmer leaving him only to implement & direct Bill's scheme and plans, effectively firing him as DC.

But I sure heard a lot of people STILL blaming Zimmer in some of our losses or close calls THIS season thereby CLEARLY implying he was a major culprit in defensive shortcomings. Yet the defense now seems to be hitting its stride which prompted the initial thread of backlash against those claiming Zimmer to be unfit.

So whether he is a true DC or more of a figurehead in some peoples eyes, the fact remains that the early season criticism of Zimmer now appears unfounded in light of the D's recent success. Fair enough?

I will chime in since I was a "major contributor" in that last thread.

I will bow out on this one...because I do not have a dog in this fight.

I have no reason to believe that it would be fair to blame Zimmer for the shortcomings this year. It would especially not be fair to, in the same breath, give credit to Parcells for the success.

So...definitely sounds fair to state that early season criticism of Zimmer now appears unfounded in light of the D's recent success.....IMO.

 

[CoCo]

I will chime in since I was a "major contributor" in that last thread.

I will bow out on this one...because I do not have a dog in this fight.

I have no reason to believe that it would be fair to blame Zimmer for the shortcomings this year. It would especially not be fair to, in the same breath, give credit to Parcells for the success.

So...definitely sounds fair to state that early season criticism of Zimmer now appears unfounded in light of the D's recent success.....IMO.

Wow, that was easy.

 

[bsheeern]

Okay, the other thread is 13 pages long and currently focused more on Burro discussion than the orginal topic - ironic isn't it

I actually read through much of that thread and it was a worthwhile debate amongst some pretty thoughtful people and yet it somehow failed to emphasize a simple point that I think is fairly obvious.

Some have argued that Parcells has 'demoted' Zimmer leaving him only to implement & direct Bill's scheme and plans, effectively firing him as DC.

But I sure heard a lot of people STILL blaming Zimmer in some of our losses or close calls THIS season thereby CLEARLY implying he was a major culprit in defensive shortcomings. Yet the defense now seems to be hitting its stride which prompted the initial thread of backlash against those claiming Zimmer to be unfit.

So whether he is a true DC or more of a figurehead in some peoples eyes, the fact remains that the early season criticism of Zimmer now appears unfounded in light of the D's recent success. Fair enough?

I didn't really chime into the last thread, but I will put my 2 cents in on this one. I don't know if this was said previously or not, but I'll go ahead with it anyway.

ALL I need to know about Zimmer as a coach is that Parcells has had him for 2 going on 3 years now. He interviewed him 2 times before he decided to keep him around and he also had a great excuse to get rid of him after last season if we wanted to go in another direction.

With that being said I have a lot more faith in BP evaluating coaches and their talent than any person who has ever typed a single letter on this message board!!!!!!!!!!!!

Zimmer has to be a good coach or Parcells would not have kept him around. To me that is the only obvious thing that can be proved which makes it the most valid argument at this time.

 

[TheHustler]

It's simple. Anytime the defense does anything good, it's a result of BP and his 3-4 defense. Anytime the defense does anything bad, it's a result of Zimmer and his wussy defense.

Duh.

 

[Mike 1967]

Wow, that was easy.

It is becoming apparant to me that I got caught up in the middle of an argument/debate from earlier this season.

I have not questioned Zimmer this year. And if I had an issue with the defense this year i would have put the root cause on the fact that we have young players in key positions. And I would ultimately hold PArcells accountable for the success or failure of this defense, since he built it.

And...since he is the one who chose Zimmer to manage it.

 

[1fisher]

I didn't really chime into the last thread, but I will put my 2 cents in on this one. I don't know if this was said previously or not, but I'll go ahead with it anyway.

ALL I need to know about Zimmer as a coach is that Parcells has had him for 2 going on 3 years now. He interviewed him 2 times before he decided to keep him around and he also had a great excuse to get rid of him after last season if we wanted to go in another direction.

With that being said I have a lot more faith in BP evaluating coaches and their talent than any person who has ever typed a single letter on this message board!!!!!!!!!!!!

Zimmer has to be a good coach or Parcells would not have kept him around. To me that is the only obvious thing that can be proved which makes it the most valid argument at this time.

you nailed it on this post!!!! If anyone on this board can do a better job than Zimmer, I suggest sending your resume to Parcells. Some of the posts are rediculous............

 

[Hostile]

Okay, the other thread is 13 pages long and currently focused more on Burro discussion than the orginal topic - ironic isn't it

I actually read through much of that thread and it was a worthwhile debate amongst some pretty thoughtful people and yet it somehow failed to emphasize a simple point that I think is fairly obvious.

Some have argued that Parcells has 'demoted' Zimmer leaving him only to implement & direct Bill's scheme and plans, effectively firing him as DC.

But I sure heard a lot of people STILL blaming Zimmer in some of our losses or close calls THIS season thereby CLEARLY implying he was a major culprit in defensive shortcomings. Yet the defense now seems to be hitting its stride which prompted the initial thread of backlash against those claiming Zimmer to be unfit.

So whether he is a true DC or more of a figurehead in some peoples eyes, the fact remains that the early season criticism of Zimmer now appears unfounded in light of the D's recent success. Fair enough?

I enjoyed the other thread until it was obvious it quit being about discussing the topic of Zimmer's worth.

On your point, it does not matter if we think he is a true DC or not. What matters is the job of coaching the defense is gettin done by someone.

I prefer to believe the obvious rather than to imagine all kinds of conspiracy theories. To me, the obvious is we have good young players who are better than last year's personnel, the coaches are coaching them and they are executing.

Just my opinion but anyone who believes Parcells would keep someone around who contributes nothing to his staff is a prime candidate to sell ocean front property to. A no nonsense Head Coach, who simultaneously is maintaining and sanctioning a facade?

Naw, no sale.

 

[TwentyOne]

Okay, the other thread is 13 pages long and currently focused more on Burro discussion than the orginal topic - ironic isn't it

I actually read through much of that thread and it was a worthwhile debate amongst some pretty thoughtful people and yet it somehow failed to emphasize a simple point that I think is fairly obvious.

Some have argued that Parcells has 'demoted' Zimmer leaving him only to implement & direct Bill's scheme and plans, effectively firing him as DC.

But I sure heard a lot of people STILL blaming Zimmer in some of our losses or close calls THIS season thereby CLEARLY implying he was a major culprit in defensive shortcomings. Yet the defense now seems to be hitting its stride which prompted the initial thread of backlash against those claiming Zimmer to be unfit.

So whether he is a true DC or more of a figurehead in some peoples eyes, the fact remains that the early season criticism of Zimmer now appears unfounded in light of the D's recent success. Fair enough?

This way or the other way, there is one fact that can't be argued: Zimmer is a bad DC. So get him out of town!

 

[Hostile]

This way or the other way, there is one fact that can't be argued: Zimmer is a bad DC. So get him out of town!

I'd argue it with you. I believe the evidence is in my favor.

 

[jazzcat22]

My argument on Zimmer is not that he is a bad DC. I stated before I never cared for his third and long blitz calls. Because we always were burned by them. But overall, no real complaints. Wasn't a big fan of his, but wanted to see what he could do with a pass rush, and not use blitz's as a way of creating pressure. It seems he is adjusting well, and has the players finally to see what he can do. I say let's give him next year also, and then see what everyone thinks. Because I am extremely happy and trust the defense this year, finally.

I have called for his head a few times, but I have for every other coach also, with bad play calls.

 

[bsheeern]

This way or the other way, there is one fact that can't be argued: Zimmer is a bad DC. So get him out of town!

Let's see on one hand we have Bill Parcell's and in the other the mighty TwentyOne. HHHMMMMM..... Who should we take more seriously......Who's opinion of NFL coaching should we consider to be more relevent.......

 

[bsheeern]

It is becoming apparant to me that I got caught up in the middle of an argument/debate from earlier this season.

I have not questioned Zimmer this year. And if I had an issue with the defense this year i would have put the root cause on the fact that we have young players in key positions. And I would ultimately hold PArcells accountable for the success or failure of this defense, since he built it.

And...since he is the one who chose Zimmer to manage it.

You recieve a star for that post and the fact that you allowed common sense to outweigh personal vendettas .

 

[poke]

It's simple. Anytime the defense does anything good, it's a result of BP and his 3-4 defense. Anytime the defense does anything bad, it's a result of Zimmer and his wussy defense.

Duh.

since i dont have the fancy little icon showing it...you hit the nail on the head.

 

[Hostile]

since i dont have the fancy little icon showing it...you hit the nail on the head.

Click on the smiley faces and you can pull up all the icons.

 

[poke]

thanks Hostile i will try not to get too carried away using these things.

 

[Hostile]

thanks Hostile i will try not to get too carried away using these things.

Aw hell, go ahead. Everyone else does. It's about expressing yourself.

 

[Next_years_Champs]

I enjoyed the other thread until it was obvious it quit being about discussing the topic of Zimmer's worth.

On your point, it does not matter if we think he is a true DC or not. What matters is the job of coaching the defense is gettin done by someone.

I prefer to believe the obvious rather than to imagine all kinds of conspiracy theories. To me, the obvious is we have good young players who are better than last year's personnel, the coaches are coaching them and they are executing.

Just my opinion but anyone who believes Parcells would keep someone around who contributes nothing to his staff is a prime candidate to sell ocean front property to. A no nonsense Head Coach, who simultaneously is maintaining and sanctioning a facade?

Naw, no sale.

Your post is spot on the change to the 3-4 isn't the major factor in our defense this year its the personnel. And the fact is last years defensive collapse was with the players Parcells selected to start the year with. So if Zimmer is reponsible for last year so is Parcells. I guarantee Parcells knew what went wrong last year or he would have fired Zimmer or at least changed his job.

The players on this years defense would be just as successful in a 4-3 because they are better athletes, The front 7 are more athletic and stronger. They could play in any alignment.

 

[TwentyOne]

I'd argue it with you. I believe the evidence is in my favor.

okay.

 

[TwentyOne]

Let's see on one hand we have Bill Parcell's and in the other the mighty TwentyOne. HHHMMMMM..... Who should we take more seriously......Who's opinion of NFL coaching should we consider to be more relevent.......

Did i miss your agruments or are there just none?!