For the record... Tim Tebow

[CowboyChris]

all i care to say about Tebow is, better hope JJ doesnt smell a big risk/reward with Tebow, he loves to take those chances.

 

[ghst187]

honestly, i think Elway's ego was somewhat being threatened by all the love that Tebow was getting and Elway couldn't stand it. I seriously think that played into the equation. I don't think anyone would sit and argue that Tebow is a SB caliber QB and probably never will be. However, Elway could've easily kept Tebow around as a backup, tossed in some wildcat/option read plays ..or not, and still brought in Manning. Meanwhile, Tebow would be learning from Manning. I don't think too many young QBs would have a problem taking a backseat to a surefire first ballot HOF'er like Manning esp knowing his time left is severely limited and that you get to learn from him everyday.
The other part is that Tebow has never done anything except work extremely hard, play his guts out, have a great attitude, put the team first, and won big at every level (he has as many playoff wins as our Romo sadly). So for Denver, really Elway, to treat him the way he did, especially with (as I see it) Elway's fragile ego being a big part of it, I think its quite fitting if Elway's Manning experiment fizzles bigtime and they never get any farther than they did with Tebow.
What would be even more fitting, is for a Tebow team to beat Denver out of the playoffs. Tend to doubt that will happen, but think it would absolutely hysterical.
So please forgive the Tebow love, I'll admit I love the guy. I love everything he stands for and the way he lives and the way he plays the game and the perspective he maintains. Don't know if he'll ever be a SB champ in the NFL (I hope he does honestly), but meanwhile he is a refreshing breath of fresh air in a game so dominated thugs (still irks me that Ray Lewis got away with being an accessory to murder), a game where many of those same thugs are so celebrated and glorified despite the fact they'd likely be in jail were it not for football. Yeah yeah I know its about winning if football is your life but for the other 99.9% of the population football is an escape from a way of life where character is not only an important thing, its often the only thing.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

honestly, i think Elway's ego was somewhat being threatened by all the love that Tebow was getting and Elway couldn't stand it. I seriously think that played into the equation. I don't think anyone would sit and argue that Tebow is a SB caliber QB and probably never will be. However, Elway could've easily kept Tebow around as a backup, tossed in some wildcat/option read plays ..or not, and still brought in Manning. Meanwhile, Tebow would be learning from Manning. I don't think too many young QBs would have a problem taking a backseat to a surefire first ballot HOF'er like Manning esp knowing his time left is severely limited and that you get to learn from him everyday.
The other part is that Tebow has never done anything except work extremely hard, play his guts out, have a great attitude, put the team first, and won big at every level (he has as many playoff wins as our Romo sadly). So for Denver, really Elway, to treat him the way he did, especially with (as I see it) Elway's fragile ego being a big part of it, I think its quite fitting if Elway's Manning experiment fizzles bigtime and they never get any farther than they did with Tebow.
What would be even more fitting, is for a Tebow team to beat Denver out of the playoffs. Tend to doubt that will happen, but think it would absolutely hysterical.
So please forgive the Tebow love, I'll admit I love the guy. I love everything he stands for and the way he lives and the way he plays the game and the perspective he maintains. Don't know if he'll ever be a SB champ in the NFL (I hope he does honestly), but meanwhile he is a refreshing breath of fresh air in a game so dominated thugs (still irks me that Ray Lewis got away with being an accessory to murder), a game where many of those same thugs are so celebrated and glorified despite the fact they'd likely be in jail were it not for football. Yeah yeah I know its about winning if football is your life but for the other 99.9% of the population football is an escape from a way of life where character is not only an important thing, its often the only thing.

Very well said.

 

[BoysFan4ever]

honestly, i think Elway's ego was somewhat being threatened by all the love that Tebow was getting and Elway couldn't stand it. I seriously think that played into the equation. I don't think anyone would sit and argue that Tebow is a SB caliber QB and probably never will be. However, Elway could've easily kept Tebow around as a backup, tossed in some wildcat/option read plays ..or not, and still brought in Manning. Meanwhile, Tebow would be learning from Manning. I don't think too many young QBs would have a problem taking a backseat to a surefire first ballot HOF'er like Manning esp knowing his time left is severely limited and that you get to learn from him everyday.
The other part is that Tebow has never done anything except work extremely hard, play his guts out, have a great attitude, put the team first, and won big at every level (he has as many playoff wins as our Romo sadly). So for Denver, really Elway, to treat him the way he did, especially with (as I see it) Elway's fragile ego being a big part of it, I think its quite fitting if Elway's Manning experiment fizzles bigtime and they never get any farther than they did with Tebow.



What would be even more fitting, is for a Tebow team to beat Denver out of the playoffs. Tend to doubt that will happen, but think it would absolutely hysterical.
So please forgive the Tebow love, I'll admit I love the guy. I love everything he stands for and the way he lives and the way he plays the game and the perspective he maintains. Don't know if he'll ever be a SB champ in the NFL (I hope he does honestly), but meanwhile he is a refreshing breath of fresh air in a



game so dominated thugs (still irks me that Ray Lewis got away with being an accessory to murder), a game where many of those same thugs are so celebrated and glorified despite the fact they'd likely be in jail were it not for football. Yeah yeah I know its about winning if football is your life but for the other 99.9% of the population football is an escape from a way of life where

character is not only an important thing, its often the only thing.

Great post.

 

[DFWJC]

Is winning a wild card game, and getting blown out in the divisional round really better than having a bye but losing in the divisional round.

I don't think it is.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

I don't think it is.

Denver lost at home against a much worse team this year then when they lost on the road at NE last year.

 

[DFWJC]

Denver lost at home against a much worse team this year then when they lost on the road at NE last year.

I think this year's loss certainly hurt worse. Expectations were way higher.

I meant in general, all else equal.

(1) Playing good all year to win your division, earning a 1st round bye, and then losing in the second round

is pretty much the same as....

(2) Not earning a bye, but winning in round one, and then also losing in round two.

I like to at least give some credit to a team that played a great season and won their division. Plus, generally second round opponents are better than 1st rund opponents. I don't want to penalize a team for earning a bye.

JMO though.

 

[WPBCowboysFan]

Why would Elway want Tebow as a backup?

Tebow couldnt outplay a pitiful Sanchez in NY. If Rex thought he could win with Tebow he would have used him no doubt.

Elway had already experienced the Tebow circus.

I dont think Elway's ego had anything to do with it.

I really think all you Tebow lovers didnt watch those games the Broncos won with Tebow playing. They won in spite of Tebow for the most part. Elway knew that. And he knew it was in no way sustainable.

Why do you think they have already said in Jax they dont want Tebow?

 

[DragonCowboy]

The 2011 Patriots were infinitely better than the 2012 Ravens. So with that said the argument is pretty much a wash.

I'm not sure how you're making this argument that they're infinitely better than the 2012 Ravens.

They weren't "infinitely better" than the 2011 Ravens, and we have no way of really telling how the 2012 Ravens would've fared against the 2011 Patriots (but I guess we'll find out how they'd fare against the 2012 Patriots).

Infinitely better is a ridiculous overstatement.

 

[Tabascocat]

Tebow is just not a good QB and will never be a franchise one IMO. I like him as a man but not as my teams caller.

I think he could be a good HC someday if thats a path he chooses.

 

[DragonCowboy]

honestly, i think Elway's ego was somewhat being threatened by all the love that Tebow was getting and Elway couldn't stand it. I seriously think that played into the equation. I don't think anyone would sit and argue that Tebow is a SB caliber QB and probably never will be. However, Elway could've easily kept Tebow around as a backup, tossed in some wildcat/option read plays ..or not, and still brought in Manning. Meanwhile, Tebow would be learning from Manning. I don't think too many young QBs would have a problem taking a backseat to a surefire first ballot HOF'er like Manning esp knowing his time left is severely limited and that you get to learn from him everyday.
The other part is that Tebow has never done anything except work extremely hard, play his guts out, have a great attitude, put the team first, and won big at every level (he has as many playoff wins as our Romo sadly). So for Denver, really Elway, to treat him the way he did, especially with (as I see it) Elway's fragile ego being a big part of it, I think its quite fitting if Elway's Manning experiment fizzles bigtime and they never get any farther than they did with Tebow.
What would be even more fitting, is for a Tebow team to beat Denver out of the playoffs. Tend to doubt that will happen, but think it would absolutely hysterical.
So please forgive the Tebow love, I'll admit I love the guy. I love everything he stands for and the way he lives and the way he plays the game and the perspective he maintains. Don't know if he'll ever be a SB champ in the NFL (I hope he does honestly), but meanwhile he is a refreshing breath of fresh air in a game so dominated thugs (still irks me that Ray Lewis got away with being an accessory to murder), a game where many of those same thugs are so celebrated and glorified despite the fact they'd likely be in jail were it not for football. Yeah yeah I know its about winning if football is your life but for the other 99.9% of the population football is an escape from a way of life where character is not only an important thing, its often the only thing.

I guess a lot of Jets staff members have fragile egos too, because he was had the 4th most passing yards on the team.

And the fact that Tebow lives an admirable life doesn't change the fact that Peyton Manning is better. I don't see how you can fault Elway for getting Manning. If anything, Elway's ego would be threatened more by Manning than Tebow.

Also, do you have any sort of source that Elway was threatened by Tebow? Is this something you've read?

 

[tyke1doe]

I'm a Tebow fan. But I understand why Elway had to let Tebow go. The Broncos simply didn't want to run the type of offense that would cater to Tebow. Elway wanted to run a more traditional offense. And Peyton Manning gave him the perfect opportunity to move in that direction without facing the unbridled wrath of Tebow fans.

And no other franchise wants that either. I think if it weren't for Tebowmania, there would be more teams willing to take a chance on Tebow, sit him for a few years and work with him on his throwing deficiencies. But Tebow fans aren't going to let him just sit quietly behind someone. They're going to demand he play, and if he succeeds, they're not going to want him to return to the bench.

And few if any teams want that.

As much as I want to see Tebow do his thang and produce the magics like last year, I doubt he'll be signed by another team. However, I have a strange feeling that maybe the Patriots will draft him just to have him on their roster.

 

[tyke1doe]

Yeah except they were at the exact same point.

It's not like Tebow got to the Super Bowl. Tebow got to the divisional round and got BLOWN OUT.

Manning got to the divisional round and made it to overtime AND LOSS.

The Tebow love here is ridiculous.

Interesting you forgot that little factoid in the underlined above.

Tebow won.

In the final analysis, his playoff success for the Broncos is greater than Peyton's, regardless of the seeding.

The Tebow hate here is ridiculous. :laugh2:

 

[Yakuza Rich]

I'm a Tebow fan. But I understand why Elway had to let Tebow go. The Broncos simply didn't want to run the type of offense that would cater to Tebow. Elway wanted to run a more traditional offense. And Peyton Manning gave him the perfect opportunity to move in that direction without facing the unbridled wrath of Tebow fans.

And no other franchise wants that either. I think if it weren't for Tebowmania, there would be more teams willing to take a chance on Tebow, sit him for a few years and work with him on his throwing deficiencies. But Tebow fans aren't going to let him just sit quietly behind someone. They're going to demand he play, and if he succeeds, they're not going to want him to return to the bench.

And few if any teams want that.

As much as I want to see Tebow do his thang and produce the magics like last year, I doubt he'll be signed by another team. However, I have a strange feeling that maybe the Patriots will draft him just to have him on their roster.

I don't think it really has to do with offensive schemes and the fact that Peyton Manning is a FAR better QB than Tebow.

One year without Manning and the Colts go 2-14. The following year with Andrew Luck they make the playoffs, but by every statistical category are the worst team to ever make the playoffs. This is where I think Dungy was overrated. He had ONE job to do in Indy...create a solid defense. And he couldn't do that.

You're looking at arguably the best QB of all time who is arguably the best QB in the league at this time that fell into Denver's lap. I'm not religious, but I like Tebow as a person...but, he's just not in the same galaxy as Peyton as a QB regardless of scheme. I think if Elway truly believed they had a top-tier Qb in Tebow with that offense, they would have stuck with him. But, he had serious doubts about that.






YR

 

[Yakuza Rich]

Interesting you forgot that little factoid in the underlined above.

Tebow won.

In the final analysis, his playoff success for the Broncos is greater than Peyton's, regardless of the seeding.

The Tebow hate here is ridiculous. :laugh2:

Big difference is that the Ravens score 38 points against the Broncos.

The Steelers scored 23 points against the Broncos.

Neither Tebow or Peyton play defense.






YR

 

[DragonCowboy]

Interesting you forgot that little factoid in the underlined above.

Tebow won.

In the final analysis, his playoff success for the Broncos is greater than Peyton's, regardless of the seeding.

The Tebow hate here is ridiculous. :laugh2:

They both reached the same level in the playoffs!

Ultimately all that really matters in the grand scheme of things is how far you advance in the playoffs - namely if you're the last team standing.

Tebow's team last year made it to the round of 8, and so did Peyton's team. Peyton's team was a hell of a lot closer getting to the round of 4.

I don't care what games they won to get to that point, because it's irrelevant.

 

[tyke1doe]

Big difference is that the Ravens score 38 points against the Broncos.

The Steelers scored 23 points against the Broncos.

Neither Tebow or Peyton play defense.



YR

We're getting off track now.

The original question was whether a wild card playoff win followed by a blowout is better than a bye then a divisional loss. I said yes.

Others who disagree with my opinion want to make the argument that Manning is better than Tebow. I understand that, and I agree.

But that wasn't the question. I'm merely defending my statement that a playoff win is better than a playoff loss regardless where it comes.

 

[tyke1doe]

They both reached the same level in the playoffs!

Ultimately all that really matters in the grand scheme of things is how far you advance in the playoffs - namely if you're the last team standing.

Tebow's team last year made it to the round of 8, and so did Peyton's team. Peyton's team was a hell of a lot closer getting to the round of 4.

I don't care what games they won to get to that point, because it's irrelevant.

You have your opinion, I have mine.

However, the fact remains that Tebow has more playoff victories with Denver than Peyton Manning. And this says nothing about Tebow being a better quarterback than Peyton because that's simply ridiculous.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

The 2011 Patriots were infinitely better than the 2012 Ravens. So with that said the argument is pretty much a wash.

Maybe, but to me your comparing two teams whose season ended at the same point and trying to argue one over the other.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

For the team, .. winning a playoff game can never be equal with losing a playoff game. Never.

Yeah, lossing a playoff game can never equal a win, but they both loss in the divisional round. What would make more sense, even though I disagre, is that a playoff win trumps a playoff bye. Because that's what we're comparing.

As a whole would anyone argue that the Seahawks, Texans or Packers had a better season than the Broncos? Ofcourse not, they all lost in the same round, and winning the previous weekend is irrelevant when comparing them to the Broncos who were better in the regular season and thus earned a bye.

To me, all 4 teams had the same amount of success this season, which is a bit more than the 4 teams that lost last weekend and a bit less than the two teams that will lose next weekend.

For the QB himself, .. one threw a pick in OT, at home to lose the game, .. and one threw a TD pass in OT, at home for the win.

And don't twist this into thinking I would rather have Tebow over P. Manning.

Just telling it like it is.

And if you aren't saying you'd rather have Tebow than Manning, then what are you saying? Because I'm certainly not arguing that the Broncos beat the Steelers in the wild card round last year with Tim Tebow at QB.

And FWIW, I think Peyton Manning consistently doesn't play his best in the biggest games. If it weren't for the SuperBowl against the Bears, no one would even notice Romo's chocking and I actually like Tim Tebow. I even think he could be a successfull QB, but would need an offense designed for him, similar to what the Commanders to with RG3, and I don't think any team would be willing to do that.

But Denver clearly did the right thing going after Manning and even with his age, I'd like my prospects better with Manning going foward than with Tebow.