FS- just another CB?

[burmafrd]

The NFL now is a pass heavy league. Is it reasonable to go with the decision that the FS position is now basically just another CB? Maybe a little bigger, but other than that no real difference? The duties are different, but its all about covering receivers and maybe playing center field. The SS still has to cover the TE and help in run support, but the FS really is only concerned with the passing game by the WRs. So instead of looking for a college FS, instead look for a bigger than usual CB that can tackle better than most and has an eye for making plays. The standard starting Lineup on D really should now have 3 CBs and 1 Safety.

 

[Hostile]

In a word, yes.

 

[burmafrd]

Sad how many of us thought that Ball would do well. I now remember that thread, but hey its been 9 months.

 

[jblaze2004]

give me Ras-I Dowling in the 2nd and move him to free safty. He looks like he is a good physical corner like Antrell Rolle but just isn't fast enough to play corner unless he is in cover 2 defense like the bucs. He has the size to play the position might need to add alittle more muscle but who doesn't coming from college.

 

[burmafrd]

but how good is he at tackling? That is the one thing the FS must be, a good tackler. He is the last line of defense.

 

[jblaze2004]

 

[RoyTheHammer]

How anyone could still be thinking about drafting or moving a CB to FS for us next year after the complete disaster that move was for us this season is beyond me. Have you all not had enough of the "Alan Ball Project" yet this season?

Give me a safety in the draft. A premium pick at the position who has played it their whole career and knows the position, the in's and out's of it and won't have to spend two years just learning the nuances of where to position themselves, how to get in better spots to make plays, etc..

You want a LB, you don't draft a TE. You want a safety.. draft a freaking safety please.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

The problem with using a converted corner is that it takes different recognition skills at safety than it does at corner. Ball struggles with recognizing play action and with zone responsibilities. When you're at corner you don't worry about the play action and you don't have folks going across your zone of responsibility both to the left and to the right.

Bottom line I'm not so certain moving a corner to safety is an end-all. Instead I would say focus on someone who has played safety at the college level who has good turn-and-run ability. Darren Woodson had that.

Ball can cover, that's not the problem. And I think his tackling is OK. His recognition skills are what's holding him back.

I think if you brought in a corner who played a lot of zone in the college level, like Scandrick, then you'd have a fighting chance of converting them to FS.

 

[jblaze2004]

How anyone could still be thinking about drafting or moving a CB to FS for us next year after the complete disaster that move was for us this season is beyond me. Have you all not had enough of the "Alan Ball Project" yet this season?

Give me a safety in the draft. A premium pick at the position who has played it their whole career and knows the position, the in's and out's of it and won't have to spend two years just learning the nuances of where to position themselves, how to get in better spots to make plays, etc..

You want a LB, you don't draft a TE. You want a safety.. draft a freaking safety please.

not everyone is alan ball lets face it ball was not a big corner (just tall and weights what 190 on a good day) with good coverage or tackling skills of Ras-I Dowling. Hence why he was a late round draft pick. But Ras-I Dowling is rated a second round. You get alot better quality player and with good coaching he can be like Antrel Rolle or better. A Ball-Hawking safety that will provide help for the CB's and make QB's pay for throwing into his part of the field.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

How anyone could still be thinking about drafting or moving a CB to FS for us next year after the complete disaster that move was for us this season is beyond me. Have you all not had enough of the "Alan Ball Project" yet this season?

Give me a safety in the draft. A premium pick at the position who has played it their whole career and knows the position, the in's and out's of it and won't have to spend two years just learning the nuances of where to position themselves, how to get in better spots to make plays, etc..

You want a LB, you don't draft a TE. You want a safety.. draft a freaking safety please.

The trouble with Dallas drafting a safety is that they seem to be in this "David Fulcher" mode, where a safety needs to be 6'2, 220lbs. Consequently they may have recognition skills but they can't turn-and-run efficiently. They're too gangly and it takes them too much time to get up to speed.

Get a FS, who's 6'0 200lbs, and can run a 4.48 and you've got a chance.

 

[burmafrd]

Didn't Woody play LB in college?

 

[MichaelWinicki]

not everyone is alan ball lets face it ball was not a big corner (just tall and weights what 190 on a good day) with good coverage or tackling skills of Ras-I Dowling. Hence why he was a late round draft pick. But Ras-I Dowling is rated a second round. You get alot better quality player and with good coaching he can be like Antrel Rolle or better. A Ball-Hawking safety that will provide help for the CB's and make QB's pay for throwing into his part of the field.

Ball's problem isn't his size or lack-thereof.

It's his recognition skills.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Didn't Woody play LB in college?

It was one of those modified LB/S positions.

But he had the hips to be able to cover and the top-gear in order to keep up.

 

[jblaze2004]

The problem with using a converted corner is that it takes different recognition skills at safety than it does at corner. Ball struggles with recognizing play action and with zone responsibilities. When you're at corner you don't worry about the play action and you don't have folks going across your zone of responsibility both to the left and to the right.

Bottom line I'm not so certain moving a corner to safety is an end-all. Instead I would say focus on someone who has played safety at the college level who has good turn-and-run ability. Darren Woodson had that.

Ball can cover, that's not the problem. And I think his tackling is OK. His recognition skills are what's holding him back.

I think if you brought in a corner who played a lot of zone in the college level, like Scandrick, then you'd have a fighting chance of converting them to FS.

good points but i was saying if we was looking to convert because not to many good safeties are coming out in this draft. But then again we do have AOA to learn and try to convert so......

 

[burmafrd]

A FS has to be big and strong enough to make the tackle when it counts. I think being a guy who like to tackle has to be one of the main requirements. But its true a Zone type CB is probably the guy you can move to FS. And by the way I have never thought that Ball was all that good at coverage.

 

[jblaze2004]

It was one of those modified LB/S positions.

yeah something like stephen Hodge played in college i think.

 

[burmafrd]

Woody was just a great player; I think where he played in college mattered little. That is what we need to find- a great PLAYER.

 

[jblaze2004]

A FS has to be big and strong enough to make the tackle when it counts. I think being a guy who like to tackle has to be one of the main requirements. But its true a Zone type CB is probably the guy you can move to FS. And by the way I have never thought that Ball was all that good at coverage.

especially not in zone which is and should be a requirement for a FS.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

A FS has to be big and strong enough to make the tackle when it counts. I think being a guy who like to tackle has to be one of the main requirements. But its true a Zone type CB is probably the guy you can move to FS. And by the way I have never thought that Ball was all that good at coverage.

I think Ball's coverage is suffering because he's arriving late on routes due to his lack of recognition skills.

The bottom line is that he needs to go back to being the 4th corner.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Woody was just a great player; I think where he played in college mattered little. That is what we need to find- a great PLAYER.

He was, but keep in mind he was a 2nd rounder. Probably due to the uncertainty of what position he could play at the next level. But physically, yeah, he was the total package.