Guards effect on the Center

[sureletsrace]

I am in no way defending Costa's play last year, nor do I feel comfortable going into this year with him as the starter.

With that said, how much effect does guard play have on the center? Last year, the guard positions were turnstiles, how many different guards did we have play last year?

The offensive line is the most rhythmic position group in the game. Guys have to develop chemistry. Again, I am not excusing Costa's awful play last year. I hate the idea of him starting. However, I am curious to see what kind of effect it will have on his game if our guards remain healthy and could manage to play above average.

From my limited knowledge of the center position (I played LT in HS), I believe the Center typically doubles up on a DT with a guard. I would perhaps be willing to -from a fan perspective, not a coaches- give the guy another chance and just see if he does any better. I guess I just don't want to give up on the guy just yet.

I suppose we'll find out come game 1 against the Giants.

Now that I mention it, what a great test for our offensive line to begin the season; keeping Tony upright against the Super Bowl Giants D-Line.

 

[Bluestang]

http://cowboyszone.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4543129&postcount=1

I touched on this a while ago.

 

[Mr Cowboy]

Holland played pretty well last year and was not a turnstile. Kosier had a bad foot and didn't play that well. Costa was identified by the opposition and targeted, knowing he was the weakest of weak links. They kept bringing that blitz up the middle, where the DE loops around and attacks the center. It worked every time, and almost got Romo killed, (see the Eagles game).

For some reason, people here think that with better guards, defenses will no longer attack Costa. If anything, with an off season of film study by opposing teams, they will devise even more ways to attack Costa. We are doomed with him as the starting center.

Woicek and Callahan are some of the best at what they do, but they are not miracle workers.

I predicted in January that after a few months, Jerry would tell us that Costa wasn't that bad and with an off season he would be better, and that people here would not only buy it, but be happy about it.

 

[CCBoy]

Holland played pretty well last year and was not a turnstile. Kosier had a bad foot and didn't play that well. Costa was identified by the opposition and targeted, knowing he was the weakest of weak links. They kept bringing that blitz up the middle, where the DE loops around and attacks the center. It worked every time, and almost got Romo killed, (see the Eagles game).

For some reason, people here think that with better guards, defenses will no longer attack Costa. If anything, with an off season of film study by opposing teams, they will devise even more ways to attack Costa. We are doomed with him as the starting center.

Woicek and Callahan are some of the best at what they do, but they are not miracle workers.

I predicted in January that after a few months, Jerry would tell us that Costa wasn't that bad and with an off season he would be better, and that people here would not only buy it, but be happy about it.

Couchscout addressed this in the Imperial Report.

Costa, has short arms, but he comes out of his stance slowly and limited lateral ability to be effective. That is why the Dallas interior was attacked extensively last season. In a zone blocking scheme, with a man on man blocker as Holland, or an injured Kosier, it was hard to coordinate double blocks and move on into the secondary zones. DeMarco Murray had to follow his fullback, until injured, or trail Bennett through a hole.

Costa's slowish reaction from his stance may be part of the cause for the tendency to snap awkwardly as well.

Myself, injury recovery permitting, Bernadeau is the answer here at center. Plug in Leary or Arkin/Nagy at right guard.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

Holland played pretty well last year and was not a turnstile. Kosier had a bad foot and didn't play that well. Costa was identified by the opposition and targeted, knowing he was the weakest of weak links. They kept bringing that blitz up the middle, where the DE loops around and attacks the center. It worked every time, and almost got Romo killed, (see the Eagles game).

For some reason, people here think that with better guards, defenses will no longer attack Costa. If anything, with an off season of film study by opposing teams, they will devise even more ways to attack Costa. We are doomed with him as the starting center.

Woicek and Callahan are some of the best at what they do, but they are not miracle workers.

I predicted in January that after a few months, Jerry would tell us that Costa wasn't that bad and with an off season he would be better, and that people here would not only buy it, but be happy about it.

Bingo...

Of course the guys out the door are to blame.

 

[CCBoy]

Bingo...

Of course the guys out the door are to blame.

So as to be a little analytical on the picture...and not to just grab another reason from the burn barrel...you are saying that the lame Kosier, a one on one blocker in Holland, and a slow from stance reacting short-armed center are in fact not the reason why things changed. Better yet, scheme quality, and not just slot fills were NOT the actual consideration, evaluation, and cause for the current picture with personnel now at those positions?

 

[speedkilz88]

It was a group effort on all three positions last year.

 

[sago1]

So, Callahan our new OL coach, buys into the idea that better OGs on either side of Costa will somehow magically improve his play & our opponents won't target Costa or our interior OL? And Garrett, former NFL backup QB that he was for many years, also buys that line? And both buy this line cause that is what OL handback says? Or does Callahan know some kind of magic to overcome or improve Costa's failings?

Frankly, this remains me of a RT (Pettiti or something like that) several years back that Parcells was determined to coach up to make him our starting RT. The guy worked hard but he was a rookie & Parcells could only do so much. Finally, Parcells signed Colombo who successfully rehabbed with us to beat out Pettiti (sp?) the next year as our starting RT.

 

[CCBoy]

So, Callahan our new OL coach, buys into the idea that better OGs on either side of Costa will somehow magically improve his play & our opponents won't target Costa or our interior OL? And Garrett, former NFL backup QB that he was for many years, also buys that line? And both buy this line cause that is what OL handback says? Or does Callahan know some kind of magic to overcome or improve Costa's failings?

Frankly, this remains me of a RT (Pettiti or something like that) several years back that Parcells was determined to coach up to make him our starting RT. The guy worked hard but he was a rookie & Parcells could only do so much. Finally, Parcells signed Colombo who successfully rehabbed with us to beat out Pettiti (sp?) the next year as our starting RT.

Callahan could only get so much done towards placing workable pieces into the scheme that has been arrived upon. The agreement as to both Callahan and Garrett, are as to direction and techniques to be given birth to.

Player acquisitions are still chained to player roster status and ability to make changes in cap use and draft. It's not like the Yankees being able to purchase who it is they desire.

Both Callahan and Garrett endorse directions. Then there is a coach up and catchup that has to be overcome...that's just the way it is.

 

[BIGDen]

I predicted in January that after a few months, Jerry would tell us that Costa wasn't that bad and with an off season he would be better, and that people here would not only buy it, but be happy about it.

A few may be buying it, but a large majority here hate the idea of Costa as our center. As far as your prediction about people being "happy" about it, I don't believe I have seen that at all. Why would anyone be happy about one of our weakest links returning? We've read that his play improved as the season went on and he does have more experience. Hopefully, improved guard play will help him - but he still has to do his job. I think the best we can hope for is that he is adquate and not a Proctor-like, massive, weak link.

 

[junk]

You can only do so much in 1 offseason. I'd be surprised if center isn't an area that they look to address next year (.....Barrett Jones....)

 

[Prossman]

Costa is by far the biggest question mark on this team. I do like his work ethic and film study, but he will have to make a quantum leap at center this year for any superbowl dream to be fulfilled. He was ranked 30 out of 32 centers in the nfl and that about says it all. To his credit he has been 110% hardcore this offseason and i hope it translates. Ideally if leary takes the right guard spot and Bernadeau moves to center would breathe a sigh of relief in me. The bottom line is we need a upgrade here, and unless a veteran becomes a cap casualty somewhere, it probably wont be until next year

 

[BIGDen]

Myself, injury recovery permitting, Bernadeau is the answer here at center. Plug in Leary or Arkin/Nagy at right guard.

I'm with you on this. Granted, we really don't know what guys like Leary or Bernadeau (at center) will do with the pads on, but I will be most optimistic (based on potential/stuff we've read) if it turns out like this:

LT:Smith
LG: Livings
C: Bernadeau
RG: Leary
RT: Free

That line would certainly go through some growing pains and I hate that we have to face the Giants DL on the road in game 1, but I like the (that four letter word again) "potential" of that group. Perhaps it's the fact that none are likely to be manhandled like Kosier (in the past), Nagy, Costa or even Arkin. These are all big, strong guys that can likely get us the tough yards. If they can come together well enough to be decent at pass protection, we have some hope for a solid O-line (and a great offense).

 

[CCBoy]

Costa is by far the biggest question mark on this team. I do like his work ethic and film study, but he will have to make a quantum leap at center this year for any superbowl dream to be fulfilled. He was ranked 30 out of 32 centers in the nfl and that about says it all. To his credit he has been 110% hardcore this offseason and i hope it translates. Ideally if leary takes the right guard spot and Bernadeau moves to center would breathe a sigh of relief in me. The bottom line is we need a upgrade here, and unless a veteran becomes a cap casualty somewhere, it probably wont be until next year

Pross, I guess some would call that affirmative action...

 

[CCBoy]

I'm with you on this. Granted, we really don't know what guys like Leary or Bernadeau (at center) will do with the pads on, but I will be most optimistic (based on potential/stuff we've read)) if it turns out like this:

LT:Smith
LG: Livings
C: Bernadeau
RG: Leary
RT: Free

That line would certainly go through some growing pains and I hate that we have to face the Giants DL on the road in game 1, but I like the (that four letter word again) "potential" of that group. Perhaps it's the fact that none are likely to be manhandled like Kosier (in the past), Nagy, Costa or even Arkin. These are all big, strong guys that can likely get us the tough yards. If they can come together well enough to be decent at pass protection, we have some hope for a solid O-line (and a great offense).

For sure, a good snapshot there....

 

[MichaelWinicki]

You can only do so much in 1 offseason. I'd be surprised if center isn't an area that they look to address next year (.....Barrett Jones....)

That's a valid point.

 

[burmafrd]

you can somewhat cover up a weak player but you cannot perform WELL in that area doing so. Costus a season has to go.

 

[BourbonBalz]

Costa is by far the biggest question mark on this team. I do like his work ethic and film study, but he will have to make a quantum leap at center this year for any superbowl dream to be fulfilled. He was ranked 30 out of 32 centers in the nfl and that about says it all. To his credit he has been 110% hardcore this offseason and i hope it translates. Ideally if leary takes the right guard spot and Bernadeau moves to center would breathe a sigh of relief in me. The bottom line is we need a upgrade here, and unless a veteran becomes a cap casualty somewhere, it probably wont be until next year

I'm curious as to why so many seem to think moving Bernadeau to center is the answer. From what I've read, he's practiced some at center but has never actually played the position in a single game. That is not an answer IMO. While Costa is far from great, at least he's a center. Bernadeau is a guard that has never played the center position, at least when it counts.

 

[burmafrd]

I'm curious as to why so many seem to think moving Bernadeau to center is the answer. From what I've read, he's practiced some at center but has never actually played the position in a single game. That is not an answer IMO. While Costa is far from great, at least he's a center. Bernadeau is a guard that has never played the center position, at least when it counts.

because costus a season is that bad

 

[BourbonBalz]

And absolutely no one knows how Bernadeau would fare playing center. You can't just plug a guy in like that. I'm not saying he can or can't be an upgrade over Costa at center, but not a single person on this forum has any idea either. It's an unknown. Should the team explore it? Maybe. I'll leave those decisions to the coaches.