Have The Dallas Cowboys Drafted Enough Defensive Linemen?

[jday]

Who was the target that they missed on when they moved up for Claiborne?

When you say "target," it suggest a player the Cowboys also wanted; to know that, I'd to need to see their draft board. But I will tell you the players I would rather have based on what we have seen thus far:

In no particular order players drafted after Claiborne:
Mark Barron
Dontari Poe
Luke Kuechly
Fletcher Cox
Bruce Irvin
Stephen Hill
Bobby Wagner
David DeCastro

I'm sure there are others, but I feel pretty confident the above cast of characters may prove to be better choices than Claiborn. This year is the last year Claiborne has to prove he was not a bust, so it's a bit unfair to say at this point those players will turn out to be better contributors, but still, he is going to have to start and become the ballhawk we were sold to change my mind.

 

[cowboy_ron]

Professional I assume? I always wondered do you play on the circuit or independently seek out tourneys, etc.? I know you need invites to some of that stuff but always wondered how that worked out? Any general info would be appreciated. Thanks

I don't do a lot of traveling for tourneys....I did a season on the WPT once but decided I didn't like that route much so I just play locally mostly.
The WSOP is open for anyone to play in and very few of those tourneys are by invitation.....Poker after dark however IS by invitation but isn't related to the WSOP and is a "cash game"with a usual 100K buy in as opposed to tournament style which I prefer and normally play.
I hope this answered your question BigStar but if it didn't feel free to ask again if you're looking for an answer more specific

 

[ElGatoGrande]

I guess we need to wait and see how Marinelli does with the caliber of players being brought in so far and what is being asked of them. It's probably safe to say the team needs at least one more high impact draft choice for the DL, the LB corps and a stud safety. If the team finishes the season only needing three defensive starters I'd be happy knowing it's on track with Marinelli.

 

[BigStar]

I don't do a lot of traveling for tourneys....I did a season on the WPT once but decided I didn't like that route much so I just play locally mostly.
The WSOP is open for anyone to play in and very few of those tourneys are by invitation.....Poker after dark however IS by invitation but isn't related to the WSOP and is a "cash game"with a usual 100K buy in as opposed to tournament style which I prefer and normally play.
I hope this answered your question BigStar but if it didn't feel free to ask again if you're looking for an answer more specific

Really envious and respect that you are of that caliber of player/pro. Assume you play all poker; Omaha, Razz, 7 Stud, etc.? Do you have a favorite? PAD, similar to High Stakes Poker with Kaplan (Love Gabe) seems more of a poker promotional show, so understand that would be off limits to amateurs like myself. Thanks a lot for the info. I must have misinterpreted the "invitation" aspect because some of the older WSOP telecasts for smaller circuit tourneys kept reiterating "was invited to join the circuit, etc." regarding certain new players they focused on. These were the older Norman Chad telecasts so it may be an outdated concept (pardon my ignorance).

 

[cowboy_ron]

Really envious and respect that you are of that caliber of player/pro. Assume you play all poker; Omaha, Razz, 7 Stud, etc.? Do you have a favorite? PAD, similar to High Stakes Poker with Kaplan (Love Gabe) seems more of a poker promotional show, so understand that would be off limits to amateurs like myself. Thanks a lot for the info. I must have misinterpreted the "invitation" aspect because some of the older WSOP telecasts for smaller circuit tourneys kept reiterating "was invited to join the circuit, etc. regarding certain new players they focused on" These were the older Norman Chad telecasts so it may be an outdated concept.

I do like to change up the games sometimes...mostly hold em and Omaha and H.O.R.S.E. which is pretty much all the games you mentioned into one tournament.....yea Gabe is a funny guy...a real pleasure to play wth

 

[xwalker]

This does sound like an ideal plan (for the QB) but wouldn't the cap come into play once the team is ready to draft the QB? You're saying the offense takes longer to develop, so wouldn't this only set up a young QB with a very short window to enjoy the foundation set forth? I agree with the general premise though in that it allows for the easiest transition for a young QB to be successful. Like we were speaking of previously, WRs are an expensive position, as are Tackles. So the majority of the cap would be tied into these positions even before a big 2nd contract for the new QB is in play. The team could maybe squeak by with a cheap/young D but seems like they would eventually be repairing one side of the ball @ a detriment to the other.

My priorities would include free agency and the draft.

I would spend on free agent OL and offensive players in free agency in the beginning. Then the QB could be drafted. The key would be to draft and develop players to replace the free agents after their contracts are up which would be about the same time that the QB was due for a big contract.

The defense wouldn't really have to be completely neglected in the beginning because if there was no big money QB then there would be money for some free agents on defense also.

The key to it all would be making successful picks in the draft. You have to hit on some non-first round picks. Draft guys like Trai Turner who was a 3rd rounder because he was less experienced and less developed than Zack Martin, but will likely be about as good after a year or so in the NFL.

 

[BigStar]

My priorities would include free agency and the draft.

I would spend on free agent OL and offensive players in free agency in the beginning. Then the QB could be drafted. The key would be to draft and develop players to replace the free agents after their contracts are up which would be about the same time that the QB was due for a big contract.

The defense wouldn't really have to be completely neglected in the beginning because if there was no big money QB then there would be money for some free agents on defense also.

The key to it all would be making successful picks in the draft. You have to hit on some non-first round picks. Draft guys like Trai Turner who was a 3rd rounder because he was less experienced and less developed than Zack Martin, but will likely be about as good after a year or so in the NFL.

I will never peg you as lacking foresight, just wanted more clarification on that specific point (thanks for expanding on it). The only possible hiccup with this philosophy is successfully hitting on OT/WR in FA (not guaranteed) to lay the initial foundation of the rookie QB. But I also understand your more central point is that drafting those FA replacements is the more integral aspect of that process to long term success. Same philosophy is then applied to the D; sign proven DL/corners while drafting accordingly for their replacements and allowing the D to be formidable in the process.

Still believe you undervalue the S position

 

[jobberone]

Had a great month...won't play the main event though...I have put in way too many 14 hr days this month, I'm getting too old anymore...haha....time for a couple of weeks off

I only play for funsies and that's an entirely different game since people screw around so much. I've become beyond bored. Go fishing or just sit in the boat or on the beach. I like the pool by the beach where the greatest concentration of lookers resides. Maximize your fun kind of thing.

 

[cowboy_ron]

I only play for funsies and that's an entirely different game since people screw around so much. I've become beyond bored. Go fishing or just sit in the boat or on the beach. I like the pool by the beach where the greatest concentration of lookers resides. Maximize your fun kind of thing.

Maybe you could plan a trip to Vegas next June and give the WSOP a shot...there are literally 100's of tournaments that month to play in 1000., 1500. 2500. range that are pretty fun which is where you can make the most money...the main event is just a showcase...kind of like going drinking on New Year Eve

 

[jobberone]

Maybe you could plan a trip to Vegas next June and give the WSOP a shot...there are literally 100's of tournaments that month to play in 1000., 1500. 2500. range that are pretty fun which is where you can make the most money...the main event is just a showcase...kind of like going drinking on New Year Eve

I've been trying to plan it and we have some friends there. But I just haven't been able to get away lately. I haven't even been back to China in over a year. I've thought about playing in some online satellite tournaments but I don't know how to get around the US thing.

I'll try to hook up with you next year and if we visit for awhile before then we can meet and have some fun. I'll probably come out for a week or two before Christmas.

 

[cowboy_ron]

I've been trying to plan it and we have some friends there. But I just haven't been able to get away lately. I haven't even been back to China in over a year. I've thought about playing in some online satellite tournaments but I don't know how to get around the US thing.

I'll try to hook up with you next year and if we visit for awhile before then we can meet and have some fun. I'll probably come out for a week or two before Christmas.

I'm not an online player so I wouldn't even know how to advise you on that jobber...I watch player actions and eyes so online just wouldn't do it...in fact when cards are dealt I don't even look at my hole cards until I see reactions to the rest of the table...even the most subtle reaction can be telling, especially with players that aren't used to playing live games much.

Yea, let me know if you and the wifey decide to come out here, I bought some lake property near Tyler that is getting a makeover so I'm back and forth quite often overseeing that operation.

 

[jobberone]

I'm not an online player so I wouldn't even know how to advise you on that jobber...I watch player actions and eyes so online just wouldn't do it...in fact when cards are dealt I don't even look at my hole cards until I see reactions to the rest of the table...even the most subtle reaction can be telling, especially with players that aren't used to playing live games much.

Yea, let me know if you and the wifey decide to come out here, I bought some lake property near Tyler that is getting a makeover so I'm back and forth quite often overseeing that operation.

Count on it, Ron, and thanks.

 

[casmith07]

quality over quantity
every year we should be looking for quality lineman, both sides...

Said it very simply and pretty much the best way to go about it. The same can be said about linebackers, cornerbacks, safeties, and other positions as well.

 

[speedkilz88]

Well that depends on who you ask. If you ask a front page writer at BTB they will come up with a complex formula to "prove" that the Cowboys have indeed invested heavily in the DL.

I will just employ Occam's razor.

The last time the Cowboys took a defensive tackle in the top half of the NFL draft was Willie Blade in 2001.

The last two draft classes were supposedly deep at the Defensive tackle position. The Cowboy came away with ONE Seventh Rounder--Ken Bishop.

By contrast, Jimmy Johnson threw some serious currency at the position. Jimmy Jones was drafted in the third round in 1990. And In 1991 the Cowboys spent two first round choices on Russell Maryland (first overal) and Kelvin Pritchett (20th overall). They also stole Leon Lett out of the seventh round that same year.

That's misleading because they were playing a 3-4. You would need to count 3-4 DEs as similar to DTs in a 4-3. Hatcher, Canty, Crawford, etc.. are DTs in a 4-3.

I guess if anything is misleading it would be your "etc"

Who outside of the three you mention were drafted as 3-4 DEs? None. So in the Post Parcells Era, Crawford is the only 3-4 DE drafted.

SMH -- Kelvin Pritchett wasn't drafted by the Cowboys. He was traded to Detroit, but they didn't finalize it until after the pick.

And xwalker is right. It is very misleading (or ignorant) to make that claim when they had been running a 3-4. Most DEs in a 3-4 would be DTs in a 4-3 and are considered interior lineman.

2014
7)Ken Bishop

Cowboys took advantage of this deep draft with udfa DTs Davon Coleman and Chris Whaley who is injured--both quick 3 tech DTs



Drafting for 3-4

2013
3)Tyrone Crawford


2010
7)Sean Lissemore
S7)Josh Brent

2006
3)Jason Hatcher
6)Montavious Stanley
UDFA)Stephen Bowen

2005
1)Marcus Spears
4)Chris Canty
7)Jay Ratliff

Drafting for 4-3

2001
3)Willie Blade
6)Daleroy Stewart
7)John Nix

1998
4)Michael Myers

1997
4)Antonio Anderson

1996
3)Mike Ulufale

1995
S7)Darren Benson

1994
7)Toddrick McIntosh

 

[daveferr33]

SMH -- Kelvin Pritchett wasn't drafted by the Cowboys. He was traded to Detroit, but they didn't finalize it until after the pick.

And xwalker is right. It is very misleading (or ignorant) to make that claim when they had been running a 3-4. Most DEs in a 3-4 would be DTs in a 4-3 and are considered interior lineman.

2014
7)Ken Bishop

Cowboys took advantage of this deep draft with udfa DTs Davon Coleman and Chris Whaley who is injured--both quick 3 tech DTs



Drafting for 3-4

2013
3)Tyrone Crawford


2010
7)Sean Lissemore
S7)Josh Brent

2006
3)Jason Hatcher
6)Montavious Stanley
UDFA)Stephen Bowen

2005
1)Marcus Spears
4)Chris Canty
7)Jay Ratliff

Drafting for 4-3

2001
3)Willie Blade
6)Daleroy Stewart
7)John Nix

1998
4)Michael Myers

1997
4)Antonio Anderson

1996
3)Mike Ulufale

1995
S7)Darren Benson

1994
7)Toddrick McIntosh

Well with all due respect, I think you just proved my original point: the Cowboys have not used the top half of the draft to acquire interior Defensive lineman, whether the scheme be a 3-4 or a 4-3. By your calculation (and Xwalker's and mine) there has only been one taken post-Parcells: third rounder Tyrone Crawford.

 

[cowboy_ron]

Count on it, Ron, and thanks.

Sounds good...let me know if you want any show tickets...I can get Celine Dion and Criss Angel tickets free FYI

 

[speedkilz88]

Well with all due respect, I think you just proved my original point: the Cowboys have not used the top half of the draft to acquire interior Defensive lineman, whether the scheme be a 3-4 or a 4-3. By your calculation (and Xwalker's and mine) there has only been one taken post-Parcells: third rounder Tyrone Crawford.

No, really you don't have a point. It's called *****ing.

 

[jobberone]

Sounds good...let me know if you want any show tickets...I can get Celine Dion and Criss Angel tickets free FYI

My wife says you are her new BFF with a kiss on the cheek. And I love both, too. Many Thanks!

 

[cowboy_ron]

My wife says you are her new BFF with a kiss on the cheek. And I love both, too. Many Thanks!

lol...tell the wifey thanks jobber

 

[xwalker]

I will never peg you as lacking foresight, just wanted more clarification on that specific point (thanks for expanding on it). The only possible hiccup with this philosophy is successfully hitting on OT/WR in FA (not guaranteed) to lay the initial foundation of the rookie QB. But I also understand your more central point is that drafting those FA replacements is the more integral aspect of that process to long term success. Same philosophy is then applied to the D; sign proven DL/corners while drafting accordingly for their replacements and allowing the D to be formidable in the process.

Still believe you undervalue the S position

Safety and LB are highly valuable on the field. I just don't value them as highly in the draft because they can be obtained in free agency for less than DEs and CBs, in general. There are some highly paid Safeties, but there are normally some mid priced but talented Safeties available every year in FA.