HOF Trivia Question

[percyhoward]

There have been 24 position players in the Super Bowl era who have: 1) a SB ring, 2) 5+ Pro Bowls, and 3) made the AP All Pro team 4+ times.

20 of the 24 are in the Hall of Fame.

Name the four players who are not in the Hall of Fame.

Hint: 3 of the 4 are Cowboys, of course.

HOF eligible players only (retired prior to 2001)

 

[pancakeman]

Michael Irvin?

 

[TruBlueCowboy]

Harvey Martin, Bullet Bob, Cornell Green?

 

[Chief]

Just guessing, but I would say Cliff Harris, Cornell Green and Chuck Howley.

It could also be Lee Roy Jordan and Drew Pearson.

That's good information, though. Something the voters should know.

 

[X-Dawg]

Cliff Harris

 

[percyhoward]

Just guessing, but I would say Cliff Harris, Cornell Green and Chuck Howley.

Hail to the Chief.

We have a winner, sort of.

Care to have a guess at the fourth (non-Cowboy)?

 

[TruBlueCowboy]

Yeah, one of those linebackers has got to be there, Michael Irvin probably too.

I'm going Howley, Green and Irvin?

 

[DallasEast]

L.C. Greenwood.

 

[percyhoward]

The fourth, Gary Zimmerman, won his ring at the end of his career as a Bronco.

What's even more unreal is that until this year, there were six players on the list, and four of them were Cowboys. Harry Carson and Rayfield Wright were both long overdue in their inductions.

Maybe the selection committee feels it has thrown the Cowboys a bone by letting Wright in. I've got news for them. There is still work to be done.

And yet, you will hear more from the media about Zimmerman in the coming years than about any of the three Cowboys.

 

[percyhoward]

Greenwood: 6 pro bowls, 2 all-pro

Irvin: 5 pro bowls, 1 all-pro

Jordan: 5 pro bowls, 1 all-pro

Pearson: 3 pro bowls, 3 all-pro

Hayes: 3 pro bowls, 2 all-pro

Martin: 4 pro bowls, 1 all-pro, dpoy-77, sbmvp-77

 

[parchy]

I don't necessarily have a problem with Bullet being left out of the Hall. I certainly recognize how he changed the game with his speed, but I really don't think he played long enough. Given another couple of seasons I think we could put him in, but by no fault of his own, he was phased out of the offense before he was "done."

 

[DallasEast]

The fourth, Gary Zimmerman, won his ring at the end of his career as a Bronco.

What's even more unreal is that until this year, there were six players on the list, and four of them were Cowboys. Harry Carson and Rayfield Wright were both long overdue in their inductions.

Maybe the selection committee feels it has thrown the Cowboys a bone by letting Wright in. I've got news for them. There is still work to be done.

And yet, you will hear more from the media about Zimmerman in the coming years than about any of the three Cowboys.

Zimmerman is another example of an ex-player deemed 'great enough' by the selectors to be named to an All-Decade team (like Harris), but not great enough to be inducted. I do agree with you about how the media will promote Zimmerman too. He deserves the spotlight, but Harris, Martin and Green are worthy of equal media exposure--moreso because all three have had to wait a lot longer than him.

 

[percyhoward]

Zimmerman is another example of an ex-player deemed 'great enough' by the selectors to be named to an All-Decade team (like Harris), but not great enough to be inducted.

It's interesting that you mention the All-Decade teams, because they are selected, not by coaches and players, but by the writers on the HOF selection committee themselves. The same guys who decide who goes into the Hall.

Using that as a standard, there are a couple of more Cowboys names you can add for consideration. Drew Pearson, who along with Harris made the all-70's team; and Ralph Neely who made it in the 60's.

Here is the list of the 24 position players with:
1) a super bowl ring, 2) 5+ pro bowls, and 3) 4+ all-pro selections.
Bold indicates Hall of Famer.

Herb Adderly
Willie Brown
Dave Casper
Willie Davis
Cornell Green
Joe Greene
Jack Ham
Cliff Harris
Chuck Howley
Ted Hendricks
Jim Langer
Jack Lambert
Bob Lilly
Larry Little
Ronnie Lott
Joe Montana
Walter Payton
Mike Singletary
Lawrence Taylor
Mike Webster
Randy White
Reggie White
Rayfield Wright
Gary Zimmerman

There are some very good players--great players, legends--who won Super Bowls and are in the Hall of Fame...but did not go to enough Pro Bowls or were named All-Pro enough times to make this list.

There is no sane argument that can possibly be made against either Howley, Harris, Green, or Zimmerman for the Hall.

 

[DallasEast]

It's interesting that you mention the All-Decade teams, because they are selected, not by coaches and players, but by the writers on the HOF selection committee themselves. The same guys who decide who goes into the Hall.

Using that as a standard, there are a couple of more Cowboys names you can add for consideration. Drew Pearson, who along with Harris made the all-70's team; and Ralph Neely who made it in the 60's.

Here is the list of the 24 position players with:
1) a super bowl ring, 2) 5+ pro bowls, and 3) 4+ all-pro selections.
Bold indicates Hall of Famer.

Herb Adderly
Willie Brown
Dave Casper
Willie Davis
Cornell Green
Joe Greene
Jack Ham
Cliff Harris
Chuck Howley
Ted Hendricks
Jim Langer
Jack Lambert
Bob Lilly
Larry Little
Ronnie Lott
Joe Montana
Walter Payton
Mike Singletary
Lawrence Taylor
Mike Webster
Randy White
Reggie White
Rayfield Wright
Gary Zimmerman

There are some very good players--great players, legends--who won Super Bowls and are in the Hall of Fame...but did not go to enough Pro Bowls or were named All-Pro enough times to make this list.

There is no sane argument that can possibly be made against either Howley, Harris, Green, or Zimmerman for the Hall.

Very good list and I agree with you 100%.

 

[Hostile]

There have been 24 position players in the Super Bowl era who have: 1) a SB ring, 2) 5+ Pro Bowls, and 3) made the AP All Pro team 4+ times.

20 of the 24 are in the Hall of Fame.

Name the four players who are not in the Hall of Fame.

Hint: 3 of the 4 are Cowboys, of course.

HOF eligible players only (retired prior to 2001)

I haven't read the thread but I can guess 2 Cowboys and the other player.

1. Chuck Howley

2. Cliff Harris

3. Bob Kuechenberg...Dolphins.

 

[Hostile]

Well, 2 out of 3 isn't horrible. The other 2 both surprised me a bit, though I do think Zimmerman needs to be in.

 

[percyhoward]

Cornell Green was a surprise to me too. He made All-Pro 4 straight years from 1966-69, and no other CB made it more than two of those years.

Green was switched over to safety late in his career and made the Pro Bowl at that position too.

 

[joseephuss]

I don't necessarily have a problem with Bullet being left out of the Hall. I certainly recognize how he changed the game with his speed, but I really don't think he played long enough. Given another couple of seasons I think we could put him in, but by no fault of his own, he was phased out of the offense before he was "done."

Things I have read before say that Hayes was partly at fault for his diminished playing time and production. He didn't last long in San Francisco.

 

[pancakeman]

Thanks for this thread - interesting stuff.

 

[Cowboy Bill Watts]

somebody ought to forward this thread to peter king or paul zimmerman and see if we get a reaction out of them. aren't they both selectors?