How the PC is making consoles look out of date

Dallas

Old bulletproof tiger
Messages
11,515
Reaction score
3
tupperware;3872093 said:
You can.

It's just not very practical. We're also not ONLY talking about the 360, but that's what I referenced. There are browsers for you to browse online.

We're not talking about the 8 bit nes here. Consoles do more than just game now, you know?

When people say that the console is superior and/or say there is a better value/quality I beg to differ, because the PC does so much more that you get much more for your money.

Most people know that consoles do ALOT more than just gaming nowadays. When my friends ask me what they should buy, I always ask them what are they looking for out of the console. Guess what is in the top 3 things they come back with?

1. Game Titles
2. ONLINE COMMUNITY/NETFLIX/FACEBOOK/STORES/CONTENT/DOWNLOADS/MUSIC..more?
3. Price

People do not only buy consoles nowadays to just to plug a game into. Many people are buying them for EVERYTHING that it can do. That "everything" is getting bigger and bigger each and every day w/ more publishers coming out with apps that run on LIVE/Station and Wii and things they can tie into the ONLINE community.

Why wouldn't you take advantage of that when purchasing a console?

But don't misunderstand what I am saying here. People can do all of this even better on a PC or Mac (I'll give props to you mac fanboys here) over a console. Most cases even more things.
 

tupperware

A Plastic Container
Messages
7,273
Reaction score
93
Dallas;3872102 said:
Most people know that consoles do ALOT more than just gaming nowadays. When my friends ask me what they should buy, I always ask them what are they looking for out of the console. Guess what is in the top 3 things they come back with?

1. Game Titles
2. ONLINE COMMUNITY/NETFLIX/FACEBOOK/STORES/CONTENT/DOWNLOADS/MUSIC..more?
3. Price

People do not only buy consoles nowadays to just to plug a game into. Many people are buying them for EVERYTHING that it can do. That "everything" is getting bigger and bigger each and every day w/ more publishers coming out with apps that run on LIVE/Station and Wii and things they can tie into the ONLINE community.

Why wouldn't you take advantage of that when purchasing a console?

But don't misunderstand what I am saying here. People can do all of this even better on a PC or Mac (I'll give props to you mac fanboys here) over a console. Most cases even more things.

Yep. That's why I don't get what theogt was saying about the whole gaming thing. No one buys a console now for JUST gaming and this thread afaik wasn't blocked off from discussing the values of both platforms relative to their other uses. Even if it was, there would be nothing wrong with pointing it out.
 

theogt

Surrealist
Messages
45,846
Reaction score
5,912
tupperware;3872093 said:
You can.

It's just not very practical. We're also not ONLY talking about the 360, but that's what I referenced. There are browsers for you to browse online.

We're not talking about the 8 bit nes here. Consoles do more than just game now, you know?

When people say that the console is superior and/or say there is a better value/quality I beg to differ, because the PC does so much more that you get much more for your money.
"zOMG!!! PC >>>>>> c0nso1ez!!!!!11!1! Check out the graphics on these games!!!!"

You can discuss whatever you like, but it's pretty clear to any other sane person what this thread was about. If you want to make the point that a PC is better than a console at surfing the internet, then go right ahead. I will not stand in the way of such a salient, focused and relevant argument.

Never mind the quotes like this in the OP:

As console hardware ages game developers are again turning to the PC to showcase the jaw-dropping visuals that next generation games will be capable of.

Over the years the annual Game Developers Conference in San Francisco has morphed from a developer focused gathering to a kind of mini-E3, where games are announced and the internet gets flooded with developer interviews and game previews. However the real core of GDC is still development, and it often delivers a fantastic insight into where games are headed.
Nope, definitely not about games.
 

Hoofbite

Well-Known Member
Messages
40,896
Reaction score
11,621
tupperware;3872174 said:
Yep. That's why I don't get what theogt was saying about the whole gaming thing. No one buys a console now for JUST gaming and this thread afaik wasn't blocked off from discussing the values of both platforms relative to their other uses. Even if it was, there would be nothing wrong with pointing it out.

Yes they do.

People already have computers. They don't need the stuff that comes with the console, it's just there so they likely use it. Those extras are not deal breakers or deal makers. They're just add-ons.

I'm getting the impression that some people are thinking the argument is about whether or not consoles will take over for PCs as a general use item.

It isn't a "what would you pick if you could only have one" type of situation. People have computers and chose to play games on consoles. That in itself should tell you a little something about why people buy consoles.
 
Messages
3,013
Reaction score
586
Can I play legendary first party PS3 games like Uncharted 2 and God of War 3 on my PC? Nope.

Can I play Starcraft 2, or my favorite MMO on my 360? Nope.

Is it awesome owning a great gaming PC and consoles? Yep.
 

tupperware

A Plastic Container
Messages
7,273
Reaction score
93
Hoofbite;3872249 said:
Yes they do.

People already have computers. They don't need the stuff that comes with the console, it's just there so they likely use it. Those extras are not deal breakers or deal makers. They're just add-ons.

I'm getting the impression that some people are thinking the argument is about whether or not consoles will take over for PCs as a general use item.

It isn't a "what would you pick if you could only have one" type of situation. People have computers and chose to play games on consoles. That in itself should tell you a little something about why people buy consoles.
Then they're overpaying, too :)

theogt, the PC is also better at games, I'm just pointing out some other areas where it is superior.

Console gamers need not get all bothered by it, I mean, if it does what you want it to do, so what?

They may be a little more accessible to the less PC inclined but they'll always be inferior and always be less value for the money, compared to what PC's can do.

And I've owned almost every console they've put out, but I also recognize which are the better platforms and which has limitations.

Consoles are good for the kids and teenagers who may just wanna plop down and play and are more casually inclined.

The thing is, I can make my PC a casual gaming system too with the help of outputting video and a wireless 360 controller, no difference for me and many other advantages to boot.
 

theogt

Surrealist
Messages
45,846
Reaction score
5,912
tupperware;3872313 said:
They may be a little more accessible to the less PC inclined but they'll always be inferior and always be less value for the money, compared to what PC's can do.
Or not. To be honest, outside of people I read about on the internet (i.e., in this thread), I don't really know anyone that games on a PC anymore. The limited number of people I do know that are gamers use consoles. This is supported by sales statistics too. PC gaming sales account for about 5% of gaming sales. The other 95% are consoles. But what do 95% of the gaming population know? Clearly they're not as enlightened as the 5% and cannot see the value of the PC. Either that or you're full of it.

I use neither, by the way.
 

tupperware

A Plastic Container
Messages
7,273
Reaction score
93
http://www.game-newswire.com/index.php/the-news/232.html

Among the key findings: Annual shipment volumes for the PC Gaming hardware market in 2009 were over two times larger than the combined Wii™, PlayStation® 2, PlayStation® 3 and Xbox 360® console units shipped in the same period. This trend for the PC Gaming hardware market to outpace all console shipments combined is expected to continue through the forecasted period of the research. In addition, revenues from consumer PCs capable of gaming that shipped with a discrete GPU (excludes Netbooks and integrated graphics-based PCs) totaled approximately $54.6 billion in 2009 and are forecasted to grow to $61.3 billion by 2014. These revenue figures are based on an estimated 61.5 million PCs (Desktop and Laptops) shipped in 2009 that can largely be associated with PC gaming as a key usage scenario.

Enjoy.
 

theogt

Surrealist
Messages
45,846
Reaction score
5,912
tupperware;3872382 said:
http://www.gamespot.com/news/6303325.html

FEBRUARY 2011 US GAME SALES
OVERALL DOLLAR SALES
Total software: $637.4 million (-8%)
Non-PC software: $601.4 million (-4%)

Yup, about 5% of games sold were on PC. The other 95% were on consoles. PC gaming is a very niche market, largely because it can't compete with the value of consoles.

You can't look at HARDWARE sales, because many people will spend $1000 on a PC and never use it for gaming. LOL @ the idea of comparing "consumer PCs capable of gaming."
 

tupperware

A Plastic Container
Messages
7,273
Reaction score
93
http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/gamesblog/2010/jul/22/pc-gamers-versus-console-gamers

Check that one out.

Also, before I go digging up some more articles about why you can't compare PC and console gaming sales directly (One being licensing fees and another the fact that PC games are usually cheaper)

Do you really think gaming sales on one platform being higher make it the superior gaming platform?

If so, why? Just because of the numbers?

Look no further than the Cowboys payroll as evidence that more $ doesn't equal superiority.
 

theogt

Surrealist
Messages
45,846
Reaction score
5,912
tupperware;3872396 said:
I still don't think you quite get what the argument is. I am not saying on an absolute level consoles are better. If I wanted the absolute fastest gaming machine with the best graphics and the most options in terms of control, of course I'd pick a PC. But that was never the argument, so it's a pointless article to which to link.

Also, before I go digging up some more articles about why you can't compare PC and console gaming sales directly (One being licensing fees and another the fact that PC games are usually cheaper)

Do you really think gaming sales on one platform being higher make it the superior gaming platform?

If so, why? Just because of the numbers?
If the discussion is about the best value, then in many ways it's a subjective discussion. If the OVERWHELMING majority of people put their money on consoles, then it speaks to the subjective nature of the discussion in general.
 

tupperware

A Plastic Container
Messages
7,273
Reaction score
93
theogt;3872403 said:
I still don't think you quite get what the argument is. I am not saying on an absolute level consoles are better. If I wanted the absolute fastest gaming machine with the best graphics and the most options in terms of control, of course I'd pick a PC. But that was never the argument, so it's a pointless article to which to link.

If the discussion is about the best value, then in many ways it's a subjective discussion. If the OVERWHELMING majority of people put their money on consoles, then it speaks to the subjective nature of the discussion in general.
Well I've never referenced sales or insinuated that PC gaming was the more popular choice, but it is the superior one.

Not everyone who wants to just game is going to invest in a computer, that's fine.

What I'm saying is, PC's are the better gaming platform, even if they don't lead in actual game sales.

This just tells me that there are more casual gamers than hardcore gamers or gamers who realize what they can get out of a PC compared to a console.

Most games have modding communities that do things with the games that you simply can't do at all on the console. Also, community addons are usually free. Content released through the 360 usually costs $. It's done on the PC too but it's not nearly as bad.
 

theogt

Surrealist
Messages
45,846
Reaction score
5,912
tupperware;3872411 said:
Well I've never referenced sales or insinuated that PC gaming was the more popular choice, but it is the superior one.

Not everyone who wants to just game is going to invest in a computer, that's fine.

What I'm saying is, PC's are the better gaming platform, even if they don't lead in actual game sales.

This just tells me that there are more casual gamers than hardcore gamers or gamers who realize what they can get out of a PC compared to a console.

Most games have modding communities that do things with the games that you simply can't do at all on the console. Also, community addons are usually free. Content released through the 360 usually costs $. It's done on the PC too but it's not nearly as bad.
Ah, yes, the dismissal of the overwhelming majority who prefer something else as not being "truists". It's the disguised way of saying "I'm right, they're wrong, because I said so." Whatever helps you justify your own subjective opinion, man.
 

tupperware

A Plastic Container
Messages
7,273
Reaction score
93
theogt;3872412 said:
Ah, yes, the dismissal of the overwhelming majority who prefer something else as not being "truists". It's the disguised way of saying "I'm right, they're wrong, because I said so." Whatever helps you justify your own subjective opinion, man.
Or the fact that I've owned the following:

Atari 7800
Nintendo
Genesis (With Sega-CD)
Super Nintendo
Gamecube
Nintendo 64
Playstation
Dreamcast
Playstation 2
XBOX
XBOX 360

And the fact that:
I've been using PC's since my very early teens, played all the games, used online services from mplayer to heat.net. I've used Gamespy I use steam I've used all the communities involved therein through mediums such as IRC, Mumble/TeamSpeak/Ventrilo.

I'm not saying it's for everyone and that it is more popular, it is superior.

I know because I've used both and this is my opinion, though anyone who has the means or knowledge to use both to their full potential will be hard pressed to disagree.
 

arglebargle

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,373
Reaction score
409
Theogt, your theory about consoles being 95% of the game sales is torpedoed by the fact that there is no accurate count of the number of games sold by digital download. Steam does not release their sales numbers and they are the big dog of digital delivery. Retail, brick and morter sales of PC games are down, but then none of those places are catering to the PC crowd, in part, because of the inability to leverage the second hand market.

I have the opposite personal experiance here: Few people I know play console games (most don't have one) but they do game on PC. The only exception is my 20 yo nephew and his friends, who play on both.

That list of 'Top Games' you linked to just makes me sad.

And the top money making game in the world has initials that begin and end with W and it does not work on a console.
 

tupperware

A Plastic Container
Messages
7,273
Reaction score
93
arglebargle;3872417 said:
Theogt, your theory about consoles being 95% of the game sales is torpedoed by the fact that there is no accurate count of the number of games sold by digital download. Steam does not release their sales numbers and they are the big dog of digital delivery. Retail, brick and morter sales of PC games are down, but then none of those places are catering to the PC crowd, in part, because of the inability to leverage the second hand market.

I have the opposite personal experiance here: Few people I know play console games (most don't have one) but they do game on PC. The only exception is my 20 yo nephew and his friends, who play on both.

That list of 'Top Games' you linked to just makes me sad.

And the top money making game in the world has initials that begin and end with W and it does not work on a console.

Good point. There is Steam but there are plenty of others. Direct2Drive and others.
 

theogt

Surrealist
Messages
45,846
Reaction score
5,912
arglebargle;3872417 said:
Theogt, your theory about consoles being 95% of the game sales is torpedoed by the fact that there is no accurate count of the number of games sold by digital download. Steam does not release their sales numbers and they are the big dog of digital delivery. Retail, brick and morter sales of PC games are down, but then none of those places are catering to the PC crowd, in part, because of the inability to leverage the second hand market.

I have the opposite personal experiance here: Few people I know play console games (most don't have one) but they do game on PC. The only exception is my 20 yo nephew and his friends, who play on both.

That list of 'Top Games' you linked to just makes me sad.

And the top money making game in the world has initials that begin and end with W and it does not work on a console.
Industry aggregates, regardless of industry, almost never have complete information. This isn't news and isn't a point worth making.

The reality is, regardless of source, PC gaming is a niche market. I'm sure most niche market customers think their products are the best and consider themselves "truists."
 
Messages
3,013
Reaction score
586
theogt;3872363 said:
Or not. To be honest, outside of people I read about on the internet (i.e., in this thread), I don't really know anyone that games on a PC anymore. The limited number of people I do know that are gamers use consoles. This is supported by sales statistics too. PC gaming sales account for about 5% of gaming sales. The other 95% are consoles. But what do 95% of the gaming population know? Clearly they're not as enlightened as the 5% and cannot see the value of the PC. Either that or you're full of it.

I use neither, by the way.

As I said before, owning all platforms is the only way to get all the great gaming experiences, but I just had to quote this to ask you if you seriously just said you don't know anybody who games on a PC?

Remember that game World of Warcraft thats latest expansion set the day 1 sales record for a game? Yeah, with the 10 million plus players? That's a PC game. Diablo 2 might be the most popular game of all time. Starcraft, Starcraft 2, etc. Some of the biggest games of all time are PC exclusive.
 

YosemiteSam

Unfriendly and Aloof!
Messages
45,858
Reaction score
22,194
CowboysZone LOYAL Fan
10 year old kids don't buy gaming PCs and therefore don't buy many PC games. They get consoles for Christmas. Kids (under 18) are the biggest consumers of video games and the market reflects that.

Most 10 year old kids probably couldn't handle the most advanced PC games anyway.
 

tupperware

A Plastic Container
Messages
7,273
Reaction score
93
theogt;3872693 said:
Industry aggregates, regardless of industry, almost never have complete information. This isn't news and isn't a point worth making.

The reality is, regardless of source, PC gaming is a niche market. I'm sure most niche market customers think their products are the best and consider themselves "truists."
I've provided reasons why PC gaming is superior. The only thing you've done is said one sells more which doesn't make it superior, just popular.

If you think a cut down version of games that go from PC to console is superior, be my guest. If you think that less graphics quality is superior, be my guest.

It might be good for the masses because it's simple and accessible but there is no way it's superior. I know from experience.
 
Top