I just have to ask...

[Common Sense]

I don't have time to look anything up myself, but I've been wondering -- wasn't Rob Ryan the DC for Oakland when Norv took over? And if that's the case, weren't they absolutely horrendous on defense that year?

So how was Rob Ryan able to put together the... what is it? ...#3 defense in the league this year under Art Shell? If Turner is hired, are we just expected to outscore everyone week in and week out?

I wasn't old enough to follow Norv when he was with the Commanders, but his record is, well, far less than impressive. What seemed to be the problem with his teams? Was it defense?



EDIT: Nevermind, Wikipedia and pro-football-reference.com told me everything I needed to know.

 

[tomson75]

I don't have time to look anything up myself, but I've been wondering -- wasn't Rob Ryan the DC for Oakland when Norv took over? And if that's the case, weren't they absolutely horrendous on defense that year?

So how was Rob Ryan able to put together the... what is it? ...#3 defense in the league this year under Art Shell? If Turner is hired, are we just expected to outscore everyone week in and week out?

I wasn't old enough to follow Norv when he was with the Commanders, but his record is, well, far less than impressive. What seemed to be the problem with his teams? Was it defense?

I'm not really picking up what you're putting down here, but as far as Ryan goes...he has been the DC in Oakland since '04 IIRC. While they were horrid his first year, he has managed to put together a very respected defensive unit over there in three years.

As far as Turner goes (and I'll go on record as not wanting him here as HC), his prior failures as a HC may have had as much to do with the organizations he coached for (Snyder, Davis) as much as it did hid ability to coach...precisely why we don't need him here either.

 

[Common Sense]

Norv didn't work for Snyder. He worked for Jack Kent Cooke, whose teams won 3 Superbowls with Joe Gibbs at the helm.

From what I've read so far, the only thing wrong with the Commanders organization from 1994-2000 was the head coach. Statistically, nearly every year Norv's been a HC, he's had mediocre offenses and pretty poor defenses. And this is the guy who is supposed to fix our problems on D?

 

[5Stars]

From what I've read so far, the only thing wrong with the Commanders organization from 1994-2000 was the head coach.

No...what went wrong with the RedStinks is that Snyder purchased the team!

 

[Common Sense]

Snyder didn't own the team until 1999, according to Wikipedia.

 

[5Stars]

Snyder didn't own the team until 1999, according to Wikipedia.

I still blame him...

 

[Phoenix-Talon]

I still blame him...

You are wise beyond comprehension.

 

[alancdc]

I'm not really picking up what you're putting down here, but as far as Ryan goes...he has been the DC in Oakland since '04 IIRC. While they were horrid his first year, he has managed to put together a very respected defensive unit over there in three years.

As far as Turner goes (and I'll go on record as not wanting him here as HC), his prior failures as a HC may have had as much to do with the organizations he coached for (Snyder, Davis) as much as it did hid ability to coach...precisely why we don't need him here either.

I don't disagree with this at all. I wonder who his QB's were at WASHINGTON? I honestly don't remember, Shuler, George, Brad Johnson? I throw out the Raiders as a hopeless situation to win in until Davis is gone.

 

[5Stars]

You are wise beyond comprehension.

Who's talking to you! Crawl back in that hole of yours...

You don't want me to insult you, stay away. Go pimp that loser team of yours somewhere else...

:lombardi:

:trophy:

 

[Cowboy4ever]

I don't disagree with this at all. I wonder who his QB's were at WASHINGTON? I honestly don't remember, Shuler, George, Brad Johnson? I throw out the Raiders as a hopeless situation to win in until Davis is gone.

I agree and I also believe that you could change Raiders to Cowboys and Davis with Jones and it would be just as accurate.

 

[Rack]

Norv didn't work for Snyder.

Norv was fired by Snyder. Can't fire someone unless they work for you.

 

[big dog cowboy]

Norv didn't work for Snyder. He worked for Jack Kent Cooke, whose teams won 3 Superbowls with Joe Gibbs at the helm.

From what I've read so far, the only thing wrong with the Commanders organization from 1994-2000 was the head coach. Statistically, nearly every year Norv's been a HC, he's had mediocre offenses and pretty poor defenses. And this is the guy who is supposed to fix our problems on D?

There are so many things wrong in that post I don't know where to begin.

 

[JohnnyHopkins]

Norv was fired by Snyder. Can't fire someone unless they work for you.

:laugh2:

 

[Henry]

Norv's pre-Snyder Commander years:

1994
3-13
19th offense
26th defense

1995
6-10
16th offense
18th defense

1996
9-7
16th offense
28th defense

1997
8-7-1
19th offense
16th defense

1998
6-10
12th offense
26th defense

During that span he had two different defensive coordinators that I can remember, most notably Mike Nolan from 1997-1999. Norv prefers a bend-but-dont-break defense that doesn't take a lot of chances but doesn't give up the big play. Unfortunately that meant a lot of long back-breaking drives from the other team. Also, the Commanders under Turner were a TERRIBLE second-half team. Once the other team figured his game-plan out he was unable to adjust, which is also probably why Norv had a losing record against every single NFC East team ... including the Cardinals ... during his stint in Washington.

 

[JohnnyHopkins]

Norv's pre-Snyder Commander years:

1994
3-13
19th offense
26th defense

1995
6-10
16th offense
18th defense

1996
9-7
16th offense
28th defense

1997
8-7-1
19th offense
16th defense

1998
6-10
12th offense
26th defense

During that span he had two different defensive coordinators that I can remember, most notably Mike Nolan from 1997-1999. Norv prefers a bend-but-dont-break defense that doesn't take a lot of chances but doesn't give up the big play. Unfortunately that meant a lot of long back-breaking drives from the other team. Also, the Commanders under Turner were a TERRIBLE second-half team. Once the other team figured his game-plan out he was unable to adjust, which is also probably why Norv had a losing record against every single NFC East team ... including the Cardinals ... during his stint in Washington.

So Norv ruined the Commanders, eh? Well, that's yet another good reason for Cowboys fans to love Norv!

 

[Common Sense]

Norv was fired by Snyder. Can't fire someone unless they work for you.

Ok, you got me. Norv worked for Snyder in 1999, and was fired before the conclusion of the 2000 season.

Before Daniel Snyder, Norv was 32-47 with the Skins and had yet to qualify for the playoffs.

While we're at it, I don't see why so many excuses are being made for his stint with the Raiders. When he was hired, they were just a year removed from playing the Super Bowl.

The Raiders didn't become the joke they are today until two years under Turner and a year under Art Shell.

 

[Ratmatt]

I don't have time to look anything up myself, but I've been wondering -- wasn't Rob Ryan the DC for Oakland when Norv took over? And if that's the case, weren't they absolutely horrendous on defense that year?

So how was Rob Ryan able to put together the... what is it? ...#3 defense in the league this year under Art Shell? If Turner is hired, are we just expected to outscore everyone week in and week out?

I wasn't old enough to follow Norv when he was with the Commanders, but his record is, well, far less than impressive. What seemed to be the problem with his teams? Was it defense?



EDIT: Nevermind, Wikipedia and pro-football-reference.com told me everything I needed to know.

Rob Ryan ran the 3-4 defense his first year at oakland,and they were horrible.They had Warren Sapp at defensive end,no one adjusted to it,it was a disaster.He changed it back to a 4-3 the next year,and they added a few guys,and turned out to be a pretty good defense.

 

[Alexander]

There are so many things wrong in that post I don't know where to begin.

The bulk of Turner's failures were pre-Snyder. Like it or not.

 

[SkinsHokieFan]

Its incredible this myth that Snyder ruined Turner

Norv's best years in Washington were under Snyder

He was 17-12 under Dan, and 32-47 pre-Dan Snyder

The stinking rot of the organization from 1994-1999 was Norv Turner

Collapses from 7-1 in 1996, 5-3 in 1997 and an inexplicable 0-7 start in 1998

All BEFORE Dan Snyder took over the Washington Commanders

His D coordinators were Ron Lynn from 1994-1996, Mike Nolan from 1997-1999 and Ray Rhodes in 2000

 

[JohnnyHopkins]

Its incredible this myth that Snyder ruined Turner

Norv's best years in Washington were under Snyder

He was 17-12 under Dan, and 32-47 pre-Dan Snyder

The stinking rot of the organization from 1994-1999 was Norv Turner

Collapses from 7-1 in 1996, 5-3 in 1997 and an inexplicable 0-7 start in 1998

All BEFORE Dan Snyder took over the Washington Commanders

His D coordinators were Ron Lynn from 1994-1996, Mike Nolan from 1997-1999 and Ray Rhodes in 2000

Yes, Norv Turner was good for Dallas Long after he left town!