Lack of pass rush

[Galian Beast]

A lot of people have stated that they are worried about our lack of pass rush.

It's a worthwhile and logical concern, but please remember that the following players are currently out:

Anthony Spencer, DeMarcus Lawrence, and George Selvie... right there is our 3 top outside pass rushers.

Assuming they can come back and contribute in a timely fashion, we should see much upgraded performance on the line. Many of the defensive ends we're seeing now won't even make the team let alone start.

 

[perrykemp]

Those top 3 pass rushers you listed is EXACTLY why the whole defense could potentially be terrible. The pessimistic viewpoint is:

• IF Spencer comes back from micro-fracture surgery on his knee, a surgery that can be career ending, and he doesn't show his general age (turns 31 before the Superbowl), then maybe he can contribute. Keep in mind he has never really play any regular season games as a 4-3 DE -- his only season with double digit sacks came as a 3-4 OLB.
• Demarcus Lawrence --WHEN he comes back sometime towards the middle of the season he will be a rookie who has missed almost all of training camp. He might be able to contribute something but the more likely scenario is they use him as an occasional 3rd down pass rusher and work him into the line-up.
• George Selvie -- do the Cowboys get the Selvie who averaged less than 0.5 sacks per season in his first 4 year years in the league or the guy who managed 7 last season? Of these 3 guys this is the player I most expect to provide a consistent pass rush -- I believe he'll be as good as last year, however, who knows. He is a quintessential NFL journeyman (4 teams in 5 years) and these kinds of players can be wildly up and down from year to year. I do believe Marinelli will get the most out of him, however.

 

[casmith07]

Melton didn't play either. Crawford played like 5 snaps and didn't do anything but outside rush the whole time.

It'll come. There will be growing pains, but the foundation is being laid.

 

[burmafrd]

Melton didn't play either. Crawford played like 5 snaps and didn't do anything but outside rush the whole time.

It'll come. There will be growing pains, but the foundation is being laid.

is it a solid foundation? That certainly is arguable.

 

[CyberB0b]

It'll come. There will be growing pains, but the foundation is being laid.

 

[burmafrd]

Both Selvie and Spencer each only had ONE YEAR where they really produced when looking at their career's prior stats. So if a guy does it one out of six like Spencer, you are assuming that he keeps producing at a rate that the odds show are only likely to happen 16% of the time.

 

[Idgit]

Those top 3 pass rushers you listed is EXACTLY why the whole defense could potentially be terrible. The pessimistic viewpoint is:

• IF Spencer comes back from micro-fracture surgery on his knee, a surgery that can be career ending, and he doesn't show his general age (turns 31 before the Superbowl), then maybe he can contribute. Keep in mind he has never really play any regular season games as a 4-3 DE -- his only season with double digit sacks came as a 3-4 OLB.
• Demarcus Lawrence --WHEN he comes back sometime towards the middle of the season he will be a rookie who has missed almost all of training camp. He might be able to contribute something but the more likely scenario is they use him as an occasional 3rd down pass rusher and work him into the line-up.
• George Selvie -- do the Cowboys get the Selvie who averaged less than 0.5 sacks per season in his first 4 year years in the league or the guy who managed 7 last season? Of these 3 guys this is the player I most expect to provide a consistent pass rush -- I believe he'll be as good as last year, however, who knows. He is a quintessential NFL journeyman (4 teams in 5 years) and these kinds of players can be wildly up and down from year to year. I do believe Marinelli will get the most out of him, however.

Everybody knows I'm a positive guy generally. Or I keep quiet, but I think this is right. We're going to be challenged to field a pass rush this season with the down personnel. We might be able to apply some pressure or make a guy move around a bit, but we don't have adequate pressure personnel. Lawrence is maybe our best bet of those listed, and he's a rookie second rounder.

I'd add Melton to that list, and Crawford, but you're only going to get so much pressure from those guys. Other than that, we're blitzing the WIL and secondary selectively and hoping to context catches aggressively on the back end.

 

[DallasEast]

If-and-until the defense can add true pass rushers to the mix, I hope Rod Marinelli will modify his defense to compensate in two ways. First, he should implement more cornerback/safety zone blitzes on passing downs. It will weaken pass coverage somewhat, but will give opposing quarterbacks something to consider in terms of true pressure during their dropbacks.

Second, the first level of rushing defense should be emphasized. Even with young defensive linemen involved, it is easier to teach and expect tackles and ends to react to the run than to the pass. If successful, it would cut into the first down conversion rate by subtracting some outlandish runs during drives. The potential is still there for opposing offenses to light up the first down stats via the air like New Orleans and Chicago last season. However, a drop in first down runs could give the ball back to our offense quicker, thus increasing our opportunities to put more points on the board.

 

[LatinMind]

A lot of people have stated that they are worried about our lack of pass rush.

It's a worthwhile and logical concern, but please remember that the following players are currently out:

Anthony Spencer, DeMarcus Lawrence, and George Selvie... right there is our 3 top outside pass rushers.

Assuming they can come back and contribute in a timely fashion, we should see much upgraded performance on the line. Many of the defensive ends we're seeing now won't even make the team let alone start.

Not to mention Melton and McClain didnt play.

 

[xwalker]

A lot of people have stated that they are worried about our lack of pass rush.

It's a worthwhile and logical concern, but please remember that the following players are currently out:

Anthony Spencer, DeMarcus Lawrence, and George Selvie... right there is our 3 top outside pass rushers.

Assuming they can come back and contribute in a timely fashion, we should see much upgraded performance on the line. Many of the defensive ends we're seeing now won't even make the team let alone start.

People will scoff, but Terrell McClain could be as important as anybody.

Marinelli's DL scheme will not work with Nick Hayden as the 1-tech, IMO. When the 1-tech fails to draw a double team or fail to get any pressure when single blocked, it screws up the ability of the other DL to get to the QB.

Terrell McClain was good against both the run and a pass rusher last season in Houston. If he can get healthy and be a legit 1-tech, then the other 3 DL will have a chance to function. Terrell McClain was very raw as a rookie back in 2011, but he looked like a completely different player last season as the backup NT and occasional Nickel pass rushing DT.

I think Ken Bishop is better than Hayden, but he's very raw. If T. McClain is not healthy, they might have to give Crawford some snaps at the 1-tech. He's better suited for the 3-tech or LDE position, but he would be better than Hayden at 1-tech, IMO.

 

[Future]

Both Selvie and Spencer each only had ONE YEAR where they really produced when looking at their career's prior stats. So if a guy does it one out of six like Spencer, you are assuming that he keeps producing at a rate that the odds show are only likely to happen 16% of the time.

Spencer's low sack numbers are as much the result of him being asked to play coverage quite a bit, as much as anything.

He's always been on par with Ware in terms of pressures per rush attempts.

 

[rpntex]

Both Selvie and Spencer each only had ONE YEAR where they really produced when looking at their career's prior stats. So if a guy does it one out of six like Spencer, you are assuming that he keeps producing at a rate that the odds show are only likely to happen 16% of the time.

You'd have a better point if he'd had his best year several years ago, followed by 3 mediocre years. But, as it was, he had three decent years (relative for a Sam LB), then a breakout year. It can be argued that he was trending up.

The Sam LB in a 3-4, as Spencer played, doesn't get a lot of sack opportunities. He plays in coverage better than 50% of the time. The fact that he still tallied 6, 5, and 6 sacks in the years prior to 2012 is a credit to how well he played, rather than it being a knock. 2012 was just what people say it was, a "career" year. It's not likely he'd have another year like that as a SLB. At DE, however, I would think 10 sacks are a possibility, if he's capable of making the transition to DE at all.

Same can be said of Melton. His last full year was his best. It can be argued that he's on the come, improving each year.

Time will tell for both of them.

 

[lostar2009]

Although the guys who played are not the starters they WILL BE OUR ROTATION...they didn't do nothing. The 2nd string, 3rd string nothing.

 

[JoeyBoy718]

Spencer's low sack numbers are as much the result of him being asked to play coverage quite a bit, as much as anything.

He's always been on par with Ware in terms of pressures per rush attempts.

I agree. The disrespect for Spencer is ridiculous. People only consider elite to be double digit sacks. The guy was a strong side OLB in the 3-4. His sack numbers throughout his career were comparable to the best 3-4 SOLBs in the league. And his play against the run was always second to none. The guy was a top 3 SOLB his whole career before having his career year.

But I agree, he's coming off micro surgery and switching to the 4-3, so I have no expectations for him.

 

[Future]

I agree. The disrespect for Spencer is ridiculous. People only consider elite to be double digit sacks. The guy was a strong side OLB in the 3-4. His sack numbers throughout his career were comparable to the best 3-4 SOLBs in the league. And his play against the run was always second to none. The guy was a top 3 SOLB his whole career before having his career year.

But I agree, he's coming off micro surgery and switching to the 4-3, so I have no expectations for him.

Well yea, of course there is that. I don't really expect him to do anything to be honest, but that has nothing to do with his past performances.

 

[TheDude]

People will scoff, but Terrell McClain could be as important as anybody.

Marinelli's DL scheme will not work with Nick Hayden as the 1-tech, IMO. When the 1-tech fails to draw a double team or fail to get any pressure when single blocked, it screws up the ability of the other DL to get to the QB.

Terrell McClain was good against both the run and a pass rusher last season in Houston. If he can get healthy and be a legit 1-tech, then the other 3 DL will have a chance to function. Terrell McClain was very raw as a rookie back in 2011, but he looked like a completely different player last season as the backup NT and occasional Nickel pass rushing DT.

I think Ken Bishop is better than Hayden, but he's very raw. If T. McClain is not healthy, they might have to give Crawford some snaps at the 1-tech. He's better suited for the 3-tech or LDE position, but he would be better than Hayden at 1-tech, IMO.

This is a serious question.

Has there been many/any players who can play 3 spots along the dline consistently? The techniques are quite different (leverage, hand battle turns, gap responsibility). I have seen many posts arguing that x player CAN play ( I read effectively) any position. This would seem to be reserved for the elitest of elites. I can see a 1 to 3 or vice versa, but then to sde with lde capabilities?

 

[perrykemp]

Terrell McClain was good against both the run and a pass rusher last season in Houston.

I'm curious on how you have come to that conclusion. I didn't watch the Texans play, however, the stat sheet says McClain had 10 tackles and 0 sacks in 16 games played. Looking at <just> the stats, it looks like a completely un-noteworthy season to me.

 

[BlindFaith]

Those top 3 pass rushers you listed is EXACTLY why the whole defense could potentially be terrible. The pessimistic viewpoint is:

• IF Spencer comes back from micro-fracture surgery on his knee, a surgery that can be career ending, and he doesn't show his general age (turns 31 before the Superbowl), then maybe he can contribute. Keep in mind he has never really play any regular season games as a 4-3 DE -- his only season with double digit sacks came as a 3-4 OLB.
• Demarcus Lawrence --WHEN he comes back sometime towards the middle of the season he will be a rookie who has missed almost all of training camp. He might be able to contribute something but the more likely scenario is they use him as an occasional 3rd down pass rusher and work him into the line-up.
• George Selvie -- do the Cowboys get the Selvie who averaged less than 0.5 sacks per season in his first 4 year years in the league or the guy who managed 7 last season? Of these 3 guys this is the player I most expect to provide a consistent pass rush -- I believe he'll be as good as last year, however, who knows. He is a quintessential NFL journeyman (4 teams in 5 years) and these kinds of players can be wildly up and down from year to year. I do believe Marinelli will get the most out of him, however.

Selvie now has actual game tape on him. It doesn't take long for DC's and Oline coaches to figure guys out. Last year he just showed up and was an unknown. He started out well, but was invisible the last 6 games or so of the season. Don't expect the same results from Selvie as last year.

 

[JoeyBoy718]

This is a serious question.

Has there been many/any players who can play 3 spots along the dline consistently? The techniques are quite different (leverage, hand battle turns, gap responsibility). I have seen many posts arguing that x player CAN play ( I read effectively) any position. This would seem to be reserved for the elitest of elites. I can see a 1 to 3 or vice versa, but then to sde with lde capabilities?

Good point. I'll give you an example. Can Mackenzy Bernadeau play LG, C and RG effectively? Yep. Do you need to be looking for an upgrade if he's in the starting lineup? Yep.

Sounds like we have a D-line full of Bernadeaus.

 

[CyberB0b]

I'm curious on how you have come to that conclusion. I didn't watch the Texans play, however, the stat sheet says McClain had 10 tackles and 0 sacks in 16 games played. Looking at <just> the stats, it looks like a completely un-noteworthy season to me.

Not to mention the fact that he hasn't started a game since 2011, and will be switching schemes.