Twitter: La'el Collins on his future position

[OmerV]

Man, I just don't agree at all. I mean, there are some players who absolutely do not have a vote. Then, there are some players, because of talent level or contractual leverage who absolutely do.

I think Collins falls within the latter of the two.

The real problem, as I see it, is that if you say Flemming is the new RT and Collins is moving to Guard, then you still have the same problem with Swing Tackle. We still don't have one and that's the problem we had last year. Probably cost us a couple of games.

I guess we will agree to disagree.

I accept that the thoughts of some players carries more weight than others, but Collins isn't even at the top of the Cowboys O-Line unit - he's 4th in line. Even so, the reality is leaders can't lead if they allow the troops to dictate to them. Many people already don't think Garrett is a strong enough leader, and I myself think there is some truth to that, and what you are asking is for him to prove that by letting the players tell him how to run the team. Coaches have to make tough decisions at times - sometimes much tougher than just a position move (like benching or cutting a player) - and they can't do that if they tiptoe around players, scared to hurt their feelings.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I guess we will agree to disagree.

I accept that the thoughts of some players carries more weight than others, but Collins isn't even at the top of the Cowboys O-Line unit - he's 4th in line. Even so, the reality is leaders can't lead if they allow the troops to dictate to them. Many people already don't think Garrett is a strong enough leader, and I myself think there is some truth to that, and what you are asking is for him to prove that by letting the players tell him how to run the team. Coaches have to make tough decisions at times - sometimes much tougher than just a position move (like benching or cutting a player) - and they can't do that if they tiptoe around players, scared to hurt their feelings.

I think, in terms of leverage, it goes Martin, then Collins. Smith and Fredbeard are already locked up so I definitely think Collins has more leverage at this point.

To be clear, I'm not asking for anything. I'm simply explaining how it works in the modern NFL, with this team. I would also say this, it starts at the top. The way the Cowboys negotiate with players comes from how Jerry set precedence. I can't really hang this on Garrett.

 

[OmerV]

I think, in terms of leverage, it goes Martin, then Collins. Smith and Fredbeard are already locked up so I definitely think Collins has more leverage at this point.

To be clear, I'm not asking for anything. I'm simply explaining how it works in the modern NFL, with this team. I would also say this, it starts at the top. The way the Cowboys negotiate with players comes from how Jerry set precedence. I can't really hang this on Garrett.

I'm confused, are you now saying they can't move him because the Cowboys have a culture stemming from Jerry Jones that allows players to dictate to the coaches? It seemed before you were saying it would be wrong to move him, not that it is just how the Cowboys operate.

In any case, Collins is locked up for the next 2 seasons, so there is no current negotiation, and Collins is not a perennial Pro-Bowl/All Pro player that has earned the right to have as much of a say as you think he should have. Besides, the point of signing players is to use them in a way that best helps the team, so what's the point if a coach is just going to bow down and let the player do what he wants without regard for what the team needs?

Something else to note is that when Collins signed his contract extension he had never even played a down for the Cowboys at RT - he had been a LG for 2 years. He understood that he could end up as an OG.

And it's not as if the Cowboys haven't moved people around before. Free changed positions. Byron Jones changed positions, and may be changing back. Sean Lee changed positions. David Irving. Tyron Crawford. You act as if the Cowboys are letting everyone else dictate their positions to the team, but there is no evidence for that.

 

[condoin125]

Collins is not a tackle, please move him back to LG and find a RT.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I'm confused, are you now saying they can't move him because the Cowboys have a culture stemming from Jerry Jones that allows players to dictate to the coaches? It seemed before you were saying it would be wrong to move him, not that it is just how the Cowboys operate.

In any case, Collins is locked up for the next 2 seasons, so there is no current negotiation, and Collins is not a perennial Pro-Bowl/All Pro player that has earned the right to have as much of a say as you think he should have. Besides, the point of signing players is to use them in a way that best helps the team, so what's the point if a coach is just going to bow down and let the player do what he wants without regard for what the team needs?

Something else to note is that when Collins signed his contract extension he had never even played a down for the Cowboys at RT - he had been a LG for 2 years. He understood that he could end up as an OG.

And it's not as if the Cowboys haven't moved people around before. Free changed positions. Byron Jones changed positions, and may be changing back. Sean Lee changed positions. David Irving. Tyron Crawford. You act as if the Cowboys are letting everyone else dictate their positions to the team, but there is no evidence for that.

Yes, that's what I'm saying but more over, I'm saying this dynamic works for every team, all over the league. Teams have no leverage over players until they are signed.

It's true, Collins has never played RT before but that's all the more reason he has leverage. For his first year there, he did really, really well and he's only going to get better. Free changed positions to the only position he could play. RT. Byron Jones has almost been ruined by position change. Lee changed positions and was on the shelf every single time. Irving plays two positions. He slides in on pass rushing situations. That's not really a position change. Crawford? Who cares? Which of those players has had leverage over the Cowboys in a contract situation? None of them.

What I'm telling you is that players do dictate and they have for a very long time. There is ample evidence of this IMO but I will not argue the point with you. I will simply say, as I said earlier, unless you intend to hand out another really large contract at Guard (assuming we sign Martin) then Collins is going to leave once you move him. You are either going to force another big contract at Guard and another big contract at RT to replace Collins or your going to allow him to walk. If you over extend at Guard again, the cap implications are very, very bad. If you don't, then you probably live with less talent along the OL.

 

[OmerV]

Yes, that's what I'm saying but more over, I'm saying this dynamic works for every team, all over the league. Teams have no leverage over players until they are signed.

It's true, Collins has never played RT before but that's all the more reason he has leverage. For his first year there, he did really, really well and he's only going to get better. Free changed positions to the only position he could play. RT. Byron Jones has almost been ruined by position change. Lee changed positions and was on the shelf every single time. Irving plays two positions. He slides in on pass rushing situations. That's not really a position change. Crawford? Who cares? Which of those players has had leverage over the Cowboys in a contract situation? None of them.

What I'm telling you is that players do dictate and they have for a very long time. There is ample evidence of this IMO but I will not argue the point with you. I will simply say, as I said earlier, unless you intend to hand out another really large contract at Guard (assuming we sign Martin) then Collins is going to leave once you move him. You are either going to force another big contract at Guard and another big contract at RT to replace Collins or your going to allow him to walk. If you over extend at Guard again, the cap implications are very, very bad. If you don't, then you probably live with less talent along the OL.

Collins is signed though. You keep acting as if the team has to bow down to him or he will walk, but he can't walk for 2 seasons. If he's not willing to do what helps the team, let him walk. Other players change positions, re-work contracts to make cap space etc ... if he isn't willing to compromise a little to make a better team, then let him play out his 2 years and let him walk out the door. Besides all that, how would it help the Cowboys negotiating position to set the precedent that the player can override the team anyway?

Frankly, I suspect you aren't giving him enough credit anyway. I understand he would prefer to stay at RT, but I doubt he will consider it a knife in the back if the team tells him the O-Line will be better if he moves back to LG.

I really just don't understand the viewpoint that a coach shouldn't be able to set the lineup or make tough decisions without the players approval. That's absolutely contrary to how any successful team functions, and would absolutely negate any chance a coach would have to be successful.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Collins is signed though. You keep acting as if the team has to bow down to him or he will walk, but he can't walk for 2 seasons. If he's not willing to do what helps the team, let him walk. Other players change positions, re-work contracts to make cap space etc ... if it's all about him and nothing about the team, then let him play out his 2 years and let him walk out the door.

I really just don't understand the viewpoint that a coach cannot set the lineup without the players approval. That's absolutely contrary to how any successful team functions.

Collins has said that he intends to stay at RT. The team will try to negotiate his contract this year because they really don't want him going into his final year, unsigned. If that happens, the Cowboys are at a real disadvantage in negotiations. You act like you've never watched how this works in the NFL. You don't plan your cap a season at a time. Now is when you do it and really, you should be planning for this before you ever resigned him. If you feel like players need to be willing to do whatever helps the team, as opposed to whatever helps their own personal financial situation, I applaud you but I will also tell you that you live in a dream world. Some players do do this but most do not and they haven't for a very long time. Get used to it because those days are gone and they aren't ever coming back. Martin is holding out for the highest paid Contract for an OG in NFL History. Should we just offer him a contract that is under market value and expect him to accept it or should we just say, OK, see ya around and go bring in a scrub to play RG for us? It just doesn't work that way.

 

[OmerV]

Collins has said that he intends to stay at RT. The team will try to negotiate his contract this year because they really don't want him going into his final year, unsigned. If that happens, the Cowboys are at a real disadvantage in negotiations. You act like you've never watched how this works in the NFL. You don't plan your cap a season at a time. Now is when you do it and really, you should be planning for this before you ever resigned him. If you feel like players need to be willing to do whatever helps the team, as opposed to whatever helps their own personal financial situation, I applaud you but I will also tell you that you live in a dream world. Some players do do this but most do not and they haven't for a very long time. Get used to it because those days are gone and they aren't ever coming back. Martin is holding out for the highest paid Contract for an OG in NFL History. Should we just offer him a contract that is under market value and expect him to accept it or should we just say, OK, see ya around and go bring in a scrub to play RG for us? It just doesn't work that way.

And the Cowboys have said they are open to the idea of moving him back to OG .... and Collins has said that he is willing to do what is best for the team, but is now focused on his current position.

At the end of the day, no team is successful by trying to make everyone happy and only taking the path of least resistance. A fact of life in the NFL is players don't always get to do what they want to do.

And no, the team doesn't plan the cap a season at a time, but that doesn't mean they bow down to every good player that has a contract coming up in a couple of years, or in the meantime, ignore what will make the team better in favor of keeping one player happy. Hell, with the money tied up in Smith, Frederick and probably Martin they may not be able to afford another contract with Collins anyway. The way it works is teams looks at cap space, priorities, and situations, and if a player isn't willing to compromise and work with the coaches for the betterment of the team, then they may well drop a few notches on the priority list.

And, again, at the end of the day, no team is successful if the coaches cannot make the tough decisions they need to make, or if the players are allowed to override those decisions.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

And the Cowboys have said they are open to the idea of moving him back to OG .... and Collins has said that he is willing to do what is best for the team, but is now focused on his current position.

At the end of the day, no team is successful by trying to make everyone happy and only taking the path of least resistance. A fact of life in the NFL is players don't always get to do what they want to do.

And no, the team doesn't plan the cap a season at a time, but that doesn't mean they bow down to every good player that has a contract coming up in a couple of years, or in the meantime, ignore what will make the team better in favor of keeping one player happy. Hell, with the money tied up in Smith, Frederick and probably Martin they may not be able to afford another contract with Collins anyway. The way it works is teams looks at cap space, priorities, and situations, and if a player isn't willing to compromise and work with the coaches for the betterment of the team, then they may well drop a few notches on the priority list.

And, again, at the end of the day, no team is successful if the coaches cannot make the tough decisions they need to make, or if the players are allowed to override those decisions.

How far do you think Martin is going to drop on the old priority list? That's not how it works, that's just fan speak. If Smith, once again, drops his load on the back, how far do you think Collins will drop on that priority list?

We don't agree at all. It's cool......

 

[OmerV]

How far do you think Martin is going to drop on the old priority list? That's not how it works, that's just fan speak. If Smith, once again, drops his load on the back, how far do you think Collins will drop on that priority list?

We don't agree at all. It's cool......

Martin is just negotiating a contract, not refusing to listen to coaches or do what is asked of him, so that's not remotely the same thing. Every team deals with that and understands it. But every team does not let the players run the ship and dictate to the coaches what is best for the team. No successful team does.

Let me ask you this ... suppose we feel we have a reasonable option at RT, but don't have a good option at LG, and still don't move Collins, and then LG is an ongoing problem, with Dak getting hit regularly, maybe hurt, and Elliott getting stuffed regularly, maybe hurt. Do you expect anyone in that case to say the Cowboys did the right thing by letting Collins override the needs of the team?

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Martin is just negotiating a contract, not refusing to listen to coaches or do what is asked of him, so that's not remotely the same thing. Every team deals with that and understands it. But every team does not let the players run the ship and dictate to the coaches what is best for the team. No successful team does.

Let me ask you this ... suppose we feel we have a reasonable option at RT, but don't have a good option at LG, and still don't move Collins, and then LG is an ongoing problem, with Dak getting hit regularly, maybe hurt, and Elliott getting stuffed regularly, maybe hurt. Do you expect anyone in that case to say the Cowboys did the right thing by letting Collins override the needs of the team?

I never once said that Collins would not listen or refuse. I said that when his contract is up, you will either have to pay him a huge contract to play Guard or you will have to let him walk because he will go where the money is. He's not going to play for less money then he could otherwise play for at RT. The only team that I know of, that doesn't do it that way is New England and that's only because they have the best Coach, maybe ever and the Best QB, maybe ever, who has been willing to play on contracts that are seriously undervalued in the market.

Your argument is a straw man because you can just as easily have that scenario play out at RT. We actually saw that happen with Tony for years.

 

[OmerV]

I never once said that Collins would not listen or refuse. I said that when his contract is up, you will either have to pay him a huge contract to play Guard or you will have to let him walk because he will go where the money is. He's not going to play for less money then he could otherwise play for at RT. The only team that I know of, that doesn't do it that way is New England and that's only because they have the best Coach, maybe ever and the Best QB, maybe ever, who has been willing to play on contracts that are seriously undervalued in the market.

Your argument is a straw man because you can just as easily have that scenario play out at RT. We actually saw that happen with Tony for years.

I thought it was about letting him play where he wants. Then it was about the Cowboys having a culture of letting the players dictate to the coaches, and it's not Garrett's fault it's that way because Jerry is the one that created it. Now it's about not wanting to pay a big contract to an OG.

Regardless of which it is, the needs of the team still override the desires of the one, and setting the precedent that players can override coaches would ensure the needs of the team are never met.

As for that scenario playing out for years at RT when Romo was playing, that's plain false. Free was our best RT, and there was nobody to move from OG that would have been better, or that wouldn't have caused a severe dropoff at OG by moving. The Cowboys were putting the best line they had on the field.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I thought it was about letting him play where he wants. Then it was about the Cowboys having a culture of letting the players dictate to the coaches, and it's not Garrett's fault it's that way because Jerry is the one that created it. Now it's about not wanting to pay a big contract to an OG.

Regardless of which it is, the needs of the team still override the desires of the one, and setting the precedent that players can override coaches would ensure the needs of the team are never met.

As for that scenario playing out for years at RT when Romo was playing, that's plain false. Free was our best LT, and there was nobody to move from OG that would have been better, or that wouldn't have caused a severe dropoff at OG by moving. The Cowboys were putting the best line they had on the field.

First of all, we don't agree on his position. I believe that he is going to end up being a better RT then he will a LG. While I believe he can be really good at either position, I think that he is showing himself to be a really good RT option for us, right now. We also don't agree on where we have more talent. I think we have two really good starters at tackle now, when healthy. I believe we finally have a really good Swing Tackle but I don't believe we have a LT who can be relied upon to last the season. I believe Smith is going to continue to experience back problems and I believe that we will see him decline more and more. As a result, I don't believe it that we are very deep at that position, in light of Smith's situation.

I believe that the short term is probably weaker at Guard right now but I also believe that there will be depth in this draft that will allow us to shore up that problem and I believe that talent should be available in FA after the draft, for a short term solution. The Cowboys are different then most teams. While most teams value LG more, the Cowboys do not. They place more value on RG because of Martin. Now, if you wanted to, you could easily flip Martin to LG because he can play that position and probably better then Collins but I think you don't need to do that and you certainly don't want to do anything like that, unless you ink him to a new deal or, unless your plan is to let him walk.

The culture of signing players was created by Jerry and it was created long before Garrett became the HC in Dallas. That's just a fact. Players being able to come directly to Jerry instead of their HC was all Jerry. Jerry calling the shots as GM on players is all Jerry. Jerry signing players to long term contracts, releasing players who are under contract with no penalties, simply because they wanted their release, that's all Jerry. I believe that right now, today, Dez would probably be out of Dallas if not for Jerry. I believe that Stephen would have moved him if it were up to him, although I freely admit that I have no proof of that. The Collins pick, itself, was Jerry's call.

It is not a "now it's about" thing. It's always been about cap management for me. Because I spell out the truth of how it's worked in Dallas over these past several years does not represent my personal views on what I believe should happen. From a team management point of view, things should be a lot different IMO. Decisions should be made with regard to cap management as a focus but that's not always how it's worked in years past. The deal with Tony is a perfect example. I do not believe we should have signed him to the deal we did, at the time. I believe we should have traded him and started our rebuild much earlier but that's another story. However, it is an example of how maybe we haven't always looked at cap management as the over riding factor in decisions.

You seem to refuse to accept the reality that players have leverage, until they are signed. The NFL no longer works as it did. Coaches can't simply dictate to players any longer. Cap matters, talent matters and those things play a major role in where players sign. Free was never our best LT, so much as he was our only LT. In 2010 and 2011, he was pretty much our only LT. Columbo was our best OT at that time and he was our RT. We drafted Smith in 2011 and he played RT for us in his Rookie year, because that was the position he played at USC. The very next year, he was moved to LT because that's the position he was drafted for and it allowed him to get a full camp in for the switch. Free was moved to RT at that point, he only ever played LT for two seasons and truth be told, Smith was probably better coming out of the gate the Free was. Free was never a great RT, he was serviceable, at best. In fact, I would go so far as to say that Collins, in his first year, was better at RT then Free was. Free would have gotten eaten up if he would have had to face the pass rushers Collins did last year. Free played in Dallas for 9 seasons, Free started at RT from 2012 till 2016. Tony had guys coming free from the Right side the entire time Free was starting. Free was never good to his inside and he had real problems with power rushers. If you could get into his body and then rip him, you were around him. He struggled with that his entire career. Don't get me wrong, I actually liked Free. He was a guy who made the most out of what his talents were and he never gave up. I can respect that but he was, or should have been, a swing tackle in the NFL IMO. He was perfectly suited for that role.

Now, I've thoroughly explained my position here so there really should be no confusion on where I stand. If we don't agree, then we don't agree and that's fine but we are not going to argue around a straw man here. That's boring and nobody much likes it. It just gets old for everybody.

 

[cern]

who determines what's best for the team? and it's not really who specifically makes the determination but rather how well said person makes that decision. is it the person who said let's take a chance on Gregory and Jaylon with 2nd round picks? or let's bring in greg hardy and see how that works out? if that's the case, it would seem a simple coin flip would work just as well. if la'el really feels most comfortable at the tackle spot, it just might be prudent to let him remain there for no other reason than it's what he wants and ergo, where he'll play at his best. the position du jour strategy didn't work well for tyrone Crawford or Byron jones.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

who determines what's best for the team? and it's not really who specifically makes the determination but rather how well said person makes that decision. is it the person who said let's take a chance on Gregory and Jaylon with 2nd round picks? or let's bring in greg hardy and see how that works out? if that's the case, it would seem a simple coin flip would work just as well. if la'el really feels most comfortable at the tackle spot, it just might be prudent to let him remain there for no other reason than it's what he wants and ergo, where he'll play at his best. the position du jour strategy didn't work well for tyrone Crawford or Byron jones.

He faced a pretty stout group of pass rushers last year and only gave up 5 sacks, in his first season there. I think he has the makings of a pretty good RT but that's just my opinion.

 

[cern]

He faced a pretty stout group of pass rushers last year and only gave up 5 sacks, in his first season there. I think he has the makings of a pretty good RT but that's just my opinion.

early on he disappointed. but by seasons end he was playing the position as good as anyone in the league. the man is coachable and listens and learns. imo, he will keep getting better at rt if allowed to stay there and play.

 

[Klingo3034]

He faced a pretty stout group of pass rushers last year and only gave up 5 sacks, in his first season there. I think he has the makings of a pretty good RT but that's just my opinion.

5 sacks against the best rushers is impressive for first time as OT. Definitely need him for 10 years.

 

[OmerV]

First of all, we don't agree on his position. I believe that he is going to end up being a better RT then he will a LG. While I believe he can be really good at either position, I think that he is showing himself to be a really good RT option for us, right now. We also don't agree on where we have more talent. I think we have two really good starters at tackle now, when healthy. I believe we finally have a really good Swing Tackle but I don't believe we have a LT who can be relied upon to last the season. I believe Smith is going to continue to experience back problems and I believe that we will see him decline more and more. As a result, I don't believe it that we are very deep at that position, in light of Smith's situation.

I believe that the short term is probably weaker at Guard right now but I also believe that there will be depth in this draft that will allow us to shore up that problem and I believe that talent should be available in FA after the draft, for a short term solution. The Cowboys are different then most teams. While most teams value LG more, the Cowboys do not. They place more value on RG because of Martin. Now, if you wanted to, you could easily flip Martin to LG because he can play that position and probably better then Collins but I think you don't need to do that and you certainly don't want to do anything like that, unless you ink him to a new deal or, unless your plan is to let him walk.

The culture of signing players was created by Jerry and it was created long before Garrett became the HC in Dallas. That's just a fact. Players being able to come directly to Jerry instead of their HC was all Jerry. Jerry calling the shots as GM on players is all Jerry. Jerry signing players to long term contracts, releasing players who are under contract with no penalties, simply because they wanted their release, that's all Jerry. I believe that right now, today, Dez would probably be out of Dallas if not for Jerry. I believe that Stephen would have moved him if it were up to him, although I freely admit that I have no proof of that. The Collins pick, itself, was Jerry's call.

It is not a "now it's about" thing. It's always been about cap management for me. Because I spell out the truth of how it's worked in Dallas over these past several years does not represent my personal views on what I believe should happen. From a team management point of view, things should be a lot different IMO. Decisions should be made with regard to cap management as a focus but that's not always how it's worked in years past. The deal with Tony is a perfect example. I do not believe we should have signed him to the deal we did, at the time. I believe we should have traded him and started our rebuild much earlier but that's another story. However, it is an example of how maybe we haven't always looked at cap management as the over riding factor in decisions.

You seem to refuse to accept the reality that players have leverage, until they are signed. The NFL no longer works as it did. Coaches can't simply dictate to players any longer. Cap matters, talent matters and those things play a major role in where players sign. Free was never our best LT, so much as he was our only LT. In 2010 and 2011, he was pretty much our only LT. Columbo was our best OT at that time and he was our RT. We drafted Smith in 2011 and he played RT for us in his Rookie year, because that was the position he played at USC. The very next year, he was moved to LT because that's the position he was drafted for and it allowed him to get a full camp in for the switch. Free was moved to RT at that point, he only ever played LT for two seasons and truth be told, Smith was probably better coming out of the gate the Free was. Free was never a great RT, he was serviceable, at best. In fact, I would go so far as to say that Collins, in his first year, was better at RT then Free was. Free would have gotten eaten up if he would have had to face the pass rushers Collins did last year. Free played in Dallas for 9 seasons, Free started at RT from 2012 till 2016. Tony had guys coming free from the Right side the entire time Free was starting. Free was never good to his inside and he had real problems with power rushers. If you could get into his body and then rip him, you were around him. He struggled with that his entire career. Don't get me wrong, I actually liked Free. He was a guy who made the most out of what his talents were and he never gave up. I can respect that but he was, or should have been, a swing tackle in the NFL IMO. He was perfectly suited for that role.

Now, I've thoroughly explained my position here so there really should be no confusion on where I stand. If we don't agree, then we don't agree and that's fine but we are not going to argue around a straw man here. That's boring and nobody much likes it. It just gets old for everybody.

While you say we don't agree on which position he would be better at, the truth is we don't necessarily disagree on it. I'm not really committed to either - I think the jury was still out at OG and that had he not gotten hurt in 2016 we might have a better feel for it. I thought last year he struggled a little at RT to start the season, but ended up doing a good job. Bottom line is, I don't think we really know.

I will concede that your argument about protection at OT in case Smith continues to have problems has merit, and I agree that would need to be a consideration. That's not to say he couldn't move from OG back to OT if needed, but that's asking a lot and certainly not something you really want to do mid season.

As for the culture of signing players, I don't see what that has to do with Collins changing positions. If the Cowboys overpay or give too long a contract, they can do it whether he is at OG or at OT. If he thinks his value is higher at OT than OG and his asking price is too high, the Cowboys would just have to make the hard decision like every team has to do every year when dealing with a high priced free agent.

As for refusing to acknowledge that a player has leverage until he is signed, that's not true. I absolutely believe they have leverage if they are a free agent, or on the cusp of becoming one. I don't see 2 years from now as being on the cusp of becoming one. I also don't think he can be treated as a "must extend now" kind of player, because he is only 1 season into his last extension, he is only the 4th best player on our O-Line, and very likely by the time he would become a free agent we aren't going to be able to handle another huge O-Line salary on top of Smith, Frederick and Martin anyway.

As for Free not being our best LT, I accidently indicated LT when I meant RT, so that's a different matter. But sticking with LT for a moment, even if he was our only LT, he was still our best. You can't replace a guy with someone that isn't even on the team.

As for Free at RT, if, as you say, we had the same scenario with Free for years as the scenario I mentioned above, then you are going to have to explain which OG we had that could have moved into Free's RT spot that would have been better, and who would have replaced that OG once he moved. If you can't come up with those answers, or if you can and those answers don't indicate there would have been a better O-Line as a result, then your claim that we had the same scenario I mentioned is wrong.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

While you say we don't agree on which position he would be better at, the truth is we don't necessarily disagree on it. I'm not really committed to either - I think the jury was still out at OG and that had he not gotten hurt in 2016 we might have a better feel for it. I thought last year he struggled a little at RT to start the season, but ended up doing a good job. Bottom line is, I don't think we really know.

I will concede that your argument about protection at OT in case Smith continues to have problems has merit, and I agree that would need to be a consideration. That's not to say he couldn't move from OG back to OT if needed, but that's asking a lot and certainly not something you really want to do mid season.

As for the culture of signing players, I don't see what that has to do with Collins changing positions. If the Cowboys overpay or give too long a contract, they can do it whether he is at OG or at OT. If he thinks his value is higher at OT than OG and his asking price is too high, the Cowboys would just have to make the hard decision like every team has to do every year when dealing with a high priced free agent.

As for refusing to acknowledge that a player has leverage until he is signed, that's not true. I absolutely believe they have leverage if they are a free agent, or on the cusp of becoming one. I don't see 2 years from now as being on the cusp of becoming one. I also don't think he can be treated as a "must extend now" kind of player, because he is only 1 season into his last extension, he is only the 4th best player on our O-Line, and very likely by the time he would become a free agent we aren't going to be able to handle another huge O-Line salary on top of Smith, Frederick and Martin anyway.

As for Free not being our best LT, I accidently indicated LT when I meant RT, so that's a different matter. But sticking with LT for a moment, even if he was our only LT, he was still our best. You can't replace a guy with someone that isn't even on the team.

As for Free at RT, if, as you say, we had the same scenario with Free for years as the scenario I mentioned above, then you are going to have to explain which OG we had that could have moved into Free's RT spot that would have been better, and who would have replaced that OG once he moved. If you can't come up with those answers, or if you can and those answers don't indicate there would have been a better O-Line as a result, then your claim that we had the same scenario I mentioned is wrong.

Actually, at the time, we did have Leonard Davis at Guard. I don't think he was necessarily better but he had played Tackle in the NFL. I believe he was a much better Guard at that point in his career but he could have played RT. I just don't think he could have been much of an upgrade, if at all. The point is, your example was a straw man. You point out that Dak or Zeke could get hurt because of poor play at Guard. Well, the same could happen if you moved Collins to Guard. You don't know how that would work out. Pointing out Free was simply an illustration of exactly how that could happen and what it looks like. That's exactly what happened with Tony.

 

[OmerV]

Actually, at the time, we did have Leonard Davis at Guard. I don't think he was necessarily better but he had played Tackle in the NFL. I believe he was a much better Guard at that point in his career but he could have played RT. I just don't think he could have been much of an upgrade, if at all. The point is, your example was a straw man. You point out that Dak or Zeke could get hurt because of poor play at Guard. Well, the same could happen if you moved Collins to Guard. You don't know how that would work out. Pointing out Free was simply an illustration of exactly how that could happen and what it looks like. That's exactly what happened with Tony.

Okay, so Davis "could have" played RT, although he likely wouldn't have been an upgrade, and somebody lesser than Davis would have had to step in at OG .... Sorry, but that doesn't fit your claim that we had the scenario at that time. The scenario was if we had the chance to upgrade the O-Line, but didn't. You are talking about a scenario that would be a downgrade and move players for no apparent reason.

As for the injury factor, let's just pass on that for now. You are right that players could get hurt whether Collins moved or not, although the weaker the overall O-line, the higher the likelihood that the players the O-Line is charged with protecting will get hurt. The point still is, how would the team explain refusing to make a move that they feel would upgrade the overall O-Line because they are afraid of upsetting a player they will have to negotiate a new contract with at some point? How would they explain to Dak that's the reason they aren't willing to provide what they think would be the best pass protection, or how do they explain to Zeke that's the reason they are unwilling to provide what they think would be the best run blocking? How do they explain to the rest of the team and to the fans that's the reason they are unwilling to put what they think would be the best overall O-Line on the field. For that matter, how do they justify it to themselves? Maybe they just don't mention it at all and hope nobody notices, but what if the OG spot becomes a sore spot and a glaring problem because the team was unwilling to make a move they felt would have eliminated that problem?