Lame Duck Coach

[Stash]

Yup. They are both very good for each other. Brees is no doubt a first ballot HOF but he's no Manning or Brady either. Was at best the 3rd best QB of his era.

I'm not taking anything away from Brees, he's great. But this notion that he was always great and "made Sean Payton" is ridiculous and highly flawed.

 

[Stash]

Yep, San Diego made a mistake but, Sean should have done much better over the years with him.

He has, especially on the side of the team he coaches. His offenses have almost always ranked among the league's best. Finding a defensive coordinator has been his undoing. When he's had them, his entire team has done well. When he hasn't it hasn't. And only some ridiculous circumstances have kept his powerhouse team out of the Super Bowl these two past years specifically.

You must admit that Sean is no Belicheat so why should the Cowboys settle for less than the best available?

Who's "available" that's "better"? If Belicheck is available, yeah, I'll take him instead.

 

[CCBoy]

Coach, the Fonz once stated this...

Nice guys don't always lose. Sometimes they finish second...

I think that his staff will be needed to elevate play on the field. But there, he is like Jimmy Johnson, needing help from his Coordinators to win. Jimmy, although, was a gruesome task master...as opposed to a clapper.

 

[Diehardblues]

Yep, San Diego made a mistake but, Sean should have done much better over the years with him. You must admit that Sean is no Belicheat so why should the Cowboys settle for less than the best available?

They obviously used a 1st round pick since Brees struggled early in his career. But if you recall they drafted Eli Manning and Daddy forced the trade with NY.

Rivers sat out his Rookie season in a contract dispute. And Brees finally begin performing well. Brees initially wasn’t coming back after 2004 since Chargers had committed so much to Rivers and Drew became a FA.

Chargers Franchise Tagged him in 2005. A big move if they thought he was a bust. His injury near the end of2005 made the decision easier for Chargers to let go.

The Chargers could have traded Brees after the 2004 season and received a 1st and 2nd rounder for him but they elected to keep him. That says a lot especially since they already had Rivers.

 

[Ranching]

They just had a dangerous running of the bulls in Spain...but, maybe we all suck a little...

I run with the bulls down here in the RGV.

 

[CCBoy]

I run with the bulls down here in the RGV.

A group of 12 of us, Blue Chip Bar - back then, once took a group bet and entered the bull riding event at the Kleberg County Rodeo....ONCE!

About five seconds worth...survived, lol.

 

[Diehardblues]

I'm not taking anything away from Brees, he's great. But this notion that he was always great and "made Sean Payton" is ridiculous and highly flawed.

I agree . I’d argue they have been great for each other. But I wouldn’t necessarily place one more important than the other.

I think the bigger point is having Payton without the talent of Brees , Saints probably wouldn’t have had as much success. It will be interesting to see how Payton does without a QB of that caliber.

 

[OmerV]

I'm not taking anything away from Brees, he's great. But this notion that he was always great and "made Sean Payton" is ridiculous and highly flawed.

Often players have to grow into greatness. Sean Payton was the right coach, and Brees was the right player, and they made each other.

 

[cowboyblue22]

garrett and rod maranelli have had several years to get the cowboys to the nfc championship if they are to be successful this season it will be because of Kellen moore and Kris Richard and the qb coach that has helped dak get to the next level they will be the guys that get the credit by the media if the cowboys are successful this season

 

[Stash]

Often players have to grow into greatness. Sean Payton was the right coach, and Brees was the right player, and they made each other.

I agree with that. But Payton also has a track record of other quarterbacks doing well under him as well. If I remember correctly, Kerry Collins had a career year working with him and I consider him a big part of Romo's ultimate success.

 

[OmerV]

I agree with that. But Payton also has a track record of other quarterbacks doing well under him as well. If I remember correctly, Kerry Collins had a career year working with him and I consider him a big part of Romo's ultimate success.

He's a good coach, no question. But it also takes talent from the players or the coaching is wasted. Just a good fit all the way around.

 

[Diehardblues]

I agree with that. But Payton also has a track record of other quarterbacks doing well under him as well. If I remember correctly, Kerry Collins had a career year working with him and I consider him a big part of Romo's ultimate success.

Payton is credited with discovering Romo. They were after all from same school but while Payton was in Dallas Romo was cut twice and third stringer.

Not sure how we credit Sean in Romo’s “ ultimate success” ? Those are strong words. If Bledsoe wasn’t so lethargic in the pocket Romo might have never had the opportunity.

Remember Payton wouldn’t even step up to offer more than a 3rd round pick for him once was in New Orleans.

 

[Diehardblues]

He's a good coach, no question. But it also takes talent from the players or the coaching is wasted. Just a good fit all the way around.

Yep
Good coaching compliments great talent. Rarely does great coaching overcome lame talent.

 

[erod]

I’ll counter with the fact that Brees was a replaced disappointment in San Diego prior to hooking up with Payton.

That's not how it went down.

He had a horrific shoulder industry that many thought he wouldn't return from. So they drafted Philip Rivers and let him go.

He then failed a physical in Miami, which is how he ended up in New Orleans.

 

[Stash]

That's not how it went down.

He had a horrific shoulder industry that many thought he wouldn't return from. So they drafted Philip Rivers and let him go.

No, that's the part that's "wrong". Rivers was drafted in 2004, Brees shoulder injury didn't happen until the very last game of the 2005 season, two years after the Chargers chose to draft Rivers.

 

[Diehardblues]

That's not how it went down.

He had a horrific shoulder industry that many thought he wouldn't return from. So they drafted Philip Rivers and let him go.

He then failed a physical in Miami, which is how he ended up in New Orleans.

Rivers was drafted in 2004 year before injury.

Actually they drafted Eli but daddy forced the trade for Rivers and Eli went to NY. Rivers sat out in 2004.

 

[Diehardblues]

No, that's the part that's "wrong". Rivers was drafted in 2004, Brees shoulder injury didn't happen until the very last game of the 2005 season, two years after the Chargers chose to draft Rivers.

Right..

 

[OmerV]

Yep
Good coaching compliments great talent. Rarely does great coaching overcome lame talent.

Certainly not at QB. Some positions lesser talent can be hidden/helped with the players around them, such as a lesser O-Lineman being supported by quality O-Linemen lining up on either side of him, but a QB is largely an island.