Mickey on thefan; Thursday

[cowboyjoe]

talked about wade what job he could get if he retired from football, some people called in and said walmart greeter, etc

talked about wade being high percentage of winning coach in regular season games

mickey talked about perception, and playoff victories, while mentioning what jerry jones talked about wade and jason after the end of the season


talked about coming down to winning superbowls, talked about the guff to me on when wade mentioned belicheck in cleveland, but we all know belicheck cheated to win

talked about bill parcells being here 4 years, and why we cant wait to end result, for the month of december,

zoners the more i am listening to this build up on wade, the sicker i am getting, to me enough is enough, wade had better win this year in december and playoffs or else, NO MORE EXCUSES! TIME TO PUT UP OR SHUT UP WADE, Just winning regular season games doesnt count, its what you do to win in the playoffs and superbowl for the dallas cowboys. Grow Up Wade!

get off of his bandwagon, bottom line, what are you going to do in the playoffs and are you going to come up with a good game plan and have the cowboys ready to play, that is something that wade has never done in his 4 playoff losses

mickey talked about dont get all too fired up with a huge build up because if you lose this game and you spent all of your energy on that game, then you might be flat in next game, which is true, thats why you play one game at a time

cowboys final 5 record for december is 35 to something
we knew this was a tough stretch, so mickey said maybe the nfl has a computer nerd thats puts the schedule together and says oh gee, the cowboys have a hard time winning in december huh, well let me put these 5 games in december for the cowboys this year and let them see how they handle that, snicker mickey says the nfl nerd that compiles the schedule together is doing maybe

victor butler, was practicing wtih special teams, he should go, hamlin still working on side with trainer so doubtful he will play

yeah if giants lose they drop to 6-6, so theywont probably win division title so they would be in middle of trying to get to last wildcard position wiht them being one full game behind of others in that last slot for wildcard, so im sure giants know this could be it for them

so you would like to jump on a team like this and put them away early, but i have a feeling that the cowboys chance to put the giants away wont come till the 4th quarter

 

[malbis030347]

at this point in the season the ship has been righted on
1.defense--kudos to Wade
2. Special temas--kudos to Camillas
3. offense--jury still out, JG needs to fine tune the offense and stop being predictable to NY, Philly and Wash who we have played already and know what we will do

 

[aikemirv]

You know what,

There are 2 very talented and good teams in the NFC alone this year. If the Cowboys don't win it this year I don't neccessarily think you will be able to chalk it up to a Wade coaching issue.

Now, the past two years I think we had the team to go somewhere, based on the teams we were competing with (talent wise) but I am not sure that we have the team to beat both Minn and NO in successive weeks. That would take total team execution on both sides of the ball. It could happen, but I am not sure I could blame Wade if it does not.

 

[Idgit]

Personally, I'm glad our coach feels slighted. He has been slighted, and he calls it like he sees it. The more-or-less simple remedy for this is to win them all in the playoffs, though even then I'm not sure there aren't Cowboy fans out there who'd think that the perfect opportunity for him to ride off into the sunset.

Playoffs might be the ultimate measuring stick for Cowboys coaches, but there should at least be a tip-of-the-hat given for regular season success that's been impressive.

Why not give your HC the benefit of the doubt and just let him assemble a third attempt at a post-season run without disregarding what he has accomplished in the w/l column and taking personal shots at the guy in the process? It makes no sense.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Personally, I'm glad our coach feels slighted. He has been slighted, and he calls it like he sees it. The more-or-less simple remedy for this is to win them all in the playoffs, though even then I'm not sure there aren't Cowboy fans out there who'd think that the perfect opportunity for him to ride off into the sunset.

Playoffs might be the ultimate measuring stick for Cowboys coaches, but there should at least be a tip-of-the-hat given for regular season success that's been impressive.

Why not give your HC the benefit of the doubt and just let him assemble a third attempt at a post-season run without disregarding what he has accomplished in the w/l column and taking personal shots at the guy in the process? It makes no sense.

Agreed.

 

[sonnyboy]

Anyone who thinks Wade is a bad HC just doesn't get it.

Wade has proven himself at least a capable HC over a long stretch.

I didn't say great, I didn't even say very good. I said capable.


He was as good a choice as we had availible in Jan 2007. And given the state of the team at the time, perhaps the best availible choice.

His past track record and the results of 2007 and 2008, given the circumstances, warranted a 3rd year.

This is a results oriented business. Wade must win this year or else. I'm totally on board with this. 3 years with this talent is long enough. At that point heading in a different direction is warranted and probably in the teams best interest.

The only question is how much must he win.
I can't say for certain what Jerry's bottom line is, but I believe we need to win at least a wildcard game and make it to Minn or NO.

If we miss the playoffs or fail to win a playoff game, I'm sure he's gone. But if our season ends in RD 2, I don't know for sure where we go.

 

[cowboyjoe]

Personally, I'm glad our coach feels slighted. He has been slighted, and he calls it like he sees it. The more-or-less simple remedy for this is to win them all in the playoffs, though even then I'm not sure there aren't Cowboy fans out there who'd think that the perfect opportunity for him to ride off into the sunset.

Playoffs might be the ultimate measuring stick for Cowboys coaches, but there should at least be a tip-of-the-hat given for regular season success that's been impressive.

Why not give your HC the benefit of the doubt and just let him assemble a third attempt at a post-season run without disregarding what he has accomplished in the w/l column and taking personal shots at the guy in the process? It makes no sense.

Because of what he does as a head coach.

Again, I said i had no problem with him if he wins a playoff game or 2, but he must do that.

Till wade wins a playoff game and is competetive in the 2nd playoff game even though he might lose that game, then i have the right to question him.

1. After loss to arizona wade gave monday off to players.
2. what happened in next game, ram game, we lost, got outcoached, sure did help didnt it letting players get a day off didnt it.
3. wade admitted that he didnt work enough on run blitz after tampa bay game then wade had to fix the pass defense , because he didnt want to get players hurt in training camp
4. reports have been made that wade in buffalo left on fridays and didnt come back after lunch to run the team, why do you think that jerry jones had a time clock deal with dan reeves, reeves and wade had worked together before, im not saying that dan reeves would take that time off, but why did jerry have that time clock option put in
this goes back to wade letting players off last year etc, think about that, when the players got off, wade got off because he wasnt there coaching them
5. wade kept bruce read and had 4 asst coaches help him on special teams last year
6. players in the weight room werent working out like they should, because they were telling one of the assts not to tell wade, (parcells was always in the weight room to see who worked out and didnt work out)
7. how many times did you see wade say i dont trust choice or felix, or ogletree but when forced to play them you saw positive results, thats not using your players correctly

This is why till wade wins a playoff game then i have the right to question him

 

[Idgit]

Because of what he does as a head coach.

Again, I said i had no problem with him if he wins a playoff game or 2, but he must do that.

Till wade wins a playoff game and is competetive in the 2nd playoff game even though he might lose that game, then i have the right to question him.

1. After loss to arizona wade gave monday off to players.
2. what happened in next game, ram game, we lost, got outcoached, sure did help didnt it letting players get a day off didnt it.
3. wade admitted that he didnt work enough on run blitz after tampa bay game then wade had to fix the pass defense , because he didnt want to get players hurt in training camp
4. reports have been made that wade in buffalo left on fridays and didnt come back after lunch to run the team, why do you think that jerry jones had a time clock deal with dan reeves, reeves and wade had worked together before, im not saying that dan reeves would take that time off, but why did jerry have that time clock option put in
this goes back to wade letting players off last year etc, think about that, when the players got off, wade got off because he wasnt there coaching them
5. wade kept bruce read and had 4 asst coaches help him on special teams last year
6. players in the weight room werent working out like they should, because they were telling one of the assts not to tell wade, (parcells was always in the weight room to see who worked out and didnt work out)
7. how many times did you see wade say i dont trust choice or felix, or ogletree but when forced to play them you saw positive results, thats not using your players correctly

This is why till wade wins a playoff game then i have the right to question him

So, how's this different from you standing in the corner and screaming until you get what you want? Of course you've got the right to question Wade. I'm just challenging your motives. He blew a huge chance in '07, there's no denying that. At least he had his team prepared, though. We had a decent game plan and we had a chance to win at the end of the game against a team that had played us very, very closely twice during the regular season and who went on to win it all (and later said the Cowboys were the toughest team they had to beat in that run).

'08 was a disaster, in part because Wade couldn't control the personalities on the team and in part because we kept turning the ball over and couldn't take it away. Wade gets no pass for that, but if you're trying to be fair you should at least acknowledge that that team had problems that weren't completely on the head coach.

This season is still underway, and I've seen nothing but positives about the coaching and don't think it's fair to dump on the HC for a run that hasn't happened yet.

No matter how you slice it, two years isn't a big statistical sample. And when it's mitigated by so much regular season success (more than his HoF predecessor had, at least), I think you should be patient and give the guy the benefit of the doubt.

To your bullet points: many of them are criticisms of his decisions in regular season games where it's been well-established that Wade does a very good job. I don't see the need to counter those.

As for the timeclock in Buffalo and the rumors of players not working out in the weight room: this is the first I've heard of these rumors, and I don't believe either of them without support. Not that you're not particularly credible, cowboyjoe. It's just that they're unsourced rumors that completely fly in the face of what his teams demonstrate on the field.

 

[cowboyjoe]

Anyone who thinks Wade is a bad HC just doesn't get it.

Wade has proven himself at least a capable HC over a long stretch.

I didn't say great, I didn't even say very good. I said capable.


He was as good a choice as we had availible in Jan 2007. And given the state of the team at the time, perhaps the best availible choice.

His past track record and the results of 2007 and 2008, given the circumstances, warranted a 3rd year.

This is a results oriented business. Wade must win this year or else. I'm totally on board with this. 3 years with this talent is long enough. At that point heading in a different direction is warranted and probably in the teams best interest.

The only question is how much must he win.
I can't say for certain what Jerry's bottom line is, but I believe we need to win at least a wildcard game and make it to Minn or NO.

If we miss the playoffs or fail to win a playoff game, I'm sure he's gone. But if our season ends in RD 2, I don't know for sure where we go.

i didnt say he is a bad HC, he is a very good defensive coordinator for one

but he waits to fix things, he should see those things in OTAs, training camp.

let me ask you this, what great head coach ( i consider don shula, landry, j johnson to be some great head coaches) has ever let a team get a monday off following a loss? is that the mark of a good HC

now let that sink in alittle, players get a day off, what happens when players get the day off,, they then have 2 days off in a row after a loss, players generally get a tuesday off after playing on sundays, then is the head coach coaching the players on the field? are the coaches coaching the players on that day off, No! So, wade got that day off too. Is that the mark of a winning good HC?

 

[cowboyjoe]

So, how's this different from you standing in the corner and screaming until you get what you want? Of course you've got the right to question Wade. I'm just challenging your motives. He blew a huge chance in '07, there's no denying that. At least he had his team prepared, though. We had a decent game plan and we had a chance to win at the end of the game against a team that had played us very, very closely twice during the regular season and who went on to win it all (and later said the Cowboys were the toughest team they had to beat in that run). .

Wrong, had the team prepared? What happened in the 2nd half on the offensive side of the ball? Did we run like we did in the first half. It has come out now that during the bye week, the players did not do their cardivacular work and that players got one of the assistant trainers to tell wade they were working and they were not. Granted thats on the players too, but the offensive line was gassed in the 2nd half. Then, romo started getting killed. It is the head coaches job to see that the team is prepared and ready to play right? Yet, the team did not practice at all in pads part of november and not at all in december during the week at practice. Anyone knows that when you dont work outk, keep your muscles in shape, and stay tuned to getting hit and hitting back, that the opponent your playng against you will be in better shape and 9 times out of 10 whip you. Thats what happened. Parcells always visited the weight room and checked up on players working out, he knew better, wade did not. You would figure that a coach that has coached for 30 years would know better, wade's biggest problem he was treating players like professionals and expecting them to do their work, wrong, A few players you dont have to motivate but most of the other players you have to discipline them.

'08 was a disaster, in part because Wade couldn't control the personalities on the team and in part because we kept turning the ball over and couldn't take it away. Wade gets no pass for that, but if you're trying to be fair you should at least acknowledge that that team had problems that weren't completely on the head coach..

Wrong, did Terry Bradshaw, Howie Long, The Moose, Nate Newton, and Jimmy Johnson tell wade his team was playing sloppy football? Yes, they did, did wade ask a former scout of the cowboys what was wrong, and what was the first thing he told wade, your special teams have been awful since buffalo. Even Jimmy told him, whatever amount of time your spending on special teams, you need to spend an hour on top of that on them and another 30 minutes on top of that. Did wade let the players get the day off after the arizona loss? Answer the question! So, then we had to make up that lost day, so we cut some things in practice and in the film room wednesday. What happened the following game, in the ram game. Answer the question,.

they lost, even wade admitted that they got OUTCOACHED! AFTER THE RAM GAME!
Its true about personalities on the team, but its up to the head coach to put it together. Its up to the head coach to discipline the team. Sure, jerry jones had some effect on this and so did jason garrett, but wade bottom line is the head coach. The head coach is the person in charge of the team. So, like you said, you should be fair and admit some things either you cant see or realize. Are you aware that last year, on special teams sometimes there was no meetings, special teams players just stood around, and some weeks they were lucky if the special teams players worked one hour during the week. Now who is to blame for allowing that to happen. What about the defensive play calling last year, You do remember brian stewart being taken away and demoted from being the defensive coordinator dont you. Who forced that issue, was it wade, No! Was Jerry Jones, just like we had to put 4 assistant coaches to help bruce read on special teams, while he wasnt doing his job, and wade was letting him get away with it. The players all saw that, they arent dumb.

This season is still underway, and I've seen nothing but positives about the coaching and don't think it's fair to dump on the HC for a run that hasn't happened yet.

No matter how you slice it, two years isn't a big statistical sample. And when it's mitigated by so much regular season success (more than his HoF predecessor had, at least), I think you should be patient and give the guy the benefit of the doubt.

To your bullet points: many of them are criticisms of his decisions in regular season games where it's been well-established that Wade does a very good job. I don't see the need to counter those.

As for the timeclock in Buffalo and the rumors of players not working out in the weight room: this is the first I've heard of these rumors, and I don't believe either of them without support. Not that you're not particularly credible, cowboyjoe. It's just that they're unsourced rumors that completely fly in the face of what his teams demonstrate on the field.

Wrong, so you call it a good decision to let the players off on a monday after the arizona game? So, the players lost important practice time and they got outcoached in the ram game. Was that smart of the head coach? YOU DO REALIZE DONT YOU THAT IF WE HAD WON THAT RAM GAME WE WOULD HAVE BEEN IN THE PLAYOFFS DONT YOU? So, who do you blame for giving the players off on the monday, missing film time that wednesday, after the arizona game. Answer that?

Thats why i have the right to question wade. You do realize that if wade had worked on the run blitz in training camp and the pass blitz coverage more instead of giving in to the players and not working them out, you do realize that we may have won that giant game and the denver game dont you? We might could have been 10-1 and in running for a bye week dont you. I am not going to kiss wade for that.

That is what I am pointing to! I am tired of wade not doing his job and having to fix things, when he should fix them in the first place.

 

[Idgit]

Wrong, had the team prepared? What happened in the 2nd half on the offensive side of the ball? Did we run like we did in the first half. It has come out now that during the bye week, the players did not do their cardivacular work and that players got one of the assistant trainers to tell wade they were working and they were not. Granted thats on the players too, but the offensive line was gassed in the 2nd half. Then, romo started getting killed. It is the head coaches job to see that the team is prepared and ready to play right? Yet, the team did not practice at all in pads part of november and not at all in december during the week at practice. Anyone knows that when you dont work outk, keep your muscles in shape, and stay tuned to getting hit and hitting back, that the opponent your playng against you will be in better shape and 9 times out of 10 whip you. Thats what happened. Parcells always visited the weight room and checked up on players working out, he knew better, wade did not. You would figure that a coach that has coached for 30 years would know better, wade's biggest problem he was treating players like professionals and expecting them to do their work, wrong, A few players you dont have to motivate but most of the other players you have to discipline them.



Wrong, did Terry Bradshaw, Howie Long, The Moose, Nate Newton, and Jimmy Johnson tell wade his team was playing sloppy football? Yes, they did, did wade ask a former scout of the cowboys what was wrong, and what was the first thing he told wade, your special teams have been awful since buffalo. Even Jimmy told him, whatever amount of time your spending on special teams, you need to spend an hour on top of that on them and another 30 minutes on top of that. Did wade let the players get the day off after the arizona loss? Answer the question! So, then we had to make up that lost day, so we cut some things in practice and in the film room wednesday. What happened the following game, in the ram game. Answer the question,.

they lost, even wade admitted that they got OUTCOACHED! AFTER THE RAM GAME!
Its true about personalities on the team, but its up to the head coach to put it together. Its up to the head coach to discipline the team. Sure, jerry jones had some effect on this and so did jason garrett, but wade bottom line is the head coach. The head coach is the person in charge of the team. So, like you said, you should be fair and admit some things either you cant see or realize. Are you aware that last year, on special teams sometimes there was no meetings, special teams players just stood around, and some weeks they were lucky if the special teams players worked one hour during the week. Now who is to blame for allowing that to happen. What about the defensive play calling last year, You do remember brian stewart being taken away and demoted from being the defensive coordinator dont you.

This season is still underway, and I've seen nothing but positives about the coaching and don't think it's fair to dump on the HC for a run that hasn't happened yet.

No matter how you slice it, two years isn't a big statistical sample. And when it's mitigated by so much regular season success (more than his HoF predecessor had, at least), I think you should be patient and give the guy the benefit of the doubt.

To your bullet points: many of them are criticisms of his decisions in regular season games where it's been well-established that Wade does a very good job. I don't see the need to counter those.

As for the timeclock in Buffalo and the rumors of players not working out in the weight room: this is the first I've heard of these rumors, and I don't believe either of them without support. Not that you're not particularly credible, cowboyjoe. It's just that they're unsourced rumors that completely fly in the face of what his teams demonstrate on the field.

Wrong, so you call it a good decision to let the players off on a monday after the arizona game? So, the players lost important practice time and they got outcoached in the ram game. Was that smart of the head coach? YOU DO REALIZE DONT YOU THAT IF WE HAD WON THAT RAM GAME WE WOULD HAVE BEEN IN THE PLAYOFFS DONT YOU?[/QUOTE]

I can't debate this flood of specious logic, unsupportable accusation, and innuendo. I'm going to respectfully slink off to another thread.

 

[cowboyjoe]

Wrong, so you call it a good decision to let the players off on a monday after the arizona game? So, the players lost important practice time and they got outcoached in the ram game. Was that smart of the head coach? YOU DO REALIZE DONT YOU THAT IF WE HAD WON THAT RAM GAME WE WOULD HAVE BEEN IN THE PLAYOFFS DONT YOU?

I can't debate this flood of specious logic, unsupportable accusation, and innuendo. I'm going to respectfully slink off to another thread.[/QUOTE]

It's a matter of fact, all you have to do is go look and read, everything that i told you is in black and white and written up on several sites.

Just because wade is a good ole boy, doesnt mean squat. Its what you do in the playoffs and the superbowl.

Till he wins some playoff games and gets off of his duff and do things, I have the right to question him.

I guess you were on the moon, when brian stewart got demoted and jerry jones forced the issue. Or when wade said I gave the team the monday off after the cardinal game because I thought they played hard. But what did the whole offensive line except flozell adams say, we stunk the place up on the offensive line in the cardinal game. I guess you were still on the moon, when wade placed 4 asst coaches to help bruce read on special teams.

The time of excuses is over with, its put up or shut up time for wade.

Till he wins like richie says on thefan then i have the right to question wade till that first playoff win.

Do you get any trophies or championships for wining just games in the NFL. No, its all about playoff games and super bowls. He is not a winning coach till he wins some playoff games.

 

[Mash]

I think Wade is doin a fine job....

Big Bill the HOF coach couldnt win a playoff game here.......

Yes we need to get over the hump....but winning a playoff game...or winning in Dec means nothing unless you win the Super Bowl.

Is Andy Reid a failure because with all that talent...and franchise QB and playing in a conference that didnt have too many good teams....and Reid could never win the SB.

Is success based on winning games in Dec? winning a playoff game?

Is that what success is?

So having success during the regular season means nothing but winning a lousy playoff game is some sort of success.?

Win the SB....everything else is a disappointing season.

But then again....lets change coaches every 3 years if they dont win the SB....

Cant be the players....can it?.....never.....this team is soo talented that Jerry Jones could coach this team to 10 wins...

 

[TwoCentPlain]

How much of it is the coach and how much of it is the players?

Last year's losses to the Eagles and Ravens were on the players in my opinion.

Bill Cowher was rumored to be on the chopping block a few years before he won the superbowl.

 

[Jarv]

I think it would be funny if we win the Superbowl and Wade tells Jerry to get lost when he tries to give him a new contract.

 

[cowboyjoe]

I think it would be funny if we win the Superbowl and Wade tells Jerry to get lost when he tries to give him a new contract.

i think this, with wade trying to hoot his horn how good a coach he is,there is no way i would give him the contract option he has, i would wait and make him earn it


wade is the type of person that with a little credit, like when he got the team to 13-3, wade will be content with a new contract and things wont change because he will say i got my contract like ken hamlin and a few others that havent earned their money after they got their new contract

wasnt wade popping off, that well we were 13-3 wasnt he, didnt wade say, i did win a playoff game, the bye week

make him earn it;

 

[Zman5]

I would have like to see how Wade would have done if he had complete control over which coaches he could/want to hire and had more say in the offense.

He has taken care of the defense and he was the main reason Joe DeCamillis was brought in to fix the special teams. The offense has been the most inconsistent part this season.

I don't like some of the things he has done but I really can't blame Wade for all the failures of this team past 3 years because he was never given a chance to have full control of the team.

 

[cowboyjoe]

I would have like to see how Wade would have done if he had complete control over which coaches he could/want to hire and had more say in the offense.

He has taken care of the defense and he was the main reason Joe DeCamillis was brought in to fix the special teams. The offense has been the most inconsistent part this season.

I don't like some of the things he has done but I really can't blame Wade for all the failures of this team past 3 years because he was never given a chance to have full control of the team.

now i agree with that, maybe till jerry jones finally admits that jimmy johnson had total control on the team, it will be tough for a head coach to run the team; that part i agree with, but at the same time, the new head coaches that jerry signs, they agree to the contract, they have no one to blame but themselves