Mike Golic's take on steroids in football vs. steroids in baseball

[TruBlueCowboy]

If you're listening to Mike & Mike this morning, you might catch his take on steroids which I thought was interesting. Some folks were crying hypocrisy because people weren't making a big deal out of ex-football players like Jim Haslett admitting that many players were taking steroids in the 70's, or the Carolina Panthers getting busted, but the same people are ready to take guys like Rafael Palmeiro and Sammy Sosa out of the Hall of Fame because of it.

Golic's take is that in his time (and to this day) the main people taking steroids were the linemen and frankly, the media and fans don't care about those fellas as much as they did the skilled position players. Stats are holy numbers in baseball, so when a home run king in either a single season or career is suspected of steroids, it affects that sport much more than football where stats are not nearly as big as they are in baseball. Plus, the biggest football guys guilty of it are players who aren't setting holy numbers like their baseball counterparts. The quarterbacks have the most famous numbers in football, and most of those guys were/are clean.

What do you think? Do you agree?

 

[burmafrd]

Pretty much true. It was the linemen and LB's that did the roids big. Most of the stat guys did not. And it is true that the media and everyone else, mostly, only care about the stats guys.

 

[Hostile]

If you're listening to Mike & Mike this morning, you might catch his take on steroids which I thought was interesting. Some folks were crying hypocrisy because people weren't making a big deal out of ex-football players like Jim Haslett admitting that many players were taking steroids in the 70's, or the Carolina Panthers getting busted, but the same people are ready to take guys like Rafael Palmeiro and Sammy Sosa out of the Hall of Fame because of it.

Golic's take is that in his time (and to this day) the main people taking steroids were the linemen and frankly, the media and fans don't care about those fellas as much as they did the skilled position players. Stats are holy numbers in baseball, so when a home run king in either a single season or career is suspected of steroids, it affects that sport much more than football where stats are not nearly as big as they are in baseball. Plus, the biggest football guys guilty of it are players who aren't setting holy numbers like their baseball counterparts. The quarterbacks have the most famous numbers in football, and most of those guys were/are clean.

What do you think? Do you agree?

The theory has merit. Most football fans care about 2 things, scoring a lot of points and winning. They don't care how you get there. They don't care about the things in between those 2 goals. Linemen are invisible to most fans unless a crunching block is thrown, a fight breaks out, a sack is allowed, or a penalty happens. The stat sheet is more visible.

 

[RiggoForever]

If you're listening to Mike & Mike this morning, you might catch his take on steroids which I thought was interesting. Some folks were crying hypocrisy because people weren't making a big deal out of ex-football players like Jim Haslett admitting that many players were taking steroids in the 70's, or the Carolina Panthers getting busted, but the same people are ready to take guys like Rafael Palmeiro and Sammy Sosa out of the Hall of Fame because of it.

Golic's take is that in his time (and to this day) the main people taking steroids were the linemen and frankly, the media and fans don't care about those fellas as much as they did the skilled position players. Stats are holy numbers in baseball, so when a home run king in either a single season or career is suspected of steroids, it affects that sport much more than football where stats are not nearly as big as they are in baseball. Plus, the biggest football guys guilty of it are players who aren't setting holy numbers like their baseball counterparts. The quarterbacks have the most famous numbers in football, and most of those guys were/are clean.

What do you think? Do you agree?

Hasn't LT admitted to being on both roids and high on coke during games? Same with Dexter Manley, though I don't know if he was high during games or not.

 

[czmtzc]

Another important factor of course is that the NFL acted against steriods what 20 years ago? They saw a problem, and they acted. Any delay in their action is more due to the fact that the problem was new at the time.

MLB on the other hand is dragging its feet kicking and screaming, after it has become obvious that steriods have significantly impacted the game. The delay in the MLB action is mainly due to the players union throwing up obstacles.

There is a reason that the NFL policy is held up as a standard for professional sports.

 

[RiggoForever]

Another important factor of course is that the NFL acted against steriods what 20 years ago? They saw a problem, and they acted. Any delay in their action is more due to the fact that the problem was new at the time.

MLB on the other hand is dragging its feet kicking and screaming, after it has become obvious that steriods have significantly impacted the game. The delay in the MLB action is mainly due to the players union throwing up obstacles.

There is a reason that the NFL policy is held up as a standard for professional sports.

Yes, I think there is a 3 strikes and out drug policy now in the NFL....1st offense four game suspension 2nd offense 1 year suspension 3rd offense lifetime ban. I believe that Manley received a lifetime ban in the early 90s for his cocaine use.

Though I'm not sure how often drug testing takes place and when.

 

[AbeBeta]

Hasn't LT admitted to being on both roids and high on coke during games? Same with Dexter Manley, though I don't know if he was high during games or not.

Never heard the high on coke during a game thing.

But if he was on roids during games -- SO WHAT. They were not banned by the league at the time.

Judging someone for having used Steroids in the past - when they were allowed by the league (not banned is more accurate) - is wrong. You want your players to take any advantage they can. If 10 years from now the league decided to ban a certain dietary supplement would you fault those players who used it when it was legal?

 

[AbeBeta]

Yes, I think there is a 3 strikes and out drug policy now in the NFL....1st offense four game suspension 2nd offense 1 year suspension 3rd offense lifetime ban. I believe that Manley received a lifetime ban in the early 90s for his cocaine use.

Though I'm not sure how often drug testing takes place and when.

more like 4 strikes -- first one, as I understand it, moves you from the random testing to the 10 times a month testing phase of the program.

I wouldn't term the final offense a lifetime ban -- players can apply for re-instatement after a year. Practically though that's a lifetime ban as the guy has now missed 36 games due to suspension.

 

[jman]

Yes, I think there is a 3 strikes and out drug policy now in the NFL....1st offense four game suspension 2nd offense 1 year suspension 3rd offense lifetime ban. I believe that Manley received a lifetime ban in the early 90s for his cocaine use.

Though I'm not sure how often drug testing takes place and when.

Actually, first infraction is a 4 game fine, money only, but no suspension.

Second is a 4 game suspension without pay.

Thrid is a 1 year suspension.

And a fourth infraction leads to the life time ban. Although you can apply for re-instatement after that one year suspension has ended.

 

[RiggoForever]

Never heard the high on coke during a game thing.

But if he was on roids during games -- SO WHAT. They were not banned by the league at the time.

Judging someone for having used Steroids in the past - when they were allowed by the league (not banned is more accurate) - is wrong. You want your players to take any advantage they can. If 10 years from now the league decided to ban a certain dietary supplement would you fault those players who used it when it was legal?

Oh I'm not judging him at all. I have the utmost respect for the man as a football player, he was an utter animal. And I applaud him for talking about the hidden side of the NFL.

You're right, it wasn't banned by the league at the time, and I bet many were on steroids but LT is the best LB to play the game ever, so he stands out.

Plus Taylor sponsors an adult NFL game called "Blitz League" where things like using performance enhancing drugs are part of the game.

 

[fortdick]

You simply cannot compete in the NFL without taking roids. Baseball is a quick muscle game, while football, for the most part, is a strength game. With the size and strength of your opponent being the greatest concern, you do what you have to to compete.

Like the DE in the movie The Program. You don't use them, you don't play.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

He may have a great point. I care about steroids because I think it's an extremely dangerous drug.

Back in the day people would say that because cigarettes didn't have a warning label, they didn't know it was bad for them. That's something I never bought because if you wake up each morning and you're hacking up a lung and are tired and get easily exhausted, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to think "hey, these cigarettes aren't good for me!"

With roids it's much different because in the short term, it will increase muscle size and athletic ability of people. Thus, people start to by into the myth that proper use of roids won't hurt you.

And while I believe parents need to be involved in their children's life first and foremost, I'd have to imagine it almost being impossible to know if your child is doing steroids. It's not like doing coke, ecstacy, or pot where there are tell tale signs. Or even with weed you can smell the stuff being smoked.

The signs of roid user are acne, rages, and a great increase in muscle mass. Well, those are also things that happen to many ordinary, non-roid using teenagers.

But the biggest thing is that nobody in their right mind would do coke to "get ahead" in a profession. But with steroids so many people believe it's something they must use. And that's really the reason why it is so dangerous.


Rich.........

 

[aikemirv]

I think you guys need a little clarification.

Just because things are not against someones or a leagues rules does not make it OK.

For example - adultery, although not illegal is wrong and goes against a promise made.

Taking steroids, even though may have not been against league rules in the 70's is cheating, any way you want to look at it because it is stealing ability/strength that was not yours.

 

[Hostile]

I think you guys need a little clarification.

Just because things are not against someones or a leagues rules does not make it OK.

For example - adultery, although not illegal is wrong and goes against a promise made.

Taking steroids, even though may have not been against league rules in the 70's is cheating, any way you want to look at it because it is stealing ability/strength that was not yours.

I'm not sure how old you are or how much you remember of those days, but the sports world in general was naive about steroids. It was pretty much thought that only the bodybuilders were using them and getting results.

Once the sports leagues caught on there was change. That change was very gradual. Not even the death of a highly visible player like Lyle Alzado did much to make inroads.

We are much more educated to steroids now than then and we're still way behind the curve. Balco got caught because someone sent a syringe for analysis so they knew what to look for. I guarantee you there are other substances out there that are unknown as of yet.

Right and wrong really doesn't have much to do with it in the eyes of most players. I saw steroids in college football. Not heard about them, physically saw guys inject themselves between their toes so the needle tracks were hidden. I saw the results too. I never did them but I'd be lying if I said it wasn't tempting as hell.

I guarantee you that the mindset of most who did them wasn't that they were cheating anything. That doesn't make them right.

 

[aikemirv]

I'm not sure how old you are or how much you remember of those days, but the sports world in general was naive about steroids. It was pretty much thought that only the bodybuilders were using them and getting results.

Once the sports leagues caught on there was change. That change was very gradual. Not even the death of a highly visible player like Lyle Alzado did much to make inroads.

We are much more educated to steroids now than then and we're still way behind the curve. Balco got caught because someone sent a syringe for analysis so they knew what to look for. I guarantee you there are other substances out there that are unknown as of yet.

Right and wrong really doesn't have much to do with it in the eyes of most players. I saw steroids in college football. Not heard about them, physically saw guys inject themselves between their toes so the needle tracks were hidden. I saw the results too. I never did them but I'd be lying if I said it wasn't tempting as hell.

I guarantee you that the mindset of most who did them wasn't that they were cheating anything. That doesn't make them right.

Well, I disagree with you there because back in the 70's people in the US had much more of a moral compass than we see today, so I bet you that those players who were taking them knew the effects that the steroids had on their abilities and the reason they hid that stuff is because they KNEW it was cheating!

 

[Eddie]

It's very naive to believe our NFL heroes are juice free. You don't grow to be 6'5" 320 lbs of muscle and run like a truck on protein shakes and grilled chicken.

Most forms of steroids are detectable, but many are not. Deca is traceable for up to a year after it's use. Others have shorter half lives and need to be in your system to be detected.

Human Growth Hormone is not detectable. Combined with Testosterone, it's one powerful anabolic compound ... I'm certain HGH is the primary substance most NFL players use. GH, for the most part, is just too expensive for the regular Joe to afford.

Trembolone Acetate is a compound used by beef farmers to inject in their feed lot heifers, two months before slaughter. These steer put on about 4 times their muscle mass. Without Trembolone, the beef industry would not be able to sustain America's consumption of beef.

Nevertheless, Trembolone is also converted to human form and used heavily in the bodybuilding industry. Tren, Test, and HGH are the foundation of almost every bodybuilder's "diet". Tren is also a legal product you can buy on the internet on many Yahoo stores.

Tren is also not illegal in sports. The beauty of the substance is it's 4 times a anabolic as Testosterone, with little or no side effects.

If there's a bias in the world against "cheaters" for using steroids ... mainly because juice is considered illegal in sports, then what about legal products like Tren (which happens to be more potent than steroids). Is that cheating?

Is taking creatine cheating? How about pro-anabolics sold in GNC?

There's a big hypocrisy in the media against anabolic compounds, mainly because they have no clue what it is ... and only regurgitate the same horror stories.

Lyle Alzado died of a brain aneurizm (sp?). That has nothing to do with his steroid use.

Belcher died of heat exhaustion because he was overweight, trying to cut weight, wore 4 uniforms in 100+ humidity .... NOT because he took ephedra in the morning. He also showered with soap ... hence, the cause of death???

Hos, I'm not sure you can inject juice into your toes or feet. Injections should be in big muscle ... usually the glutes, thighs, calves, delts, etc. Some believe in site injections for local growth, but I don't think it's possible.

Ok, there's my surmon on steroids and anabolic compounds. I've done my research over the years. I understand the benefits and the dangers ... and don't go crying wolf over it. Used in moderation, it's a powerful tool to enhance the male physique, performance, and health.

But as with all things, abuse is common, and that's when we usually hear the bad news.

 

[Hostile]

Well, I disagree with you there because back in the 70's people in the US had much more of a moral compass than we see today, so I bet you that those players who were taking them knew the effects that the steroids had on their abilities and the reason they hid that stuff is because they KNEW it was cheating!

You mis-read. I didn't say the players didn't realize the results. I said the sports leagues were naive and thought only body builders were using them.

There was a time not that long ago that baseball players wouldn't lift weights at all for fear it would slow them down.

Naivity (sp?) of the subject did exist and to some degree, still does.

 

[czmtzc]

Not necessarily. If the team doctor gives you medicine to help you recover from injury or sickness is that cheating? Well what if he is giving you steroids to help you work out and build mass? You have to remember that during the 70’s we didn’t really know about the harmful side effects, and TEAM DOCTORS often prescribed and administered steroids personally. As has been mentioned almost all of the “bulk” positional players took steroids, because it made you bigger. The reason that the “skill” players mostly didn’t take the drugs was due to the belief that you would become muscle bound.


If an action is officially endorsed, it isn’t cheating. They didn’t start to prohibit steroid until it became obvious that it was harmful to the players that had done it. That is why the anti steroid rules came out in the 80’s not the 70’s.

 

[Hostile]

It's very naive to believe our NFL heroes are juice free. You don't grow to be 6'5" 320 lbs of muscle and run like a truck on protein shakes and grilled chicken.

Most forms of steroids are detectable, but many are not. Deca is traceable for up to a year after it's use. Others have shorter half lives and need to be in your system to be detected.

Human Growth Hormone is not detectable. Combined with Testosterone, it's one powerful anabolic compound ... I'm certain HGH is the primary substance most NFL players use. GH, for the most part, is just too expensive for the regular Joe to afford.

Trembolone Acetate is a compound used by beef farmers to inject in their feed lot heifers, two months before slaughter. These steer put on about 4 times their muscle mass. Without Trembolone, the beef industry would not be able to sustain America's consumption of beef.

Nevertheless, Trembolone is also converted to human form and used heavily in the bodybuilding industry. Tren, Test, and HGH are the foundation of almost every bodybuilder's "diet". Tren is also a legal product you can buy on the internet on many Yahoo stores.

Tren is also not illegal in sports. The beauty of the substance is it's 4 times a anabolic as Testosterone, with little or no side effects.

If there's a bias in the world against "cheaters" for using steroids ... mainly because juice is considered illegal in sports, then what about legal products like Tren (which happens to be more potent than steroids). Is that cheating?

Is taking creatine cheating? How about pro-anabolics sold in GNC?

There's a big hypocrisy in the media against anabolic compounds, mainly because they have no clue what it is ... and only regurgitate the same horror stories.

Lyle Alzado died of a brain aneurizm (sp?). That has nothing to do with his steroid use.

Belcher died of heat exhaustion because he was overweight, trying to cut weight, wore 4 uniforms in 100+ humidity .... NOT because he took ephedra in the morning. He also showered with soap ... hence, the cause of death???

Hos, I'm not sure you can inject juice into your toes or feet. Injections should be in big muscle ... usually the glutes, thighs, calves, delts, etc. Some believe in site injections for local growth, but I don't think it's possible.

Ok, there's my surmon on steroids and anabolic compounds. I've done my research over the years. I understand the benefits and the dangers ... and don't go crying wolf over it. Used in moderation, it's a powerful tool to enhance the male physique, performance, and health.

But as with all things, abuse is common, and that's when we usually hear the bad news.

Alzado's brain cancer was traced to his heavy steroid and HGH use. There was even an SI article prior to his death about how he got huge on them and was wasting away.

 

[Eddie]

Alzado's brain cancer was traced to his heavy steroid and HGH use. There was even an SI article prior to his death about how he got huge on them and was wasting away.

Hos, I wouldn't take SI's word as a journal of medicine. They're just sports reporters looking for the latest smash.

Alzado's brain cancer had nothing to do with his steroid and GH use.