Mock 1.0

[DFWJC]

No big deal, but Dallas would at least get 14, 43, and 76 from the Rams for the 4th overall.

 

[darthseinfeld]

Rams want Goff and want him before SF or NO tries to take him... we get picks 15, 43 and 108.


15 Vernon Hargreaves CB


34 Derrick Henry RB


43 Austin Johnson DT


67 and 102 and a 2017 5th to NYJ for pick 51


51 Dak Prescott QB


108 Scooby Wright LB


137 Fahn Cooper OT


192 DJ Pettway DE


212 Henry Kriger Coble TE


216 Geronimo Allison WR


217 Dan Vitale FB


I think the combo of Hargreaves and Henry outweigh the drop off to the next best CB than the drop off from Elliot to Henry.


Prescott may be a little early but after Wentz and Goff go there will be a run on QBs in the second from the teams that did not reach for one in the first.

Good mock.

I dont think Hargreaves makea to 15. He is the best pure CB in the draft ( better as a CB then Ramsey) and I think he will get snatched up just outside the top 10. I think 15 is a good spot for Elliott. He could go higher, but bad teams tend to look more towards the line with top 15 picks. I also think 34 could be a big sweet spot for CBs with Fuller, Jackson and Apple and Burns possibly being there

Im very flaky on Prescott. I need to watch more of him since his name is coming up alot. From what I did see he needs alot of work and doesnt have elite ability as a passer, but he has more then enough arm talent to be a starting QB. What i do really about him is he has the mental makeup of someone you want as your starting QB. I dont think he will ever put up pro bowl passing numbers, but I think he could be a winner.

 

[Kaiser]

I like it, I think it hits the key positions we will be targeting. The trick is seeing if players drop to us and players like Billings and Lynch are available later than expected.

I do think we take a CB fairly early on and a QB later than this board wants. I would take Booker over Derrick Henry but I trust the Cowboy scouts on the RB position.

 

[tyke1doe]

And instincts. And production. And level of competition. And coverage ability.

Jackson is faster, but Hargreaves tests better in every other drill in addition to the above.

Instincts? I wouldn't say Hargreaves instincts are better than Jackson's. That's hard to quantify anyway. Jackson makes plays on the ball just as Hargreaves does. How are you determining that Hargreaves instincts are better.

Production? Their production is basically the same. In terms of interceptions, over their careers, Hargreaves had 10; Jackson 8. But Jackson has returned 2 for touchdowns; Hargreaves 0.
Last year, Jackson's stats were better than Hargreaves. Jackson had more tackles (43 to 33) passes broken up (23 to 4) and interceptions (5 to 4).

Level of competition? Well, that goes into schooling.

Coverage ability? And how are you determining that?
This from Pro Football Focus:

Jackson was PFF’s second-highest graded cornerback in coverage this season, and second only to Ramsey in overall grade when play against the run is thrown into the equation. He was targeted 93 times this past season, allowing only 46 catches (49.5 percent). He had five interceptions and 12 pass breakups, allowing a passer rating of just 57.9 when thrown his way.

I'm still trying to collect data on Hargreaves.

Be that as it may, I still think Jackson will end up being a better player than Hargreaves. But we shall see.

 

[Sydla]

Tell the Rams I want 15, 43, 45 for the 4th pick.

 

[tyke1doe]

Im very flaky on Prescott. I need to watch more of him since his name is coming up alot. From what I did see he needs alot of work and doesnt have elite ability as a passer, but he has more then enough arm talent to be a starting QB. What i do really about him is he has the mental makeup of someone you want as your starting QB. I dont think he will ever put up pro bowl passing numbers, but I think he could be a winner.

Jerry's probably looking for the next Russell Wilson.

 

[Nightman]

I realized that the value of the 7th pick (1500), where i was thinking a trade back, got stuck in my head. Here is a revised version:


Rams want Goff and want him before SF or NO tries to take him... we get picks 15, 43, 76 and 108.


15 Vernon Hargreaves CB


34 Derrick Henry RB


43 Jayron Kearse SS


67 and 102 and a 2017 5th to NYJ for pick 51


51 Dak Prescott QB


76 Scooby Wright LB


108 Chris "Tea Bag" Jones DT


137 Fahn Cooper OT


192 DJ Pettway DE


212 Henry Kriger Coble TE


216 Geronimo Allison WR


217 Dan Vitale FB


I think the combo of Hargreaves and Henry outweigh the drop off to the next best CB than the drop off from Elliot to Henry.


Prescott may be a little early but after Wentz and Goff go there will be a run on QBs in the second from the teams that did not reach for one in the first.

I can't stress how much I hate this draft.
I hate the trade back. I want Goff more than any CB.
I don't like Henry at 34
I don't like Kearse at 43
I don't like Dak before the 6th

We need quality and not quantity with this draft. We already have 9 picks, we don't need to trade down from 4 to get more picks. I would rather move up from 34 and get EE if he falls to the late teens.

 

[texbumthelife]

Instincts? I wouldn't say Hargreaves instincts are better than Jackson's. That's hard to quantify anyway. Jackson makes plays on the ball just as Hargreaves does. How are you determining that Hargreaves instincts are better.

I determine instincts by watching game tape and focusing a lot on what guys do before the ball is thrown and how they react when it's thrown away from them. Hargreaves has the best anticipation of any corner in the draft. I chalk that up to instincts.

Production? Their production is basically the same. In terms of interceptions, over their careers, Hargreaves had 10; Jackson 8. But Jackson has returned 2 for touchdowns; Hargreaves 0.
Last year, Jackson's stats were better than Hargreaves. Jackson had more tackles (43 to 33) passes broken up (23 to 4) and interceptions (5 to 4).

Now factor in that almost every coach admittedly went out of their way to avoid challenging Hargreaves and those numbers are pretty damn incredible. In his game tape you can see teams avoiding throwing his way for whole halves of games.

Level of competition? Well, that goes into schooling.

That makes sense. I thought by "schooling" you meant coaching. Both are relevant. We can agree there.

Coverage ability? And how are you determining that?

See above.

Be that as it may, I still think Jackson will end up being a better player than Hargreaves. But we shall see.

Due to his length and speed, I think Jackson may represent a higher ceiling, but I think Hargreaves is immediate starter material and, in the right scheme could be an immediate impact player.

As far as pure coverage ability, I actually grade Hargreaves right there with Marcus Peters last season. Last year for months leading up to the draft I said Peters was the best cover corner. I don't think anyone agreed with me, but the proof is in the pudding. I see the same things in Hargreaves that I saw in Peters, though Peters is a little bit more physical and more of a press guy.

I am not trying to claim Jackson won't be a good corner, but I see more natural ability in Hargreaves.

 

[tyke1doe]

I determine instincts by watching game tape and focusing a lot on what guys do before the ball is thrown and how they react when it's thrown away from them. Hargreaves has the best anticipation of any corner in the draft. I chalk that up to instincts.

Now factor in that almost every coach admittedly went out of their way to avoid challenging Hargreaves and those numbers are pretty damn incredible. In his game tape you can see teams avoiding throwing his way for whole halves of games.

That makes sense. I thought by "schooling" you meant coaching. Both are relevant. We can agree there.

See above.



Due to his length and speed, I think Jackson may represent a higher ceiling, but I think Hargreaves is immediate starter material and, in the right scheme could be an immediate impact player.

As far as pure coverage ability, I actually grade Hargreaves right there with Marcus Peters last season. Last year for months leading up to the draft I said Peters was the best cover corner. I don't think anyone agreed with me, but the proof is in the pudding. I see the same things in Hargreaves that I saw in Peters, though Peters is a little bit more physical and more of a press guy.

I am not trying to claim Jackson won't be a good corner, but I see more natural ability in Hargreaves.

Fair enough.

 

[jnday]

F- .is this the lowest possible grade?

I can see this as a draft that the team would be happy with. I agree with the F-, but Jerry can sell it to the fans.

 

[BAT]

Rams want Goff and want him before SF or NO tries to take him... we get picks 15, 43, 76 and 108. In your scenario, here are my picks:


15 Vernon Hargreaves CB Noah Spence DE - forget 40 times, Spence is quick twitch and Cowboys need to improve their pass rush *would consider trade down to twenties for another 2nd, 3rd and/or later pick & take Andrew Billings DT (6'1 315 5.0) or Leonard Floyd DE (6'6 245 4.6).

34 Derrick Henry RB Jaylon Smith LB - Best LB in draft falls to 2nd due to injury concern

43 Jayron Kearse SS Derrick Henry RB - 6'3 250 4.5 is the answer to goal line and 3rd & short problems

67 *No Trade Up: Robert Nkemdiche DT - 6'4 300 4.8 is too great a combo of size, speed & power; top 10 talent drops to 3rd due to immaturity & production

51 Dak Prescott QB *IF trade up then my pick is: Sua Cravens SS/OLB - position flex but more importantly a playmaker

76 Scooby Wright LB Karl Joseph FS - Best S in draft falls to the 3rd due to injury; short but hitting machine who picked up 5 INTS in 3 games

102 *No Trade Up: Miles Killebrew SS - hardest hitting player in the draft; S in LB body; tandem of Joseph & Killebrew will give opposing teams nightmares

108 Chris Jones DT Javon Hargrave DT - can play 1 tech or 3 tech at 310 lbs; 1.69 10 and 4.9 40 is amazing enough but 2 time MEAC DPOY (13 sacks 2015, 16 sacks 2014) - good bye Hayden!

137 Fahn Cooper OT Cardale Jones QB - Need a QB in 4-5 years? Why not the one with the most physical upside.

192 DJ Pettway DE Matt Judon DE/DT - MORE PASS RUSH; speed to play outside (4.7) and size and power to play inside (30 reps 225 & 6'3 275); best of all 20 sacks in 2015 (small school but STILL)

212 Henry Kriger Coble TE Byron Marshall KR/RB/WR - Dunbar UPGRADE: 1,000 yard rusher in 2013; 1,000 yard receiver in 2015; falls due to injury

216 Geronimo Allison WR Keivarae Russell CB - blue chip talent but dogged by multiple injuries and off field issues (suspended for academic dishonesty)

217 Dan Vitale FB Quayvon Hicks FB - Vitale is best or 2nd best FB so will be gone before 6th; Hicks is monstrous but no fat at 260 plus and versatile (also plays in line TE): See yah Clutts!

UDFA Rico Gathers TE - Baylor basketball player with NFL body at 6'8 270 known for shot blocking and rebounding

 

[blindzebra]

Rams want Goff and want him before SF or NO tries to take him... we get picks 15, 43, 76 and 108. In your scenario, here are my picks:


15 Vernon Hargreaves CB Noah Spence DE - forget 40 times, Spence is quick twitch and Cowboys need to improve their pass rush *would consider trade down to twenties for another 2nd, 3rd and/or later pick & take Andrew Billings DT (6'1 315 5.0) or Leonard Floyd DE (6'6 245 4.6).

34 Derrick Henry RB Jaylon Smith LB - Best LB in draft falls to 2nd due to injury concern

43 Jayron Kearse SS Derrick Henry RB - 6'3 250 4.5 is the answer to goal line and 3rd & short problems

67 *No Trade Up: Robert Nkemdiche DT - 6'4 300 4.8 is too great a combo of size, speed & power; top 10 talent drops to 3rd due to immaturity & production

51 Dak Prescott QB *IF trade up then my pick is: Sua Cravens SS/OLB - position flex but more importantly a playmaker

76 Scooby Wright LB Karl Joseph FS - Best S in draft falls to the 3rd due to injury; short but hitting machine who picked up 5 INTS in 3 games

102 *No Trade Up: Miles Killebrew SS - hardest hitting player in the draft; S in LB body; tandem of Joseph & Killebrew will give opposing teams nightmares

108 Chris Jones DT Javon Hargrave DT - can play 1 tech or 3 tech at 310 lbs; 1.69 10 and 4.9 40 is amazing enough but 2 time MEAC DPOY (13 sacks 2015, 16 sacks 2014) - good bye Hayden!

137 Fahn Cooper OT Cardale Jones QB - Need a QB in 4-5 years? Why not the one with the most physical upside.

192 DJ Pettway DE Matt Judon DE/DT - MORE PASS RUSH; speed to play outside (4.7) and size and power to play inside (30 reps 225 & 6'3 275); best of all 20 sacks in 2015 (small school but STILL)

212 Henry Kriger Coble TE Byron Marshall KR/RB/WR - Dunbar UPGRADE: 1,000 yard rusher in 2013; 1,000 yard receiver in 2015; falls due to injury

216 Geronimo Allison WR Keivarae Russell CB - blue chip talent but dogged by multiple injuries and off field issues (suspended for academic dishonesty)

217 Dan Vitale FB Quayvon Hicks FB - Vitale is best or 2nd best FB so will be gone before 6th; Hicks is monstrous but no fat at 260 plus and versatile (also plays in line TE): See yah Clutts!

UDFA Rico Gathers TE - Baylor basketball player with NFL body at 6'8 270 known for shot blocking and rebounding

Jaylon Smith has nerve damage and is not playing in 2016 and 50% of players that suffer this type of injury never come back to pre-injury level the kid may never be able to play at a NFL level, way too big of a risk in round 2.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

And instincts. And production. And level of competition. And coverage ability.

Jackson is faster, but Hargreaves tests better in every other drill in addition to the above.

I don't see why you would list production, yes Hargreaves has 2 more career ints, but Jackson had more last year and the same amount the last 2 years. Passes defended isn't even close 23 to 4 this past year and 40 to 27 for their career.

 

[texbumthelife]

I don't see why you would list production, yes Hargreaves has 2 more career ints, but Jackson had more last year and the same amount the last 2 years. Passes defended isn't even close 23 to 4 this past year and 40 to 27 for their career.

If you didn't get a chance to watch a lot of Hargreave's tape, that passes defensed number should tell you how few passes came his way, which makes his stats eye popping.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

If you didn't get a chance to watch a lot of Hargreave's tape, that passes defensed number should tell you how few passes came his way, which makes his stats eye popping.

maybe, but production is not something that you discuss in a subjective matter. you can weigh level of competition and opportunity, but no matter how you slice it, Jackson was more productive this season and has been as well if you look at the last two.

 

[BAT]

Jaylon Smith has nerve damage and is not playing in 2016 and 50% of players that suffer this type of injury never come back to pre-injury level the kid may never be able to play at a NFL level, way too big of a risk in round 2.

I believe that is yet to be confirmed. But if so, then still take chance in 5th, maybe even 4th. Smith is too talented worth the risk.

 

[texbumthelife]

maybe, but production is not something that you discuss in a subjective matter. you can weigh level of competition and opportunity, but no matter how you slice it, Jackson was more productive this season and has been as well if you look at the last two.

I would say teams being terrified to throw your way should certainly be measured as production. If anything, that's the greatest sign of production a DB can possibly have. Unfortunately, there is no way to track "times a QB ignored his side of the field."

 

[Manwiththeplan]

I would say teams being terrified to throw your way should certainly be measured as production. If anything, that's the greatest sign of production a DB can possibly have. Unfortunately, there is no way to track "times a QB ignored his side of the field."

lol, yea, no real way to quantify that. but...ints and passes defended (23 is a ridiculous amount btw) does quantify something, even if it is not the end all be all.

 

[texbumthelife]

lol, yea, no real way to quantify that. but...ints and passes defended (23 is a ridiculous amount btw) does quantify something, even if it is not the end all be all.

Agreed. I haven't put down Jackson at all. I've even gone on record saying he's a good prospect. I simply think Hargreaves is a superior corner right now.