My Fab Five

[Dough Boy]

In not particular order, in the first round I would take one of the following:
1. DeCastro
2. Glenn
3. Poe
4. Ingram
5. Kirkpatrick

I'm assuming Coples or Claiborne will not be available. If we resign Spencer, I would drop Ingram off the list. If we sign Carr, I would drop Kirkpatrick off the list. If we sign Nicks, I would drop Glenn off the list put I would be inclined to keep DeCastro on the list and flip a coin between DeCastro and Poe at 14 if both were available. My one fear with Poe, can he be motivated. I have no fears with DeCastro.

I don't view OG as playmakers as they seldom change the landscape of a game by themselves. Left Tackles are playmakers as they can shut down a teams best pass rusher one on one and allow the OC to give help to another lineman. That being said, it would be hard to ignore that DeCastro is a special player. I viewed LA (Larry Allen) as a playmaker as he played OG and Left Tackle during the same season. Think about that for a moment. Guys talk about the challenge of switching from Right Tackle to Left Tackle (during training camp); Allen switched between OG and LOT during the course of a game. That is a playmaker in my mind. I don't think DeCastro will have that impact, but I view him as having Nicks type impact. I think DeCastro compares favorably to Steve Hutchinson. Would I spend the 14th pick in the draft to get Steve Hutchinson; in a word - YES

I think Poe compares favorably to Holigati Nata (sp). The questions around him during the draft was his desire. He was noted as taking plays off and not always giving top effort. Those questions have been answered as he is now considered to be one of the best DT in the game. Nata's versatility makes him a playmaker. He must be accounted for on every snap and he has single handedly ruins series for opposing offenses.

Here is the rub, I think DeCastro is closer to Hutchinson than Poe is to Nata. I would say given the option, I would take Nata over Hutchinson and not lose any sleep over the decision. You just don't find many 350lb men that run sub 5.0 forty's. They eat up valuable real estate, they force double teams, they allow other players to make plays - even aging LB's (Ray Lewis) look good behind him because he keeps them clean. But he's not just big; he's quick also which creates a 2nd problem. He may split the double team. The offense sent two guys to block him, he beat them both - now 2 defenders are free to attack the ball carrier. No matter how you slice it; big fast guys in the middle of the defense wreck havoc.

Can Poe have this type of impact? That is the million dollar question. But IF he can; how can you pass up on this. Poe and DeCastro are the two players I want most. Unfortunately, I don't have the resources to fully vet either. The Front Office needs to meet with Poe's coaches, former players, opposing players, friends, etc... in order to get to the bottom line. Why did a guy with this much talent (see combine) have limited performance (see his stats) against not so good competition (see game schedule). Maybe there is an answer, opposing offenses double and triple teamed him, he played hurt, he did exactly what the scheme asked him to do. The question needs to asked and the FO needs to feel good about the answer.

I can't see Poe getting out of the first round. The Giants will take him. They believe in building the team through its front line. He is the big/fast guy they gravitate toward. I think the Pats would take him also. I recall that BJ Raji had maturity questions coming out of BC. He cleared those up the following year. Poe decided to leave one year early. Can he answer the questions?

 

[visionary]

great post

for Poe, the question is around effort not talent

it is interesting to note that similar questions surrounded other similar guys (Ngata and Raji) who have since proven their worth and then some

you put together his talent and the position he plays, he is a no-brainer at 14 IF he can

convince our scouts that he is the real deal, i would go

Rd 1: Poe
Rd 2: Osemele/Silatolu
Rd 3: CB

 

[Woods]

Great post DB.

I think you make some great points.

First, the issue regarding motivation is that you don't really know how a guy will respond. As you know, when some guys get the big money, it changes their desire to be great. This has to be the most important point regarding Poe in getting right.

Second, it has been said that because his college team was so bad, all that opposing coaches had to do was gameplan for him. And they supposedily did. From what I understand, Poe was often double teamed and even tripled teamed on occasion. (I can't verifty this as true, however.) This may explain his relatively poor stats.

My last point, IMO, it does take dedication in the weight room to put up 44 reps in the bench press and run like he did. There are a lot of big guys who are basically just fat. Poe isn't one of them. He is athletic. That said, I don't know if he bascially dedicated himself for the Combine and slacked off too much on the field.

 

[VACowboy]

great post

for Poe, the question is around effort not talent

it is interesting to note that similar questions surrounded other similar guys (Ngata and Raji) who have since proven their worth and then some

you put together his talent and the position he plays, he is a no-brainer at 14 IF he can

convince our scouts that he is the real deal, i would go

Rd 1: Poe
Rd 2: Osemele/Silatolu
Rd 3: CB

Unfortunaely, the problem is, you won't know unless you pick him. He had half Ngata's crappy final college season production. What are the odds that he's Albert Haynesworth instead of Haloti Ngata? Are you willing to take that bet?

 

[JackWagon]

i really wanna go POE ... but i cant take a question mark in the first round. I go Decastro if hes there at #14 with POE as my backup. Then probably Hightower and Kleuchy next 2 candidates.

 

[Dough Boy]

Great post DB.

I think you make some great points.

First, the issue regarding motivation is that you don't really know how a guy will respond. As you know, when some guys get the big money, it changes their desire to be great. This has to be the most important point regarding Poe in getting right.

Second, it has been said that because his college team was so bad, all that opposing coaches had to do was gameplan for him. And they supposedily did. From what I understand, Poe was often double teamed and even tripled teamed on occasion. (I can't verifty this as true, however.) This may explain his relatively poor stats.

My last point, IMO, it does take dedication in the weight room to put up 44 reps in the bench press and run like he did. There are a lot of big guys who are basically just fat. Poe isn't one of them. He is athletic. That said, I don't know if he bascially dedicated himself for the Combine and slacked off too much on the field.

You summed up Poe nicely. I do think it takes dedication in the weight room to push out 44 reps. You don't get to 44 over a two week span. The 44 numbers tells me he is constantly in the weight room. The on the field play is a question, based on what I've read. Me personally, I don't care about the lack of production. If he is doubled or tripled team, it would explain the production.

My question, does he not go all out. Does he lose some of his explosion; not because he is tired but because he just doesn't care about beating the man in front of him. If it is conditioning, I think the team can fix that. One, we play a rotation and two he will have all day to train and split the day between training and going to class.

I would want to know, that whipping his man on every play is in his DNA. That trait can not be coached up. Either you have it (Ray Lewis) or you don't (Albert Haynesworth).

 

[Zimmy Lives]

Throw Kuchey-koo in there and it works for me!

 

[CATCH17]

I like everything about Poe except hearing about his on the field effort.


We need players who will impose their will on other teams.

The Dallas Cowboys have a lot of proven talented quitters. Especially on the defense.


If he doesn't impose his will on opposing offenses than ill pass.

 

[Zimmy Lives]

I like everything about Poe except hearing about his on the field effort.


We need players who will impose their will on other teams.

The Dallas Cowboys have a lot of proven talented quitters. Especially on the defense.


If he doesn't impose his will on opposing offenses than ill pass.

That would be any one of the three Alabama kids on defense.

 

[Dough Boy]

Unfortunaely, the problem is, you won't know unless you pick him. He had half Ngata's crappy final college season production. What are the odds that he's Albert Haynesworth instead of Haloti Ngata? Are you willing to take that bet?

You and I can not find out; but this is exactly what scouts are paid to do. They also should be talking to the coaching staff, former teammates and guys he played against.

This should not be a complete roll of the dice for the FO. I will admit, that it is a bit of a binary option for us 'Mock Drafters'. We just don't have the resources. But in the "RW" Real World, great scouting departments have more hits than misses because they go the extra step.

In my mind, scouting is not just about picking talent; at its best, it is about being able to say why this guy is good or why this guy will fit our scheme. The scouts need to be able to say, he stats are low because he played the entire season with a fractured forearm but he never talked about it to the media. Instead of the lack of production tag; he now gets the played through pain tag.

Or, a scout should say, he doesn't take plays off, half way through the season he was diagnosed with asthama. With proper medication, he will be 100% go all the time. Again, we can't say that but the scouts should.

 

[visionary]

You and I can not find out; but this is exactly what scouts are paid to do. They also should be talking to the coaching staff, former teammates and guys he played against.

This should not be a complete roll of the dice for the FO.

this is what i am talking about

after all, GB and baltimore found a way to figure out that it was fine to take Raji and Ngata, what process did they employ

in fact, Cleveland had the 11th pick and B'More had the 12th

Cleveland was said to be interested in Ngata and Kamerion Wimberly

B'More traded one of their late picks to go up one spot and select Ngata because they did not want to take the chance of Cleveland drafting him

that is how sure they were of Ngata

at that time, folks in Cleveland were very happy because to them Ngata and Wimberly rated the same and "we got an extra pick"

of course we all know how that turned out

good front offices make good decisions

i hope we make the correct decision on this one

if Poe is the real deal, he can change our defense completely and have a huge impact

 

[Dough Boy]

good front offices make good decisions

Spot On!

Nice touch with the Brown's story. You just can't miss in the 1st round.

 

[Cowboyz88]

Regarding Poe and as others have said, I have had my fill of guys whose effort is questionable, and I'm all about having rabid dogs on the field.

I want guys who love the sport and the physicality and bring it all the time.

Basically, we don't need anymore mentally soft guys, so I say pass on Poe.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

Unfortunaely, the problem is, you won't know unless you pick him. He had half Ngata's crappy final college season production. What are the odds that he's Albert Haynesworth instead of Haloti Ngata? Are you willing to take that bet?

I'll bet you a million dollars he doesn't stomp on a players face his entire career.

You in?