New Rule for Celebrating

[Stautner]

No difference... celebrating in the NFL IN GENERAL began as something spontaneous and evolved into what it is now... and it is not even close to true these 3 receivers have developed it that much... Ernest Givens "Electric Shake" was being done in the mid-80s and that shake still is one of the most innovative dances the NFL has done...

this has been going on for over 20 years.... "Ikky Shuffle"...

There is a difference - the Lambeau Leap is a quick display of emotion, much like jumping into a teammates arms - and that's the key. Pretending to fall asleep in the endzone or talking on a cell phone planted in the end zone or pulling out a Sharpie are not displays of emotion, they are pre-planned one act plays.

The NFL isn't trying to curb emotion, they are trying to curb choreographed theatrics meant to draw attention to one's self and away from the game. That's why TO's arm swinging display a few weeks ago was allowed but his sleeping act wasn't.

 

[YosemiteSam]

I hate selective inforcement. In the Colts game, they spike the football (not a crime as far as I know) The ball bounces at a Patriots player (clearly it wasn't intentional) it's a penalty, if it doesn't then no foul. How do you dem something excessive? TO laid down like he was sleeping (penalty) but jumping into the stands is not excessive. Pretending to shoot a basket ball (as long as the whole team doesn't do it together) is not excessive. It's stupid.

I tell you one other thing that pissed me off last night in the Colts game. The judge (not sure who it was) was behind the QB on a QB sneak by Brady. Seeing the reply several times you couldn't tell if he actually made it or not, yet this judge who in no way could have actually see if he crossed the line calls a first down without measuring and has them move the sticks before even the booth can review which they did and you still couldn't tell if he crossed the line which he just let go anyhow.

The quality of refereeing in the NFL I've noticed is starting to drop to the level of the NBA in some games.

 

[SultanOfSix]

I disagree with this completely. The "Lambeau Leap" began as a spontaneous thing, and though it developed into a tradition, it was never the pre-planned theatrical production that TO and Chad Johnson and Steve Smith developed, and it is much closer to the kind of quick, get it over and done show of emotion after a TD that the NFL allows (and should allow).

So, something that is spontaneous (if that is supposedly how the "Lambeau Leap" came about which is probably debatable), is now the determining factor in what is "excessive" celebration and what isn't?

Also, how do you know TO planned this? He could have done it just as spontaneously as well, and his "excessive celebration" was also shorter than the the leap which fits the excessive label perfectly.

 

[Hoov]

People will watch because they love football. I really do not know anyone who watches football every week just to see dancing in the endzone. The game is what most people love. College pulls big time ratings yet there is no endzone celebrations allowed, NFL allows it but they are trying to get some control over it.

I would bet a bunch that if you take away TD's from players that celebrate (and beleive me, some of them will still do it) fans will get fed up with the nfl very fast. Especially if it costs your team a game or two and they miss playoffs. You cannot control everyones behavior by increasing the severity of the penalty to the extremes.

 

[Stautner]

So, something that is spontaneous (if that is supposedly how the "Lambeau Leap" came about which is probably debatable), is now the determining factor in what is "excessive" celebration and what isn't?

Also, how do you know TO planned this? He could have done it just as spontaneously as well, and his "excessive celebration" was also shorter than the the leap which fits the excessive label perfectly.

Spontaneous is "A" factor, but not the only one. You must have conveniently missed my previous comments about shows of emotion as opposed to pre-meditated, choreographed one act plays. That is a much bigger difference.

 

[WV Cowboy]

You cannot control everyones behavior by increasing the severity of the penalty to the extremes.

Yes, yes you can, ... or at least in this case you can.

I don't think any player would celebrate his own TD if that meant they would take HIS TD away.

I just don't think they would still do it, ... why would they if it meant what they just did wouldn't count ?

We would soon forget EZ celebrations and move forward with football.

 

[SultanOfSix]

Spontaneous is "A" factor, but not the only one. You must have conveniently missed my previous comments about shows of emotion as opposed to pre-meditated, choreographed one act plays. That is a much bigger difference.

No, I saw it. Your point is still irrelevant because it isn't possible to prove that an act is spontaneous or pre-meditated on the football field now that props aren't allowed.

 

[Hoov]

It's not an entertainment business, .. it is football. Yes, football is entertaining, but nobody watches just to see the celebrations.



My point was if the NFL wanted to stop it, that would make players stop.

I don't think it would ever have to be enforced.

Let them celebrate on the sidelines.

Even if you stop the celebrations, people will still watch.

But it is an entertainment business at the NFL level. Football is a sport that people like you and I respect and admire and even love. But we are not representative of the whole NFL audience, i know many people who watch football but dont really get it and would never consider chatting on a message board anything but a waste of time. furthermore, many of them dont even know their teams win-loss record or who they play next week. for a lot of poeple, its just a stupid game but its a time to drink beer and yell at the tv for the guy with the ball to run harder. and the more ratings tv gets, the more money flows into the nfl, the more hype a star gets, the more nfl paraphanelia gets sold and thats more money to the nfl.

Why do you think those clowns get to broadcast MNF, because someone in the nfl wants to lighten the mood, keep things funny and lively to generate more intrest from people that are ho-hum about football. Thats why they protect qb's more and more and call PI so stiffly, they want more scoring to make the nfl more fun, more exciting.

For you and me it is less exciting because we see the sacred game getting tarnished, but for the average joe that did not grow up loving football, they dont see the beauty of hard fought smashmouth football game with great blocking and tackling and nasty hitting. The average Joe gets excited about a broken play that goes 50 yards and involved 5 blown tackles from poor defensive effort or a qb and wr playing simple game of catch all day because the rules favor wr so much and they call it a great play.

Everything is driven by getting more intrest (even now the nfl is trying to genereate intrest in other countries by playing preseason games all over the world) so that it will equate to more dollars.

 

[WV Cowboy]

But it is an entertainment business at the NFL level. Football is a sport that people like you and I respect and admire and even love. But we are not representative of the whole NFL audience, i know many people who watch football but dont really get it and would never consider chatting on a message board anything but a waste of time. furthermore, many of them dont even know their teams win-loss record or who they play next week. for a lot of poeple, its just a stupid game but its a time to drink beer and yell at the tv for the guy with the ball to run harder. and the more ratings tv gets, the more money flows into the nfl, the more hype a star gets, the more nfl paraphanelia gets sold and thats more money to the nfl.

Why do you think those clowns get to broadcast MNF, because someone in the nfl wants to lighten the mood, keep things funny and lively to generate more intrest from people that are ho-hum about football. Thats why they protect qb's more and more and call PI so stiffly, they want more scoring to make the nfl more fun, more exciting.

For you and me it is less exciting because we see the sacred game getting tarnished, but for the average joe that did not grow up loving football, they dont see the beauty of hard fought smashmouth football game with great blocking and tackling and nasty hitting. The average Joe gets excited about a broken play that goes 50 yards and involved 5 blown tackles from poor defensive effort or a qb and wr playing simple game of catch all day because the rules favor wr so much and they call it a great play.

Everything is driven by getting more intrest (even now the nfl is trying to genereate intrest in other countries by playing preseason games all over the world) so that it will equate to more dollars.

As I read through your post, I agreed with EVERY SINGLE WORD !! (you dog you)

But I still say even if there were no celebrations, .. ALL OF US would still watch for all of the reasons you mention above, .. and that was the only point I was trying to make here.

 

[Clove]

NO offense, but what does this penalty have to do with the out come of this game? NADA!!!!! If you don't believe me, just go back and watch the entire game. I didn't like the celebration, but we have more important issues to discuss about this horrible game, like Parcells giving up an entire minute and ten seconds at the end of the game we could've used to get us closer to the field goal, or even a touch down.

 

[Derinyar]

There are several levels of entertainment. The sporting event is one level, I hope thats the level we all watch for. The celebrations, from meaningless tackles to sacks to TD's, are a different level. I for one know I wouldn't watch less if players didn't do some of the stupid celebrations. If TO didn't know that would get him play on Sports Center for most of the next week, he wouldn't do it.

 

[Stautner]

No, I saw it. Your point is still irrelevant because it isn't possible to prove that an act is spontaneous or pre-meditated on the football field now that props aren't allowed.

Really? You think the sleeping thing just popped in TO's mind immediately after scoring a TD?

Have you ever scored a TD or slid into home or sunk a key basket?

If you have you would know how ridiculous your comment is. In those situations you want to jump up and down, receive the adualation of teammates, show your joy.

Laying down and feigning sleep is not a spontanous or instantaneous reaction, nor is it a display of emotion.

The Lambeau Leap is not choreographed - it isn't intended to accomplish anything other than as a quick display of emotion shared with fans.

If you personally don't mind the TO type of "celebration" that's fine - that's an opinion you have a right to, but to act as if feigning sleep is anything more than a choreographed one act play designed to call attention to an individual is both ridiculous and mindless.

 

[Hoov]

As I read through your post, I agreed with EVERY SINGLE WORD !! (you dog you)

But I still say even if there were no celebrations, .. ALL OF US would still watch for all of the reasons you mention above, .. and that was the only point I was trying to make here.

Yes WV, i would still watch and you would too.

And as PO'd as i get about the cowboys from time to time, as soon as i see the players wearing the star and warming up pregame, all the crap from last week seems to just disappear and its game time all over again with a fresh start and i have to watch.

 

[SultanOfSix]

Really? You think the sleeping thing just popped in TO's mind immediately after scoring a TD?

Have you ever scored a TD or slid into home or sunk a key basket?

If you have you would know how ridiculous your comment is. In those situations you want to jump up and down, receive the adualation of teammates, show your joy.

Laying down and feigning sleep is not a spontanous or instantaneous reaction, nor is it a display of emotion.

The Lambeau Leap is not choreographed - it isn't intended to accomplish anything other than as a quick display of emotion shared with fans.

If you personally don't mind the TO type of "celebration" that's fine - that's an opinion you have a right to, but to act as if feigning sleep is anything more than a choreographed one act play designed to call attention to an individual is both ridiculous and mindless.

Why not? You're assuming the "Lambeau Leap" was some spontaneous reaction. Who's to say that one day a GB Packer was in the locker room, came up with the idea, and said "Hey, if we score a touchdown, let's all jump in the stands to celebrate with the fans?"

Can you read TO's mind?

And my point had to do with actually proving that something is pre-mediated or not, which refs can't do. It's impossible.

 

[Grim21Reaper]

Yes but as Owens said..."It's what I do"

I still can't believe a fellow team member didn't get in his face for that.

THAT said a lot to me.

If no one on the Cowboys did anything when Haynesworth committed an assault on your center, what makes you think anyone is going to say something to Owens over this?

 

[icyhot]

NO offense, but what does this penalty have to do with the out come of this game? NADA!!!!! If you don't believe me, just go back and watch the entire game. I didn't like the celebration, but we have more important issues to discuss about this horrible game, like Parcells giving up an entire minute and ten seconds at the end of the game we could've used to get us closer to the field goal, or even a touch down.

exactlly my point

 

[WV Cowboy]

.. as soon as i see the players wearing the star and warming up pregame, all the crap from last week seems to just disappear and its game time all over again with a fresh start and i have to watch.

I hear ya my friend.

 

[Doomsday101]

I would bet a bunch that if you take away TD's from players that celebrate (and beleive me, some of them will still do it) fans will get fed up with the nfl very fast. Especially if it costs your team a game or two and they miss playoffs. You cannot control everyones behavior by increasing the severity of the penalty to the extremes.

The league can control it. If players want to cost their team I would think that team will not tolerate the player. Look college has no problem with it I don't know why grown men have an issue with it. I'm sorry I don't watch football to see guys acting like idiots I watch it because I love the game.

 

[LaTunaNostra]

NO offense, but what does this penalty have to do with the out come of this game? NADA!!!!! If you don't believe me, just go back and watch the entire game. I didn't like the celebration, but we have more important issues to discuss about this horrible game, like Parcells giving up an entire minute and ten seconds at the end of the game we could've used to get us closer to the field goal, or even a touch down.

The penalty ended up not effecting the outcome of the game, unless you are willing to build some kind of esoteric chain-reaction case, hypothetical series of events of what coulda-shoulda-woulda.

And I'm not.

It's the long term effect of selfishness that concerns me. It's the character of the team that worries me. It's lack of unity and sportsmanship.

I loathe selfishness, and self-aggrandizing premeditated displays that cost yardage..it reflects putting the individual before the team. And that is imo, the worst thing a player can do - put his own ego before the team's good.

I belabored this enough last night, but I feel bad for Owens that he dropped that ball. That was not his 'crime' last night - no one is perfect.

But for once again exalting himself over his team, he deserves to be castigated - regardless of the short term outcome of his act.

Team character, like individual character - it's what matters most. Not just for the obvious 'moral reason' that commitment to team is always preferable to selfishness, but because in today's 'parity' laden NFL, team character..cohesion, unity, moral toughness, is what will separate the winners from equally talented losers.

 

[icyhot]

Before the Philly game there was a long thread about saying what celebration they wanted TO to do. The first game in Jax people came on here wanting him to celebrate when we were down. He tossed th eball to the ref. Now that he does celebrate on a play that puts us up by a TD,people want to criticize him. I can see if you get on him for a dropped pass. Get on the others as well. My point is be consistent and criticize the others as well. Just my point.