nfl network Charley Casserly's top 10 OT

[dbair1967]

Except Ted Thompson. The guy can't miss right now.

He's missed on some, its just people like to excuse the flavor of the month for whatever mishaps they may have made.

He's been running their drafts since 2005, if you think he hasnt missed on anyone you need to google NFL draft history for the Green Bay Packers. There's plenty of early misses there.

 

[realtick]

Perhaps but the argument can easily be made that it's a major assumption to think that he can keep the weight on as well. He has had a history of having difficulty keeping weight on since long before now. It's not such a stretch to think that it's still an issue.

He's also addressed why it was hard for him to maintain weight at USC. He wasn't getting the calorie intake he needed. He's an athlete, a standard 2,000-2,500 calorie-per-day diet isn't going to do it for an athlete, let alone one 6'5" 280 lbs who is likely burning 3,500-4,000 calories easily between weight training and practice.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

He's also addressed why it was hard for him to maintain weight at USC. He wasn't getting the calorie intake he needed. He's an athlete, a standard 2,000-2,500 calorie-per-day diet isn't going to do it for an athlete, let alone one 6'5" 280 lbs who is likely burning 3,500-4,000 calories easily between weight training and practice.

Honestly, does this jive with you? I have no idea what your athletic background is but I assume you played some football at some point. Have you ever heard of a strength and conditioning coach or an OL coach who would not correct this situation? He is a former TE who was moved to RT. It would be a major priority for the coaching staff to ensure that he gained weight and that would mean a dietary work up along with a metabolic panel to understand how his body is burning calories. Basically doing everything and anything you can to put weight on the guy. It just doesn't make sense to me that he would not be taking in sufficient caloric intake in order to gain weight. I don't know, that story is just hard for me to take seriously. It suggests that nobody was watching this kid and that's not how it works at major college level football programs and especially if your a guy who is projected to be a 1st round pick in the NFL. If anything, USC is known for using ANY and all methods to put muscle and weight on players.

 

[realtick]

Honestly, does this jive with you? I have no idea what your athletic background is but I assume you played some football at some point. Have you ever heard of a strength and conditioning coach or an OL coach who would not correct this situation? He is a former TE who was moved to RT. It would be a major priority for the coaching staff to ensure that he gained weight and that would mean a dietary work up along with a metabolic panel to understand how his body is burning calories. Basically doing everything and anything you can to put weight on the guy. It just doesn't make sense to me that he would not be taking in sufficient caloric intake in order to gain weight. I don't know, that story is just hard for me to take seriously. It suggests that nobody was watching this kid and that's not how it works at major college level football programs and especially if your a guy who is projected to be a 1st round pick in the NFL. If anything, USC is known for using ANY and all methods to put muscle and weight on players.

Yeah it jives completely to me.

If you take the stance like "USC will do anything and everything (insinuating that they advocate steroids)" then there isn't much to disarm your theories.

The reality is USC does not have personel to watch every kid on the roster. USC, nor any school is responsible for supplying a player with personal dieticians, cooks, protein shakes, et cetera.

As a soon-to-be millionaire, he will have the ability to have all of that and more.

You can try to demonize USC like "ah, they supply their players everything over there," but that simply isn't true.

Smith gave his explanation that he lived off of campus and was at times only eating one or two meals a day and often in his words "junkfood." Some assume that junkfood equates to high calories, which it typically does. It does not however mean nutritious, as in protein, vitamins, et cetera.

Further, moving forward, a man's metabolism typically only slows down as they age in their 20's regardless of their athletic activity and he should have no problems maintaining weight.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Yeah it jives completely to me.

If you take the stance like "USC will do anything and everything (insinuating that they advocate steroids)" then there isn't much to disarm your theories.

The reality is USC does not have personel to watch every kid on the roster. USC, nor any school is responsible for supplying a player with personal dieticians, cooks, protein shakes, et cetera.

As a soon-to-be millionaire, he will have the ability to have all of that and more.

You can try to demonize USC like "ah, they supply their players everything over there," but that simply isn't true.

Smith gave his explanation that he lived off of campus and was at times only eating one or two meals a day and often in his words "junkfood." Some assume that junkfood equates to high calories, which it typically does. It does not however mean nutritious, as in protein, vitamins, et cetera.

Further, moving forward, a man's metabolism typically only slows down as they age in their 20's regardless of their athletic activity and he should have no problems maintaining weight.

I don't agree with this. I know that Major College Programs follow dietary programs very closely. Heck, when Taylor Mays and Brian Cushing were there, they were having specially prepared meals delivered to them at their apartment while at USC.

Does USC use roids? Well, you don't have to convince me that they are not guilty of this practice. You would have to convince the NFL.

http://blogs.chron.com/nfl/2009/04/draft_scenarios_for_the_texans.html


As to ages that metabolisms change, there is no hard and fast age that this occurs. Metabolic rates are linked directly to muscle mass. So in effect, Metabolic rate could change early in life or later in life, depending on how active you stay and how seriously you build muscle.

 

[Dough Boy]

I don't agree with this. I know that Major College Programs follow dietary programs very closely. Heck, when Taylor Mays and Brian Cushing were there, they were having specially prepared meals delivered to them at their apartment while at USC.

Does USC use roids? Well, you don't have to convince me that they are not guilty of this practice. You would have to convince the NFL.

http://blogs.chron.com/nfl/2009/04/draft_scenarios_for_the_texans.html


As to ages that metabolisms change, there is no hard and fast age that this occurs. Metabolic rates are linked directly to muscle mass. So in effect, Metabolic rate could change early in life or later in life, depending on how active you stay and how seriously you build muscle.

No comment about Ware playing DE at 248lbs. Like Smith, Ware was underweight and like Smith, Ware had to be projected to a new position, OLB.

In my mind, Ware's development shoots holes in your weight/ playing a new position theory. Clearly Ware was underweight as a collge DE. He has gained the weight, and kept it on, would you not agree. Why can't Smith?

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

No comment about Ware playing DE at 248lbs. Like Smith, Ware was underweight and like Smith, Ware had to be projected to a new position, OLB.

In my mind, Ware's development shoots holes in your weight/ playing a new position theory. Clearly Ware was underweight as a collge DE. He has gained the weight, and kept it on, would you not agree. Why can't Smith?

Sure, but it was not weight gained in the space of 6 months during the off seasons. Ware came in at 245 lbs and over the course of three years, has managed to gain 20 lbs. That's a much more natural method. It suggests a healthy regimented weight training program. Ultimately, the difference is the position. Ware plays Weakside LB in a 34. Smith is projected to Right Tackle if he is picked by Dallas at 9. It's a different world, as is the method in which each player gained weight.

Lastly, I have said repeatedly that I believe Smith probably could gain that weight eventually. That's really not something that is contested. It's about this year and would he be able to keep the weight on and play RT this year?

 

[Dough Boy]

Sure, but it was not weight gained in the space of 6 months during the off seasons. Ware came in at 245 lbs and over the course of three years, has managed to gain 20 lbs. That's a much more natural method. It suggests a healthy regimented weight training program. Ultimately, the difference is the position. Ware plays Weakside LB in a 34. Smith is projected to Right Tackle if he is picked by Dallas at 9. It's a different world, as is the method in which each player gained weight.

Lastly, I have said repeatedly that I believe Smith probably could gain that weight eventually. That's really not something that is contested. It's about this year and would he be able to keep the weight on and play RT this year?

No offense, and I hope you don't take it this way, but you are really nit picking. Do you actually know how Smith gained his weight? USC did not go to the bowl this year, thus Smith season was over around Thanksgiving. From late Nov to the combine, he gained 20lbs. He gained 20lbs in 4 months and maintained his quickness. He gained 5lbs a month. That's a little over 1lb per week. I don't know how you get more natural than that. Most weight loss experts tell you that weight loss of more than 1-2lbs per week is unhealthy. I'm not nutritionist, but I would imagine that weight gain would be in the same category.

Also, the days of the big road grading RT is a thing of the past. Def Coord seek out the weak link and now force the teams weakest Tackle to defend their best pass rusher. Plus, giving the offense philosophy of Red (he wants to run Felix wide and throw the deep ball) we need a RT that can man-up. If we get too tackles that can go one on one that frees Witten up to make plays.

Just food for thought.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

No offense, and I hope you don't take it this way, but you are really nit picking. Do you actually know how Smith gained his weight? USC did not go to the bowl this year, thus Smith season was over around Thanksgiving. From late Nov to the combine, he gained 20lbs. He gained 20lbs in 4 months and maintained his quickness. He gained 5lbs a month. That's a little over 1lb per week. I don't know how you get more natural than that. Most weight loss experts tell you that weight loss of more than 1-2lbs per week is unhealthy. I'm not nutritionist, but I would imagine that weight gain would be in the same category.

Also, the days of the big road grading RT is a thing of the past. Def Coord seek out the weak link and now force the teams weakest Tackle to defend their best pass rusher. Plus, giving the offense philosophy of Red (he wants to run Felix wide and throw the deep ball) we need a RT that can man-up. If we get too tackles that can go one on one that frees Witten up to make plays.

Just food for thought.

Inaccurate. USC's last game was Dec. 4th against UCLA. USC won that game 28-14. The Combine was held on February 24th thru March 1st.

Tryon Smith weighed in at 307 lbs at that time. I don't know everything there is to know about how Smith gained his weight but I know that he gained it in a period of just under three months. 82 day is what the math works out to.

As to your idea that big RTs are a thing of the past, well, if by past you mean since last season, perhaps you are correct but as of last season, thats not a very accurate statement. Do you know how many RTs started in the NFL at under 300 lbs?

 

[CATCH17]

I can binge eat for 1 weekend and gain 13 pounds of bloat... Just sayin.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I can binge eat for 1 weekend and gain 13 pounds of bloat... Just sayin.

Goes on pretty easy for me too CATCH.

:laugh2:

 

[realtick]

I don't agree with this. I know that Major College Programs follow dietary programs very closely. Heck, when Taylor Mays and Brian Cushing were there, they were having specially prepared meals delivered to them at their apartment while at USC.

This is complete vaguery.

College football programs offer nutritional advice and dietary schedules, but it's up to the individual player to abide or adhere to it. It's much in the same way programs have weight training programs. You can't make a player work hard though. Why do you think you have players coming into the league needing strengthening and conditioning.

You should know both Cushing and Taylor Mays were workout freaks, as in being consumed with their bodies. You show me some sort of proof that USC was paying for them to have personal chefs that provided them personalized dishes on the school's dime and then we'll be getting somewhere.

Does USC use roids? Well, you don't have to convince me that they are not guilty of this practice. You would have to convince the NFL.

http://blogs.chron.com/nfl/2009/04/draft_scenarios_for_the_texans.html

USC is guilty as well as many other colleges for having players on their rosters that did steroids.

That is a much different statement than saying USC is advocating its players to use steriods.

If that is the case then why just Cushing and a few others, why didn't the training staff of USC encourage the entire squad to use steroids?

Beyond that, why don't you just put it on the table instead of beating around the bush. Are you claiming Tyron Smith is doing steriods? Yes or no?

As to ages that metabolisms change, there is no hard and fast age that this occurs. Metabolic rates are linked directly to muscle mass. So in effect, Metabolic rate could change early in life or later in life, depending on how active you stay and how seriously you build muscle.

You're right, there are many factors. Men's metabolism generally starts to slow in their middle to late twenties. Further, men's musculature is easier to build or "stack" around the same age range, which is why you rarely ever see 18-19 year old professional body builders competing and winning.

This really all comes down to this: optimism or pessimism

I'm optimistic that a 6'5", 20-year old kid with nearly 37" arms, that is already 310 lbs can maintain and continue to add good weight to his frame.

That's not even a sketchy bet, but good money.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

This is complete vaguery.

College football programs offer nutritional advice and dietary schedules, but it's up to the individual player to abide or adhere to it. It's much in the same way programs have weight training programs. You can't make a player work hard though. Why do you think you have players coming into the league needing strengthening and conditioning.

You should know both Cushing and Taylor Mays were workout freaks, as in being consumed with their bodies. You show me some sort of proof that USC was paying for them to have personal chefs that provided them personalized dishes on the school's dime and then we'll be getting somewhere.

I know this. I know that any coaching staff I've ever been around had an ideal weight that they wanted me at and if I wasn't making that weight, they wanted to know why. Once they did know, they made corrections to help me get to that weight and by help me, I mean the feed me like a pig or they ran me like a grey hound. I don't buy that the coaching staff didn't know he was starving himself calorically to keep his weight down to around 280.

I don't know that Cushing and Taylor are any different then any other big time player at USC. I don't know that they worked out any harder or not. I know that somebody was paying for those meals if the University wasn't providing. I'd much rather believe that the meals were provided by the University at the request of the coaching staff but if you want to believe that they were not and that these two college kids could afford to have meals specially prepared and delivered to them at their door step three times a day, then OK. That's up to you.

USC is guilty as well as many other colleges for having players on their rosters that did steroids.

That is a much different statement than saying USC is advocating its players to use steriods.

If that is the case then why just Cushing and a few others, why didn't the training staff of USC encourage the entire squad to use steroids?

Beyond that, why don't you just put it on the table instead of beating around the bush. Are you claiming Tyron Smith is doing steriods? Yes or no?

USC is very guilty of it and it's not just Mays or Cushing. However, I don't believe that they are alone. It can be found anywhere. That pretty much goes without saying. However, referring to what is in bold, I never said this. You said this. I said that USC is famous for adding weight to their players using any and all methods available. That's a well known fact and as you yourself have admitted, on occasion they have used illegal methods with which to do it. This brings us back to the question of how they could be so successful with so many players at adding weight but fail to do so with their starting RT, Top 10 NFL prospect. I mean, it just doesn't fit.

I don't know what Smith did to add so much weight in such a short period of time but I do know this. Whatever it was, I don't believe it was very healthy for him and I don't know that he will be able to maintain it in the short term.

This really all comes down to this: optimism or pessimism

I'm optimistic that a 6'5", 20-year old kid with nearly 37" arms, that is already 310 lbs can maintain and continue to add good weight to his frame.

That's not even a sketchy bet, but good money.

I am not so optimistic. Good luck with your bet.