OLP: T. Smith, top 3 LT of all time

JoeCorrado

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Bad back would limit any person's physical abilities. The fact that he plays at what remains as a high level while competing against some of the very best athletes in the world speaks volumes about his skill set.

I also view him as one of my favorite players on this current team. That also speaks volumes for my perspective of him.
 

Cowboy Brian

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I’m not convinced he’s been better than Flozell so this seems to be a reach. Flo had his issues with penalties but he was also deaf in one ear.
What the heck, in what world is Flozell Adams even in the same conversation as Tyron
 

McKDaddy

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I disagree, Jason Peters has been the best LT.in football for a long time.
that's the real problem in this debate. Peters & Williams are right there with Tyron. So, if you aren't clearly the best of your generation, its hard to see how you can be top 3 all time.
 

McKDaddy

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according to PFF, he didn't give up a sack this year and only 15 pressures. even injured he is great.
I seriously have to question their grading as he was getting beat like a drum for most of the first half of the season. Its been pretty easy to see the difference between him at his prime where he is 3\4 yards from the QB & his guy is on the ground or has given up and him grasping to get a hand on a guy to push him past the QB or committing the penalty.
 

mattjames2010

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I seriously have to question their grading as he was getting beat like a drum for most of the first half of the season. Its been pretty easy to see the difference between him at his prime where he is 3\4 yards from the QB & his guy is on the ground or has given up and him grasping to get a hand on a guy to push him past the QB or committing the penalty.

He was never getting "beaten like a drum" - I would like you to back this up, with videos please. I'll wait.
 

mattjames2010

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why should i go thru the trouble when you can go watch almost any game?

Because you made the claim. There is getting beat, then there is "getting beat like a drum". You're also dismissing PFF....that watches the games as well. Yet, that wasn't enough for you, you "Question" their way of grading. I'm not saying they are beyond questioning, but it seems you believe you're above them with just...well claims yourself.

So, can you show me the multiple times he was getting beaten like a drum or is Smith our new scapegoat?
 

McKDaddy

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Because you made the claim. Fair enough. I don't shrink from trying to support the things I say so I will try to piece together something. If I can't post video clips, i will tell you the game specifics.

There is getting beat, then there is "getting beat like a drum". Sure, perception can come into play but if i show a guy going by him before he gets out of his stance or that he barely gets a hand on will you agree that is "getting beat like a drum"? What about committing the hold to prevent the sack?

You're also dismissing PFF....that watches the games as well. Yet, that wasn't enough for you, you "Question" their way of grading. I'm not saying they are beyond questioning, but it seems you believe you're above them with just...well claims yourself. The PFF said gave up zero sacks & only 15 pressures. Does that sound remotely correct to you having watched the games? For a team that gave up 56 sacks & often saw Dak scrambling to avoid pressure? FWIW, I'm not the only person who questions their grading metrics. At the end of the day they are trying to convert high level athletic competition into numerical values which requires that you set criteria that are subjective ... In the Panters game alone, the next days BTB article credited the Oline with a combined 10 sacks & penalties. Just saying.

So, can you show me the multiple times he was getting beaten like a drum or is Smith our new scapegoat?
I'm not looking for any scapegoats. Nor do i have any interest in putting down Smith. I am simply evaluating his play as I saw it. You focus a lot on the first half of my statement. Are you saying you don't agree with the second half of my statement? (Its been pretty easy to see the difference between him at his prime where he is 3\4 yards from the QB & his guy is on the ground or has given up versus him grasping to get a hand on a guy to push him past the QB or committing the penalty.) or was it the "drum" reference that is the root of what you take exception with?
 

mattjames2010

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I'm not looking for any scapegoats. Nor do i have any interest in putting down Smith. I am simply evaluating his play as I saw it. You focus a lot on the first half of my statement. Are you saying you don't agree with the second half of my statement? (Its been pretty easy to see the difference between him at his prime where he is 3\4 yards from the QB & his guy is on the ground or has given up versus him grasping to get a hand on a guy to push him past the QB or committing the penalty.) or was it the "drum" reference that is the root of what you take exception with?

I understand that Smith is dealing with a QB that led the league in sacks taken, as in, it wasn't on the O-Line - it was on the QB. He's dealing with a QB holding the ball too long, and even the best of the best tackles can only hold off a professional defensive player for so long. PFF most likely takes this into account....

So yes, I am not surprised by the sack and pressure total because there is context with each time a QB has a defender in his face or is hit. Wilson, Rodgers, and Prescott are 3 players known to make their offensive lines look worse than they actually are due to holding the ball too long. Rodgers and Wilson for different reasons, Rodgers looks to put the knife into a defense with big plays, Wilson often tries to extend plays with his legs, while Prescott struggles to get through his reads quick enough.

The game I remember Smith getting beat often came in the first Commanders game - but guess what? Not the first time that happened to Smith or our O-Line. It happened in 2014 as well, the Commanders always seem to confuse us with blitz packages.

A banged up Tyron Smith was still a top 10 tackle this season. We have much bigger problems to deal with - and while PFF has me scratching my head at times, I think what they are saying about Smith is probably pretty accurate because I can't remember any other game where Smith was "beat like a drum".
 

Tussinman

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Flo was a second team all-pro. Never first.... Now:
In 7 seasons.

Yeah, that Tyron.
To add to this 5x NFL top 100 and Tyron along with Joe Thomas will be getting 1st team all-decade for this upcoming 2020 class.

In a 7 year span he was able to cement himself as a 1st ballot HOF...... (that's literally insane)
 

Cowboy Brian

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To add to this 5x NFL top 100 and Tyron along with Joe Thomas will be getting 1st team all-decade for this upcoming 2020 class.

In a 7 year span he was able to cement himself as a 1st ballot HOF...... (that's literally insane)
and he is only 28 years old (birthday in December)

Could have another 5-7 years in him......

Comparing Flozell Adams to Tyron Smith is like comparing Gerald Sensabaugh to Earl Thomas
 
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