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BringBackThatOleTimeBoys;5001333 said:
the fact he has been charged with murder tells you what the police believe, whether he is found guilty of the crime is another issue
Olympic runner Oscar Pistorius charged with murder
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the fact he has been charged with murder tells you what the police believe, whether he is found guilty of the crime is another issue
BringBackThatOleTimeBoys
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^ I'd like to know what the police know.
Yes, they apparently think they have a good case against him.
Yes, they apparently think they have a good case against him.
BringBackThatOleTimeBoys
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^ 1-2 times should be enough, but 4X?
BringBackThatOleTimeBoys
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Disclaimer: I'm not a psychologist.
Is this an accident or murder?
I totally understand Pistorius overcome with emotion - who wouldn't?
If it was an accident, don't you suspect he would say things like how he will miss her - grieve?
The pictures of him have his face covered. That suggests shame - guilt.
Is this an accident or murder?
I totally understand Pistorius overcome with emotion - who wouldn't?
If it was an accident, don't you suspect he would say things like how he will miss her - grieve?
The pictures of him have his face covered. That suggests shame - guilt.
Miller
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BringBackThatOleTimeBoys;5001340 said:
I just read yesterday that the legal system there is strange. They charge people with the highest possible crime to start and go from there. The system is very expensive so by doing this it forces plea deals vs going to trial and wasting everyone's time. They may think he is good for murder but at the same time now they got the upper hand in all other negotiations...if what I read was correct.
I may be wrong. But my thinking is this....you have a hot, model girlfriend. It's Valentines. You expect to spend time with her. So I doubt surprising him in the middle of the night in a gated community (where they probably have to check you in)..is going to happen. I'm assuming she was already there. That is a piece of the puzzle I wonder if police know...the guard gate people would be able to know when she got there.
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HoustonFrog;5001695 said:
Jammer
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BringBackThatOleTimeBoys;5001368 said:
I seem to recall, not too long ago, a story about a women hiding in her closet while an intruder broke into her home and hunted her. While talking on the phone with her husband she shot the intruder 6 times. If I'm not mistaken, the intruder escaped, but still lived. So, no, 4X may not be enough.
BringBackThatOleTimeBoys
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Problem with breaking news stories is when it's posted, it's not a complete picture, but people jump to conclusions anyway.
For instance, we initially did not know shots were made thru a door and she may have been beat in the head with a bat.
For instance, we initially did not know shots were made thru a door and she may have been beat in the head with a bat.
joseephuss
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BringBackThatOleTimeBoys;5003357 said:
http://abcnews.go.com/International...portedly-eye-bloody-cricket/story?id=18527579
Police in South Africa investigating the shooting death of model Reeva Steenkamp, allegedly by boyfriend and Paralympics champion Oscar Pistorius, consider a bloody cricket bat to be a central piece of evidence, according to South Africa's City Press newspaper.
Pistorius, 26, was arrested Thursday and charged with killing Steenkamp, 29, at his home in the South African capitol of Pretoria. His family says the shooting was an accident. He is in jail awaiting a bail hearing Tuesday.
The City Press reported Sunday that police are investigating different scenarios involving the bat. Among them is the possibility that the flat-fronted bat was used in a violent argument before the shooting.
The paper also reported that Pistorius might have first shot Steenkamp in the bedroom, and that she possibly fled to the bathroom where she was shot three more times through the door.
When Pistorius' family arrived at the scene before paramedics, they saw him carrying Steenkamp down the stairs and performing mouth-to-mouth resuscitation on her, City Press reported.
WV Cowboy
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I tried to believe this guy, but now they are saying neighbors heard heated argument and yelling leading up to the shooting.
And then they heard one shot, .. and then 17 minutes later several more shots.
That does not jive with his story.
Plus they think the trajectory of the shots would have come from a height if he had his legs on, .. which he said he didn't.
What a waste.
And then they heard one shot, .. and then 17 minutes later several more shots.
That does not jive with his story.
Plus they think the trajectory of the shots would have come from a height if he had his legs on, .. which he said he didn't.
What a waste.
joseephuss
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http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/feb/20/oscar-pistorius-case-police-blunders
Oscar Pistorius case police admit investigative blunders
News
World news
Reeva Steenkamp shooting
Oscar Pistorius case police admit investigative blunders
Detective gives uncertain performance under cross-examination at Paralympic and Olympic sprinter's bail hearing
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David Smith in Pretoria
guardian.co.uk, Wednesday 20 February 2013 10.47 EST
Link to video: Oscar Pistorius appears in court for second day of bail hearing
The prosecution case against the Olympics and Paralympics star Oscar Pistorius suffered a blow on Wednesday as South African police admitted a series of blunders in their murder investigation.
Hilton Botha, the detective leading the investigation, crumbled under defence cross-examination after he wrongly claimed to have found boxes of "testosterone" in Pistorius's bedroom and admitted that police had no evidence contradicting the athlete's version of events.
The double-amputee, known as the Blade Runner, has admitted shooting dead his girlfriend, Reeva Steenkamp, 29, while she was in the bathroom of his home on 14 February, but claims he mistook her for an intruder. He denies a charge of premeditated murder.
Sitting in the dock at Pretoria magistrates court for his bail hearing, Pistorius looked more calm and composed than at any point so far, while the smiles on his family's faces suggested that they felt momentum was shifting his way.
The lead protagonist in another day of drama was chief investigating officer Botha, who initially asserted that he had found two boxes of "steroids" in Pistorius's bedroom, electrifying the courtroom. But he hastily corrected himself to say "two boxes of testosterone, needles and injections".
Later, questioned by advocate Barry Roux for the defence, Botha had to admit he could not be certain of the contents. Roux said it was a "herbal remedy" called testo-compositum co-enzyme used by many athletes, insisting: "It is not a steroid and it is not a banned substance."
***********************************************
One point of dispute is whether Pistorius was wearing his prosthetic legs when he shot through the bathroom door. In his statement on Tuesday, the athlete said he was on his stumps and feeling vulnerable when he opened fire.
But the prosecution has claimed the killing was premeditated because Pistorius took time to put on his prosthetic legs first. Botha supported this view, saying the trajectory of the bullets through the door showed the gun was fired from a height. "It seems to me it was fired down," he said.
Prosecutor Gerrie Nel projected a plan of the bedroom and bathroom on to a white screen in the court and argued Pistorius had to walk past his bed to get to the bathroom and could not have done so without realising Steenkamp was not in the bed. "There's no other way of getting there," Nel said.
Botha said the holster for the 9mm pistol was found under the side of the bed on which Steenkamp slept, also implying it would have been impossible for Pistorius to get the gun without realising that Steenkamp was not in the bed and could have been the person in the bathroom. Pistorius has claimed that the bedroom was pitch dark.
Oscar Pistorius case police admit investigative blunders
News
World news
Reeva Steenkamp shooting
Oscar Pistorius case police admit investigative blunders
Detective gives uncertain performance under cross-examination at Paralympic and Olympic sprinter's bail hearing
Share 328
inShare0
David Smith in Pretoria
guardian.co.uk, Wednesday 20 February 2013 10.47 EST
Link to video: Oscar Pistorius appears in court for second day of bail hearing
The prosecution case against the Olympics and Paralympics star Oscar Pistorius suffered a blow on Wednesday as South African police admitted a series of blunders in their murder investigation.
Hilton Botha, the detective leading the investigation, crumbled under defence cross-examination after he wrongly claimed to have found boxes of "testosterone" in Pistorius's bedroom and admitted that police had no evidence contradicting the athlete's version of events.
The double-amputee, known as the Blade Runner, has admitted shooting dead his girlfriend, Reeva Steenkamp, 29, while she was in the bathroom of his home on 14 February, but claims he mistook her for an intruder. He denies a charge of premeditated murder.
Sitting in the dock at Pretoria magistrates court for his bail hearing, Pistorius looked more calm and composed than at any point so far, while the smiles on his family's faces suggested that they felt momentum was shifting his way.
The lead protagonist in another day of drama was chief investigating officer Botha, who initially asserted that he had found two boxes of "steroids" in Pistorius's bedroom, electrifying the courtroom. But he hastily corrected himself to say "two boxes of testosterone, needles and injections".
Later, questioned by advocate Barry Roux for the defence, Botha had to admit he could not be certain of the contents. Roux said it was a "herbal remedy" called testo-compositum co-enzyme used by many athletes, insisting: "It is not a steroid and it is not a banned substance."
***********************************************
One point of dispute is whether Pistorius was wearing his prosthetic legs when he shot through the bathroom door. In his statement on Tuesday, the athlete said he was on his stumps and feeling vulnerable when he opened fire.
But the prosecution has claimed the killing was premeditated because Pistorius took time to put on his prosthetic legs first. Botha supported this view, saying the trajectory of the bullets through the door showed the gun was fired from a height. "It seems to me it was fired down," he said.
Prosecutor Gerrie Nel projected a plan of the bedroom and bathroom on to a white screen in the court and argued Pistorius had to walk past his bed to get to the bathroom and could not have done so without realising Steenkamp was not in the bed. "There's no other way of getting there," Nel said.
Botha said the holster for the 9mm pistol was found under the side of the bed on which Steenkamp slept, also implying it would have been impossible for Pistorius to get the gun without realising that Steenkamp was not in the bed and could have been the person in the bathroom. Pistorius has claimed that the bedroom was pitch dark.
CanadianCowboysFan
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Cross examination of the fuzz at a bail hearing?
Qu'elle surprise, the fuzz might have screwed up in investigating. OJ says see told ya.
Qu'elle surprise, the fuzz might have screwed up in investigating. OJ says see told ya.
CanadianCowboysFan
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I still don't know why he thinks an intruder was in the can.
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So just scanning the headlines and the lead investigator is facing attempted murder charges himself?
I swear this case gets weirder and weirder.
I swear this case gets weirder and weirder.
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Yeah from a past event. He has now been removed from the case.
Who knows, maybe Hilton Botha really killed Reeva and is framing Oscar like Freeman tried to do to OJ
Who knows, maybe Hilton Botha really killed Reeva and is framing Oscar like Freeman tried to do to OJ
joseephuss
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http://www.indianexpress.com/news/pistorius-gets-bail-does-not-represent-flight-risk/1078354/
After four days of combative hearings, a South African magistrate Friday granted bail to Oscar Pistorius, the double amputee track star accused of murdering his girlfriend in a case that has horrified and fascinated the nation and much of the world.
Magistrate Desmond Nair announced the decision after impassioned final arguments from the defence and the prosecution in Courtroom C of the Pretoria Magistrate's Court.
The magistrate said Pistorius did not represent a flight risk and was not likely to interfere with state witnesses. "The accused has made a case to be released on bail," he concluded, while the prosecution had not established a case for detaining him. Pistorius's family members in the packed courtroom shouted, "Yes!"
Magistrate Nair set bail at 1 million rand, about $112,000, and ordered a series of conditions before the case was adjourned to June 4. Pistorius was told to relinquish firearms and passports and avoid his upscale home in a gated community where he shot to death his girlfriend, Reeva Steenkamp, in what he has called an accident and prosecutors have called premeditated murder. The home is now a crime scene.
After four days of combative hearings, a South African magistrate Friday granted bail to Oscar Pistorius, the double amputee track star accused of murdering his girlfriend in a case that has horrified and fascinated the nation and much of the world.
Magistrate Desmond Nair announced the decision after impassioned final arguments from the defence and the prosecution in Courtroom C of the Pretoria Magistrate's Court.
The magistrate said Pistorius did not represent a flight risk and was not likely to interfere with state witnesses. "The accused has made a case to be released on bail," he concluded, while the prosecution had not established a case for detaining him. Pistorius's family members in the packed courtroom shouted, "Yes!"
Magistrate Nair set bail at 1 million rand, about $112,000, and ordered a series of conditions before the case was adjourned to June 4. Pistorius was told to relinquish firearms and passports and avoid his upscale home in a gated community where he shot to death his girlfriend, Reeva Steenkamp, in what he has called an accident and prosecutors have called premeditated murder. The home is now a crime scene.