On The Tape: Travis Frederick

[xwalker]

When you watch Frederick play, yes, he is very slow footed.

When you watch Cooper play, no, he is not slow footed.

Maybe they can touch cones @ equal speed but they don't play the game @ equal speed.


Supposedly our new TE is the opposite. He ran a slow 40 but plays like a 4.5 guy.

I think that Frederick played "too heavy" in college. He was listed at 338 which is way too heavy for a guy that is 6'3-5/8". He weighed 312 at the combine. I think his playing weight will be somewhere between those two numbers. He will obviously be quicker at 312 or 320 than at 338.

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

everyone trying to argue that ignored what was going on during the first round.

As usual facts trump opinion.

I don't think you understand the difference between a fact and an opinion.

 

[bsheeern]

lol you guys won't let the Murray pick go but i've hit on far more picks than i've missed.


BTW my evaluation of Murray was that he runs high, doesn't have a lot of moves, and get's hurt a lot.

What never showed up on film with him at Oklahoma was the type of power back that he would become in the NFL because he still runs high, doesn't have many moves, and gets hurt a lot.

Heck people on here thought he was going to be a slot receiver.

So, yes, I missed on Murray but there was nothing from his time @ OU that would lead me to believe that he was going to be running guys over @ the next level.

You just didn't miss brother. You said he was a waste of a draft pick and would be out if the league in 3 years.

You expect people to let that go? It speaks way more about talent evaluation than maybe you realize.

 

[burmafrd]

I don't think you understand the difference between a fact and an opinion.

I know you don't.

 

[bsheeern]

and stats lie- just like Samuel Clemens said

Costa could not carry Coopers shoes

No stats don't lie. They are facts. Written In stone.

What we as fans need to realize is that stats are only numbers. While factual numbers they should never be used without being taken with a grain of salt. Because they alone don't make you a good or bad football player.

In fact if they were heads up in a "shoe carrying contest" looks like Costa would be your man hands down. Point is, we don't, or at least I don't, watch shoe carrying competitions.

 

[burmafrd]

The guys both were tested under the same circumstances without bias, yet you want to ignore one guy's numbers. Why is that? Oh, because you are letting your personal bias even get to the point where you dispute facts because they don't fit your agenda.

And for the record, these aren't stats...they are measurements.

Can you tell me how the measurements lie? That Costa didn't really put the bar up 30 times, or have a better vertical and broad jump? The running numbers, sure, there can be some questioning unless everything was done on the exact same day, exact same conditions, exact some timing equipment...but it's obvious when all the numbers are looked at you are looking at two pretty amazingly athletic big men.

I guess you really missed the part about playing not measuring. Not surprising

 

[burmafrd]

No stats don't lie. They are facts. Written In stone.

What we as fans need to realize is that stats are only numbers. While factual numbers they should never be used without being taken with a grain of salt. Because they alone don't make you a good or bad football player.

you can twist stats around to prove any point you want to; that was what he meant

 

[xwalker]

He was playing at 345 or something last year. He ran agility drills really well at the combine. He was 315 there. Having a shuttle like that means that he can move laterally well. I am wondering what weight they want to have him at.

Time for Woicik to make his money.

Yes, I expect him to be much quicker in games at around 320 than his college listed weight of 338.

I think coming in to training camp at the correct weight is a big key to Frederick's success. I think his combine weight of 312 is too light and his college weight of 338+ is way too heavy.

 

[speedkilz88]

Actually he tested very well in the athletic drills, both the 3 cone and the short shuttle were comparable to Cooper. Not saying he is as good as Cooper, just saying his agility tested well.

The problem for Fredrick was his 40 time, that is what made him drop like a rock in a lot of draft publications. I read today that he was rated as the 27th best player in the draft until his 40 time, then most publications had him in the 2nd or 3rd round.

He doesn't seem that slow on the tape, even though he ran over a 5.0 at the combine. Was he dogging it? Was he injured and didn't tell anybody? I don't know, he just seems like he plays a lot faster than his 40 time.

He would have been a 1st round lock if he had a decent 40 time at the combine.

Combine: Gurode vs Frederick
------------------40----10---20sp---20ss---3c------vj-----bj
6 ft 4¼ in 316 lb 5.34 s 1.89 s 3.14 s 5.05 s 8.15 s 30½ in 8 ft 4 in
6 ft 3½ in 312 lb 5.58 s 1.91 s 3.14 s 4.76 s 7.81 s 28½ in 8 ft 1 in

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

and stats lie- just like Samuel Clemens said

Costa could not carry Coopers shoes

Mark Twain wrote fiction.

 

[CATCH17]

You just didn't miss brother. You said he was a waste of a draft pick and would be out if the league in 3 years.

You expect people to let that go? It speaks way more about talent evaluation than maybe you realize.

I don't remember all of the details of what I said like you do but, yes, I didn't think Demarco would be the level of back he is.

I can't evaluate what I never saw and I never saw a guy that imposed his will on teams like he has for us in his 2 years here.

Productive player in college? Absolutely. A power back with speed? No, never saw that.


It would be like Frederick coming out here in the Fall and being nimble. You just don't see it in College.


Bottom line is everyone whiffs on players and he was a whiff for me. I'll gladly put my overall hit or miss on players, especially O Linemen, against anyone.


Heck, I missed on Terrell Suggs too. I took heat for wanting Willis McGahee over Lee Suggs and Greg Jones. I had to argue with this very fan base that Demarcus Ware was much more talented than Merriman.

 

[nalam]

If he can anchor soundly first, I'll be happy, as we often saw the center pushed back into Romo's face often , no room to step up at all. I think Fred can do that , check out how strong he is waist down ,in Rafael Vela's blog.

And still he has room to grow in upper body and improve strength . Wocik should help him with that.

 

[speedkilz88]

I don't remember all of the details of what I said like you do but, yes, I didn't think Demarco would be the level of back he is.

I can't evaluate what I never saw and I never saw a guy that imposed his will on teams like he has for us in his 2 years here.

Productive player in college? Absolutely. A power back with speed? No, never saw that.


It would be like Frederick coming out here in the Fall and being nimble. You just don't see it in College.


Bottom line is everyone whiffs on players and he was a whiff for me. I'll gladly put my overall hit or miss on players, especially O Linemen, against anyone.


Heck, I missed on Terrell Suggs too. I took heat for wanting Willis McGahee over Lee Suggs and Greg Jones. I had to argue with this very fan base that Demarcus Ware was much more talented than Merriman.

You didn't see anything prior to his senior season then, because it was obvious in those games. His senior year wasn't very impressive but it was due to a horrible OL.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I don't remember all of the details of what I said like you do but, yes, I didn't think Demarco would be the level of back he is.

I can't evaluate what I never saw and I never saw a guy that imposed his will on teams like he has for us in his 2 years here.

Productive player in college? Absolutely. A power back with speed? No, never saw that.


It would be like Frederick coming out here in the Fall and being nimble. You just don't see it in College.


Bottom line is everyone whiffs on players and he was a whiff for me. I'll gladly put my overall hit or miss on players, especially O Linemen, against anyone.


Heck, I missed on Terrell Suggs too. I took heat for wanting Willis McGahee over Lee Suggs and Greg Jones. I had to argue with this very fan base that Demarcus Ware was much more talented than Merriman.

I don't remember the details but I remember you made the claim on the basis that 'he didn't scare you like Peterson did.'

 

[ABQcowboyJR]

The guy doesn't have great lateral movement IMO. When he pulls its kinda painful to watch. I think he is a smart guy that has a tendency to lean on people and not really use his hands. He will let defensive players into his chest. His second level blocking is what worries me the most. He seems to have a hard time getting to the second level and blocking his man. He tends to reach in those situations and then get beat. I think most of these things can be coached up and improved. I don't know if he will ever be able to pull or second level block very well. He does not get driven into the backfield though. He will be able to keep the pressure right up the middle off of Romo.

 

[NeonNinja]

I think that Frederick played "too heavy" in college. He was listed at 338 which is way too heavy for a guy that is 6'3-5/8". He weighed 312 at the combine. I think his playing weight will be somewhere between those two numbers. He will obviously be quicker at 312 or 320 than at 338.

Good point.

 

[CATCH17]

I don't remember the details but I remember you made the claim on the basis that 'he didn't scare you like Peterson did.'

Lol nobody scares me like Peterson does so I don't know why I would've said that.

 

[CATCH17]

You didn't see anything prior to his senior season then, because it was obvious in those games. His senior year wasn't very impressive but it was due to a horrible OL.

I've followed Murray since before he was a Freshman coming out of Las Vegas and he was always more finesse.

Most Sooner fans thought he was the next Reggie Bush when he was recruited there.

 

[speedkilz88]

I've followed Murray since before he was a Freshman coming out of Las Vegas and he was always more finesse.

Most Sooner fans thought he was the next Reggie Bush when he was recruited there.

You're just digging a deeper hole then. His first year he was smaller and faster but after that he was getting bigger & showed the power.