Phelps and what I don't understand about Olympic swimming medals

[Doomsday101]

In Olympic weight lifting, one medal is awarded based upon the athletes performance on two lifts: the Snatch and the Clean-and-Jerk (there was a third lift, the Press, but it was eliminated after the 1972 games).

If Olympic medals were awarded for each of these two (or three) lifts in addition to the all-around medal that is currently awarded, Vasiliy Alekseyev (sometimes translated to Alexeev or Alexeyev) would have tripled the number of Olympic medals that he won.

Would Alexseyev had been any "better" or more "dominant" had he collected the extra medals? Of course not. He was the greatest and most dominant lifter of his time and perhaps of all time. The absolute number of medals doesn't mean squat.

And speaking of dominance - Between 1970 and 1977, Alexseyev set 80 world records and was undefeated. Let that sink in for a moment. 80 world records. Undefeated for 8 years.

He was pretty good.

----

Teófilo Stevenson won "only" three gold medals, but he was a man among boys in the boxing ring.

----

Using Phelps medal count as evidence of his greatness over athletes of other sports is just plain silly.

Phelps is a very talented swimmer who has the good fortunate of participating in a medal rich sport at a time of technological improvements to his sport.

Who said these athletes you named were not great? Phelps is doing his proving where in counts in competition against other world class talent and he has shown himself to be head and shoulders above all others. Is he the greatest Olympian? that is really a matter of opinion just like saying who the best QB to play in the NFL was or who the greatest boxer was it comes down to peoples own opinion. I will say Phelps does not take a backseat to any Olympian and will go down as one of the all time greats of the Olympics and rightfully so

 

[thekavorka]

Phelps is destroying the field, that's true. Having said that, there has to be something up with that pool. Phelps just broak his own world record by 1.61 seconds. That's unheard of. I'm not saying he isn't the best swimmer in the world, by a very large margin. I'm saying that there has to be something up with this pool. It's not just Phelps. All the swimmers are swimming faster times.

Of course. That's not a secret. Even before the olympics started, everyone was saying that a ton of world records would be broken.

Here's a good read why:

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=93478073

This is in addition to the new swim suits.

 

[DFWJC]

Track and Field medals are similar I think....all are deserving.

 

[DragonCowboy]

Hey, hey, just be happy we're getting gold medals.

We're gonna need 'em all if we have a chance to beat the Chinese.

 

[CanadianCowboysFan]

Hightech pools? How is that possible? It's a hole filled with water.

The chinese pool is 3m deep, most are 2m deep, this one is faster as the waves are dissipated by the time the swimmers swim back to them. How that works, I have no idea as I was not a physics major, but apparently it does.

 

[ZeroClub]

The chinese pool is 3m deep, most are 2m deep, this one is faster as the waves are dissipated by the time the swimmers swim back to them. How that works, I have no idea as I was not a physics major, but apparently it does.

On top of the above, I heard that this pool is extra wide, with no one using the extreme lanes (to dissipate waves), and that the lane dividers also have a high tech design.

It's a cool pool in a great building. Sure looks to be a very impressive facility.

 

[peplaw06]

In Olympic weight lifting, one medal is awarded based upon the athletes performance on two lifts: the Snatch and the Clean-and-Jerk (there was a third lift, the Press, but it was eliminated after the 1972 games).

If Olympic medals were awarded for each of these two (or three) lifts in addition to the all-around medal that is currently awarded, Vasiliy Alekseyev (sometimes translated to Alexeev or Alexeyev) would have tripled the number of Olympic medals that he won.

Would Alexseyev had been any "better" or more "dominant" had he collected the extra medals? Of course not. He was the greatest and most dominant lifter of his time and perhaps of all time. The absolute number of medals doesn't mean squat.

And speaking of dominance - Between 1970 and 1977, Alexseyev set 80 world records and was undefeated. Let that sink in for a moment. 80 world records. Undefeated for 8 years.

He was pretty good.

----

Teófilo Stevenson won "only" three gold medals, but he was a man among boys in the boxing ring.

----

Using Phelps medal count as evidence of his greatness over athletes of other sports is just plain silly.

Phelps is a very talented swimmer who has the good fortunate of participating in a medal rich sport at a time of technological improvements to his sport.

Seems like your beef is more with the media rather than the actual swimming events.

In that case, that's just a product of the world we live in today. Every outstanding person has to be dubbed Best something of all time by the media. It sells papers, it sells magazines, it draws in viewers and sells advertising.

Remember how the 2005 USC football team was being touted as the best of all time before the Rose Bowl against Texas? Same thing. The media says, who cares if the person/team is actually done with the task at hand? You can't draw in viewers after the fact.

 

[Nors]

I don't beieve Carl Lewis has any world records today.

 

[DFWJC]

The world record times of Phelps (and others) are diluted by the superfast hightech pool and the superfast hightech one-piece longsleeved catalinas that they are all wearing.

Yes they are. Like most sports, you almost have to go by era now because of the technolgy and training techniques. It does not diminish Phelp's greatness though.

 

[Doomsday101]

Yes they are. Like most sports, you almost have to go by era now because of the technolgy and training techniques. It does not diminish Phelp's greatness though.

Well the Japan's Japan's Kosuke world record holder in 200m breaststroke won lastnight but did not break his own World record so while we have seen some great times I don't think the pool in China is that big of a factor.

 

[MrMom]

What you don't see, because they won't let the cameras show it, is the commies with AK47's standing on each end of the pool.

Those Olympian swimmers are scared and just trying to get done as fast as they can so they can get the heck away from them.

:laugh1:

 

[jimmy40]

And speaking of dominance - Between 1970 and 1977, Alexseyev set 80 world records and was undefeated. Let that sink in for a moment. 80 world records. Undefeated for 8 years.

He was pretty good.

----

Obviously ahead of the times in the steroid department.

 

[dargonking999]

Seems like your beef is more with the media rather than the actual swimming events.

In that case, that's just a product of the world we live in today. Every outstanding person has to be dubbed Best something of all time by the media. It sells papers, it sells magazines, it draws in viewers and sells advertising.

Remember how the 2005 USC football team was being touted as the best of all time before the Rose Bowl against Texas? Same thing. The media says, who cares if the person/team is actually done with the task at hand? You can't draw in viewers after the fact.

Greatest Game Ever FTW!!!

(BTW i do think Vince Young went 3rd in that draft because of that game)

 

[yeahyeah]

You know...I totally agree with you Zero.
I have never heard it put forward like that but its a valid argument.

 

[tomson75]

Ridiculous. He did it again.

He won the 100m Fly by a single water molecule.

 

[Danny White]

Ridiculous. He did it again.

He won the 100m Fly by a single water molecule.

That was insane.

I wonder how much pressure is required to "set off" the sensor or whatever they use to determine who touches first, because it looked possible that the other dude may have touched earlier or simultaneously, but because he was reaching and Phelps was thrusting, Phelps beat him.

I don't know if that even makes sense, all I know is that it looked like the guy had him dead to rights.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

7 gold medals in Beijing

 

[Yeagermeister]

That was insane.

I wonder how much pressure is required to "set off" the sensor or whatever they use to determine who touches first, because it looked possible that the other dude may have touched earlier or simultaneously, but because he was reaching and Phelps was thrusting, Phelps beat him.

I don't know if that even makes sense, all I know is that it looked like the guy had him dead to rights.

The chinese owed us one for the gymnastics. :laugh2:

 

[DallasCowpoke]

The world record times of Phelps (and others) are diluted by the superfast hightech pool and the superfast hightech one-piece longsleeved catalinas that they are all wearing.

Not sure what Olympics you're watching, but I haven't seen even one swimmer in a "one-piece longsleeved catalinas"? Even the women's suits are sleeveless, more what you'd call a T-back than anything else.

In fact, Phelps wears only bottoms that end about mid-calf.