Ralph Neely - worth it?

[THUMPER]

Ralph Neely, for those of you who are too young to remember him, was an OT who started out at RT for 5 years then moved to LT for 8 more. He was named 1st-Team All-Pro 3 straight years from 1967-69 meaning he was considered the best RT in the game for those 3 seasons.

The question about his worth arises when you look at what we gave up to get him...

Neely was drafted by the Colts in the 2nd round with the 15th overall pick of the 1965 NFL Draft. I specify "NFL Draft" because in 1965 the AFL still held a separate draft and the Houston Oilers ALSO selected Neely in the 2nd round of their draft with the 28th overall pick.

We traded our 4th rounder in 1965 (#54 overall) plus punter Billy Lothridge to the Colts for the rights to Neely and thought we got a great deal.

Unfortunately, unknown to us, Neely had already agreed to a contract with the Oilers but kept it secret so he could play in the Gator Bowl, so they took us to court. If we wanted Neely then we had to give up draft picks to Houston for him. The only problem was that there wouldn't be a joint NFL/AFL draft for another 2 years!

We had to give Houston our 1st (#23), 2nd (#49), and 2 5th rounders (#119 & #127) in the 1967 draft. We had already given up a 4th and a player to the Colts for him so in the end he cost us a 1st, 2nd, 4th, 2 5ths, and a player for a guy taken in the 2nd round!

Could you imagine the outcry if Jerry made that trade today?

Here is a blurb about it from Wikipedia:

In 1965, he was drafted in the second round of both the 1965 NFL Draft (by the Baltimore Colts) and the 1965 AFL Draft (by the Houston Oilers). The Colts would later trade his rights to the Dallas Cowboys.

Neely accepted the Oilers contract offer (which also included rights to own a Houston gas station), but requested it be kept secret to remain eligible to play in the Gator Bowl. When he learned that the Colts traded his rights to the Cowboys, he began negotiating with Dallas, and returned his check to the Oilers. Litigation ensued between the Oilers and Cowboys.

One of the terms of the merger agreement between the NFL and the AFL was that the Neely contract dispute be resolved. Dallas finally agreed to send draft choices to Houston and the incident between the Oilers and the Cowboys was the start of the annual pre-season game between the two teams, the Governor's Cup.

Back in those days 4th & 5th round picks were pretty high since there were 17 rounds in the draft (20 rounds up through 1966) so it was like giving up 5 picks in the first 3 rounds today.

That trade really hurt us in 1967 as we didn't have a pick until #76 in the 3rd round and the only player of any value we got in that draft was HoFer Rayfield Wright in the 7th round.

We could have selected HoFers CB Lem Barney and LB Willie Lanier with those 2 early picks. Barney in particular would have filled a major need at CB at the time. We took DB-Phil Clark with our 3rd rounder but he didn't pan out.

Fortunately for us, Neely was a great player but he wasn't absolutely necessary for us at the time as it turned out with Wright becoming a fixture at RT anyway and we had Tony Liscio at LT already. It wasn't until Liscio retired that Neely slid over to the left side and Wright took over at RT.

Anyway, I just found this whole transaction very interesting and costly to us. I loved Ralph Neely but it was a high price to pay for ANY player.

 

[Illini88228]

It will seem like he was worth it to most now. Nobody is imagining all of their pet cats that we could have taken with each of those picks. People overestimate the value of draft picks when they can see the opportunity cost of giving them up. With this trade having been so long ago, very few here will even be aware of the players that we could have had instead.

 

[Hagman]

Was Neely a good player? Absolutely. Was he worth giving up all of that? Heck no. (Plus the Cowboys were pretty good at hitting on their draft picks back then).

Plus, he went on broke his leg in a motorcycle accident during the 1971 Super Bowl run (the 'Boys had to drag Tony Liscio out of retirement) so it's hard to argue that he was crucial to winning championships.

Again a good player, but he's not all that.

 

[Manster68]

Ralph Neely and John Niland were both outstanding offensive lineman who were under-appreciated by the fans and media.

Part of the animosity might have been because of the "Zero Club" they formed in the early 70s. All the offensive linemen refused to talk to the media. Part of the reason why Rayfield Wright took several decades to get into the hall.

Only Dallas' offensive lines in the early 90s were better than the offensive lines in the late 60s/early 70s.

Neely/Nye/Manders/Niland/Wright

Just go on YouTube and watch Super Bowl VI. Dallas' offensive line dominated that game. The defense wasn't shabby either.

 

[Captain Late]

The price for Ralph Neely was steep,and Thumper you are right about it hurting the Cowboys in the 1967 draft.But getting a brilliant player like Rayfield Wright later in that draft was a key move for that O-Line.And the following year getting Blaine Nye with a later draft pick was important as well.

That group was as good as it gets for the offensive lines of that era- Neely,Niland,Manders,Nye and Wright were a solid unit.The Cowboys of that era had a very productive running game,with Don Perkins,Dan Reeves,Calvin Hill,Walt Garrison and Duane Thomas running behind that group.

Neely was a good player for many years,not the star player that Rayfield Wright was,but important nontheless.A nice career for 'ol "Rotten"!!

 

[pancakeman]

Thanks for the history - interesting stuff!

 

[Sarge]

Ralph Neely and John Niland were both outstanding offensive lineman who were under-appreciated by the fans and media.

Part of the animosity might have been because of the "Zero Club" they formed in the early 70s. All the offensive linemen refused to talk to the media. Part of the reason why Rayfield Wright took several decades to get into the hall.

Only Dallas' offensive lines in the early 90s were better than the offensive lines in the late 60s/early 70s.

Neely/Nye/Manders/Niland/Wright

Just go on YouTube and watch Super Bowl VI. Dallas' offensive line dominated that game. The defense wasn't shabby either.

Great post!

 

[THUMPER]

As Hagman and Manster68 have pointed out, our O-Line back in the late 60s - early 70s was one of the best in the league. Our running game in particular was very productive and we used several RBs interchangeably.

Neely was a big part of that success but it cost us too much to get him. I was just surprised at how much we ended up paying for him as I researched it.

Thanks for the input folks. :starspin

 

[joseephuss]

Peter King made the argument that Rayfield Wright shouldn't be in the Hall of Fame because Ralph Neely was better. It was a stupid argument. Just because Neely may have been better doesn't mean Wright wasn't HoF worthy. It is two separate things. Anyway, I have heard it a few times over the years that Neely may have been better than Wright and we all know Wright was pretty darn good. I don't think any one player is worth a truck load of draft picks; however, I do think Neely was a great player for Dallas.

 

[THUMPER]

Peter King made the argument that Rayfield Wright shouldn't be in the Hall of Fame because Ralph Neely was better. It was a stupid argument. Just because Neely may have been better doesn't mean Wright wasn't HoF worthy. It is two separate things. Anyway, I have heard it a few times over the years that Neely may have been better than Wright and we all know Wright was pretty darn good. I don't think any one player is worth a truck load of draft picks; however, I do think Neely was a great player for Dallas.

For 3 years Neely was better than any one at OT but he dropped off a bit after that and only made the Pro Bowl twice in his career. Wright was at the top of his game for twice that long, making 1st-Team All-Pro 3 straight years from 1971-73 and the Pro Bowl from 1971-1976.

"The Peter King" is an idiot, but that's not news to anyone. Rayfield Wright belongs in the HoF because of his performance on the field over the course of his career. It doesn't matter whether anyone else was better or not, just whether or not he deserved it, and he did.

Had Ralph Neely continued to play at the high level he had early in his career then he also would likely be in the HoF. But he didn't so he isn't.

Neely was basically the Erik Williams of his day, the best at his position for a few years but did not sustain it long enough to merit induction. Tony Boselli is another guy like that.

 

[RS12]

Peter King made the argument that Rayfield Wright shouldn't be in the Hall of Fame because Ralph Neely was better. It was a stupid argument. Just because Neely may have been better doesn't mean Wright wasn't HoF worthy. It is two separate things. Anyway, I have heard it a few times over the years that Neely may have been better than Wright and we all know Wright was pretty darn good. I don't think any one player is worth a truck load of draft picks; however, I do think Neely was a great player for Dallas.

I remember Wright being the superior player.

 

[Captain Late]

Peter King made the argument that Rayfield Wright shouldn't be in the Hall of Fame because Ralph Neely was better. It was a stupid argument. Just because Neely may have been better doesn't mean Wright wasn't HoF worthy. It is two separate things. Anyway, I have heard it a few times over the years that Neely may have been better than Wright and we all know Wright was pretty darn good. I don't think any one player is worth a truck load of draft picks; however, I do think Neely was a great player for Dallas.

Peter King has made some foolish remarks about about a few of the Cowboys greats in regard to the HOF.He said Bob Hayes should be in the "hall of very good",made the remark you cited about Rayfield Wright not being as good as Neely(simply wrong) and it helped delay both of these great players getting their rightful place in the HOF.Paul Zimmerman (Dr.Z) was very outspoken about the fiasco regarding Hayes and also was upset about Cliff Harris not getting in.King has shown an anti-Dallas bias for years.

 

[Captain Late]

For 3 years Neely was better than any one at OT but he dropped off a bit after that and only made the Pro Bowl twice in his career. Wright was at the top of his game for twice that long, making 1st-Team All-Pro 3 straight years from 1971-73 and the Pro Bowl from 1971-1976.

"The Peter King" is an idiot, but that's not news to anyone. Rayfield Wright belongs in the HoF because of his performance on the field over the course of his career. It doesn't matter whether anyone else was better or not, just whether or not he deserved it, and he did.

Had Ralph Neely continued to play at the high level he had early in his career then he also would likely be in the HoF. But he didn't so he isn't.

Neely was basically the Erik Williams of his day, the best at his position for a few years but did not sustain it long enough to merit induction. Tony Boselli is another guy like that.

That is an excellent analysis about Neely,he had a big impact early in his career but wasn't as dominant after 1970.If I recall correctly,he was actually moved to guard early in 1970 when Coach Landry shook up the roster but got moved to LT when Tony Liscio got hurt that year.That was when the Cowboys did the "performance" critique of the team and benched Neely and Bob Hayes.Thankfully,they weren't on the bench for long.

 

[THUMPER]

Peter King has made some foolish remarks about about a few of the Cowboys greats in regard to the HOF.He said Bob Hayes should be in the "hall of very good",made the remark you cited about Rayfield Wright not being as good as Neely(simply wrong) and it helped delay both of these great players getting their rightful place in the HOF.Paul Zimmerman (Dr.Z) was very outspoken about the fiasco regarding Hayes and also was upset about Cliff Harris not getting in.King has shown an anti-Dallas bias for years.

I am amazed the number of mediots on the HoF Selection Committee that have been outspoken in their bias against the Cowboys.

Why mediots make up the committee I'll never understand. :bang2: :bang2: :bang2:

 

[Bull Frog]

Did Neely get called for holding often? I was young, but I remember my Dad yelling about Neely holding frequently. He yelled more about Phil Pozderick later on.

 

[THUMPER]

Did Neely get called for holding often? I was young, but I remember my Dad yelling about Neely holding frequently. He yelled more about Phil Pozderick later on.

Probably late in his career he did.

 

[RS12]

Did Neely get called for holding often? I was young, but I remember my Dad yelling about Neely holding frequently. He yelled more about Phil Pozderick later on.

Yes after the motorcycle accident, I remember that too, at some of the worst times.

 

[Captain Late]

Did Neely get called for holding often? I was young, but I remember my Dad yelling about Neely holding frequently. He yelled more about Phil Pozderick later on.

Funny story about Ralph Neely and getting called for holding,when the Cowboys did their 20th anniversary ceremony in 1979,as Ralph was introduced he tossed a flag in the air as he ran to his spot on the podium.Texas Stadium gave him a huge ovation.




Your dad was right about Pozderac,he was simply a penalty machine out there when he played.

 

[jazzcat22]

Great post and info.

Back then this trade didn't matter to the fans, as most did not follow it, and could not, as this type of information may have been hard to find, or wasn't written about, and certainly not over analyzed like today.

But also back then, a 4th and 5th roundr pick, even a 7th round pick was considered a good player and expected to make the team.

Now a 5th rounder is considered a JAG (over used term) / long shot.

 

[kelc]

Pozderac was the worst starting OT Cowboys ever had.If he wasn't holding he was giving up sacks.I wish we had a young Neely now,good player.Wright Niland were the best.Nye and Manders very good to.