Red Zone success, and my feelings on Wade/Garrett

[Picksix]

http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2010/10/30/1783251/dallas-cowboys-red-zone-efficiency-2010#storyjump

This is a good article, showing how successful we've been in the red zone on offense and defense this season. Interestingly enough, the numbers are identical - 61.1 % of the time, a touchdown was scored. This is 7th in the NFL on offense, 26th on defense. And take into consideration Barron's hold, Marty B's tipped pass that was intercepted, and Miles' drop against the Giants, and the number would be higher.

Where am I going with this? Well, first let me say that I'm biased. I've been friends with John Garrett since our days in Cincinnati, so I've always been a Jason Garrett defender...to a point. I don't think he's perfect, and I'm not sold on him being the next HC, but I've always thought that he gets a bad rap by people who, for the most part, don't know any better. Is he predicatable? Yeah. Does he have trouble adjusting? I guess, though it's tough to adjust when your team won't execute. Lack creativity? Okay. But I'm from Indiana, have a brother/sister in law who are huge Colts fans, so I watch a lot of Indy games, and I don't think I've seen an offense more predictable than the Colts, yet they're consistently at the top of the league. They don't run much, use much play-action, they throw a ton out of the shotgun. And I don't watch enough film to know, but are their plays better or more creative than Garrett's? Or do they just execute better?

Our OL is bad, and has been for at least a couple years now. Yeah, at that times they've been good, but I've seen too many games where they look confused, slow, and beaten - especially on the right side. Free is good, Kozier has been decent, but when I read the breakdowns by those examining a lot of game film, Gurode, Davis, and Columbo have had their moments, but for the most part have been poor to just plain bad. And I don't care how good of an OC you are. If you have 3 bad lineman, your offense will struggle.

And despite that, we're still top 5 in yards, and top 7 in red zone efficiency. And that's with seemingly having different game plans each week. People say we should be able to have a consistent identity, and a will that we can impose on the opponents. Again, to me, it starts up front, and our front doesn't seem to be able to impose much of anything.

Same thing on defense, which brings me to Wade. In his 4 seasons as HC and DC (for the most part), our DL has never been dominating. We've had guys who were good at stopping the run, until this year, that is. We've had arguably the best defensive player in the game. We've had a lot of sacks. But I've never seen us consistently stuff the run, get a lot of negative plays, or consistently get to the QB. The blitzes don't seem to get there. Maybe because the whole world knows what's coming, and they're easier to pick up.

Wade, at least until this year, has by and large gotten a pass for his defense. Yeah, they're ranked high in terms of yards or points allowed, and that's nothing to sneeze at. But how many times have you seen this defense just dominate an opponent? Wade likes to bring pressure, but then plays soft in the secondary. I can't help but wonder, if this is because he's so afraid of giving up a big play. I think that may even be why he brings pressure - because he knows he's afraid his defense will get crushed if he doesn't. What I would love to see, just once, is a total, get-after-it mentality, like you see from Lebeau, or they Ryan's. An attitude of trying to win on defense as much as on offense. What I saw Monday night was a defense that quit because the QB got hurt. You don't see that in Baltimore, Pitt, New York, etc.

So, I'll say it. I'm absolutely sick of Wade, and really don't hold out any real hope as long as he's here. I don't even want him as DC, because I think he's overrated. And I like Wade. It's hard not to. But still, I'm tired of him. I didn't really like the hire at the time, but I supported it, and hoped for the best. Not anymore. We're not mentally tough enough, detail oriented enough, or focused enough on the little things, to ever be successful under him. And I don't think we ever were.

Would Garrett be a better choice? I don't know. I think he'd do a better job with the details and focus aspects, but would he have a good coaching staff? Would he have the authority to hold players accountable? And would he exert that authority if he had it? Don't know that either. Would he have command of the locker room? Bottom line, doesn't matter who the coach is, if the answer to these questions isn't yes. People make the mistake of trying to correlate the success of a coordinator with the success of being a head coach. There really isn't one.

Sorry this post was so long. If you read the whole thing, thank you. And I'm not advocating Garrett for being the next head coach. Personally, I think there are better options. I just think he's been better than people make him out to be, and Wade isn't.

 

[CowboyMike]

Excellent post. It is nice to see someone take that stance using a well thought out argument backed up by facts and good grammar and flow. It is a nice change from the unrealistic hard to follow haters.

 

[TheDude]

Good post. i just don't think garrett has been able to either 1) persuade or demand certain players/types 2) develop talent to replace aging players 3)Adjust as well as DCs adjust to him 3)play call to the team's strength within the flow of the game.

those are tranferrable skills that a HC needs. He may be great everywhere one day, but Romo is as important to Dallas as Manning is to indy. OCs always look better or worse based on QB talent.

Since most Garrett supporters are also Romo supporters (but not always vice versa), i think they overrate Garrett's ability.

Good OCs develop talent and game plans around talent and don't rely on 1 person too much. Cassel in NE, Pitt this year, Dallas in 1990s, Rams w/warner ist year, etc. Some systems work and OCs develop talent for those systems.

granted, this takes an entire team to rack up wins, but you get the drift

 

[big dog cowboy]

People make the mistake of trying to correlate the success of a coordinator with the success of being a head coach. There really isn't one.

That is the point most Garrett haters over look. No one knows what he would be like as a HC.

Great point and very good read.

 

[ShiningStar]

http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2010/10/30/1783251/dallas-cowboys-red-zone-efficiency-2010#storyjump

.

Okay, now im sure you didnt mean it to turn out this way, but its the flow i caught and i really have to answer the call of "im going to defend Garrett on offense, whos had control of the offense when he was hired and im going to compare that to Wade, whos had control of the defense since hes been hired and im going to state that Garrett isnt that bad"

OKay, apples and oranges right there. Ones doing defense, hes Wade Phillips, the other is doing offense, thats Jason Garrett.

Lets stick to Garretts offense with facts upon which we can see. He can take an explosive offense and make it mediocre real fast. How do we know this, simple, all the lazy researchers, who we dub the media, can even see there is talent on this team and some very good talent at one time thats usually not seen on many teams at 1 giving time.

We have Austin who emerged last year and who made Austin, thats right, Ray Sherman who was on the Tennesses War Draft table wanting Austin since he was one of the few to go to Austins work out and see him. No one took Austin, Tennesse fires Sherman and wheres Sherman end up, Lo and behold in Dallas, with who, thats right Austin. He believed in Austin and made Austin work. So now we have a legit first WR. Than we add Williams, subtract Terrell Owens and add a splash of Dez and now every unemployeed offensive coordinator wants in on Dallas.

You take one good runner with another runner with some speed and you got TWO guys running no where.

You take a horrible offensive line and you really have nothing going for you. You have an offensive coordinator who takes this all in and says, "well, lets not play to my guys strengths, but lets see if i can repeatedly get them to run this play which didnt work last year and ill try and stop their drive with it.

So on the first drive of the season, against the Skins, with our offense moving at will, what does Garrett want to do, you got it, run that one play that never works for us and bam, ordinary offense that stops after that.

Whats Garrett do after that, nothing, because he wont adjust, which you saw Chicago do when Cutler wasnt working in the first half, and you see Chicago blow right by us and we dont even bother trying to keep up.

So you think to yourself, okay the offensive coach has got to see this and take a week to adjust his boys to come out and play, and they do vs a very good Houston team.

So you say to yourself, 2 weeks off, got Tennessee coming up, our boy is going to adjust the team, tweak some plays and bring them out playing to their strengths. No way, they come out flat. Their mobile Qb has happy feet, their guys arent running the routes to their strengths, they are getting beat by a very generic but tough playing secondary.

And you say to yourself, wow why wasnt guys shuffled on the offensive line, why wont Romo hit Austin in stride which seems to work wonders for Austin, wow Roy Williams was wide open. Look at Dez give it his all and our offensive guy just watches in wonder as Tennessee tears us up.

So the team takes the next week off and you think, wow wont our offensive coordinator change the team, tweak some plays and make this thing work. And the Giants come to town and the D is ready to play, but that offense just cant seem to score with two take aways.

Instead of wishing this team will want to play, Special teams tries to pick it up and instead one rookie mistake and our qb is out of contention.

Now your just done iwth the offensive guy who had all offseason to fully understand what will be at his disposal, full say because we all know the guy who hired him before the HC, so you know he has say on the offense, and gets a draft to play with and free agents out on the market and he comes up with zilch for the offense.

One has to figure he decided well we'll just trot out the same players with this bad play that doesnt work but i wont give up on it and throw in a rookie just to make it easier for the other teams and we'll see how this does in preseason and if it does all right, than theres no bother to rework the playbook, or make adjustments and ill just rely on my players to run around and let happy feet toss the ball to them and we'll see where the dice roll when I toss em.

Because jack thats all we've seen this season. A hall of fame hopeful tight end, a pro bowl WR, a pro bowl center, one screaming fast RB, and 1 win to show for it.

Garrett punched his ticket out of Dallas last season and only the blind are hoping he can ressurrect that which hes not really looking to resurrect.

Now we can debate this and that and all it is at best is speculation. But you want to play with facts and all the facts anyone needs to see is that which is done on the field and theres not alot for his defenders to go out and collect and make an argument for. I dont know why its hard to see for some, but it is, but Garrett really doesnt wnat to be here. Maybe hes seen Jerry for what it is, he knows what Dallas is and maybe he just figured he'll hit the ejector seat and take his chances, but still trying to work in 1 play that doesnt work, nto bothering to adjust, not playing to your Wr's strengths with a whole offseason to make adjustments to the playbook and you dont run screens so well, other teams look like pro bowl defenders against you and the 1 rare time your offense starts clicking and you intercede to screw that up, does it take the sole person on the sideline to trip you as your running down the field to prove to you THAT person doestn want to be there?

The evidence is on the field, 1 win and 5 losses 3 of which should have been your games and you left the points on the field. This offense should be the ferrari of the NFL and our offensive genuis got in the volkswagon.

Oh i forgot all we do is draft dumb players. and our rookies are horrid. but other than that Garrett is doing alright. He can put that on his resume when hes done blowing off the dust because it should be spread around like snow up in Canada, because hes proving to a lot of people he doesnt have what it takes if he cant do it with this offense.

And dont hand me crap about the line because there are other teams with a more porous line than ours, Chicago comes to mind and they are doing things to win.

 

[ShiningStar]

That is the point most Garrett haters over look. No one knows what he would be like as a HC.

Great point and very good read.

You need to adjust as head coach or at least direct someone to adjust, if he cant adjust at one position what makes you think he can do it at another?

 

[craig71]

I enjoyed the read, thanks for posting.

Here is a blog from the same site that I also found interesting.

Here is the link:

http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2010...wade-allen-phillips-and-the-stifled-genius-of

A snippet.

Say what you will, but in 2007 Jason's offense scored the most points second only to the record setting Patriots. That's the last time the O-line played even semi-decently. This year we were 6th in the league in red zone scoring, Garrett made the adjustments that were necessary making last year an anamoly. Every other team that was dragged down by the the eventual self immolation of Wade's defenses had absolutely grinded to a halt, being a mere shadow of its former self. Not Jason Garrett's. You want to point at all of the yards the Cowboys have gained without scoring points? You need to point directly at the defensive coordinator. In fact, it's Jason Garrett's game plan that has enabled Wade's defense to look good. They surrendered approximately 250 points last year because of the long drives, because of the exceptional special teams work, because of Jason Garrett and Joe DeCamillis. Think about it, as a Dallas fan it pains me to say that the writing has been on the wall for a very long time - a quick look at Wade's history may have prepared us for what was surely to come. That time is now, and that my friends is the very Curious Case of Wade Allen Phillips, next time we'll look at the Stifled Genius of Jason Calvin Garrett.

Craig

 

[CowboyMike]

You need to adjust as head coach or at least direct someone to adjust, if he cant adjust at one position what makes you think he can do it at another?

It's really funny that you say that, because up until this year everyone lauded Garrett for his in game adjustments. Our offense was a historically slow starter and gained the momentum after half time up until this year.

This was especially evident in '07 and last year.

 

[ShiningStar]

It's really funny that you say that, because up until this year everyone lauded Garrett for his in game adjustments. Our offense was a historically slow starter and gained the momentum after half time up until this year.

This was especially evident in '07 and last year.

Yes, you are very correct. In fact the slow starts were begining to take their tolls because teams were catching up and racing to get the Cowboys to play catch up, once that happened Garrett fell apart. Among other reasons.

 

[CowboyMike]

Yes, you are very correct. In fact the slow starts were begining to take their tolls because teams were catching up and racing to get the Cowboys to play catch up, once that happened Garrett fell apart. Among other reasons.

But my point is that Garrett was really good at making half time adjustments. This year for some reason it just hasn't happened.

 

[ShiningStar]

But my point is that Garrett was really good at making half time adjustments. This year for some reason it just hasn't happened.

and i agreed, but didnt clarify, this year no adjustments seem to be made from Garrett and I think teams figured to score faster and make Dallas try to catch up, putting Garrett in a "throw mode" more often and now he has to play the balanced act.

Garrett with HH's help, have really let this team down with a very bad offense.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

I remember one game against the Giants when we ran for over 100 yards in the first half alone and the Next Tom Landry adjusted to abandoning the run, leading to one field goal the rest of the game.

 

[Doomsday]

But I'm from Indiana, have a brother/sister in law who are huge Colts fans, so I watch a lot of Indy games, and I don't think I've seen an offense more predictable than the Colts, yet they're consistently at the top of the league. They don't run much, use much play-action, they throw a ton out of the shotgun. And I don't watch enough film to know, but are their plays better or more creative than Garrett's? Or do they just execute better?

Isnt part of the job of the offensive coordinator to make sure his players are prepared and execute at a high level? We are in the third year with basically the same players running his system yet we see the same mental mistakes this season that were present 3 years ago.

 

[CowboyMike]

and i agreed, but didnt clarify, this year no adjustments seem to be made from Garrett and I think teams figured to score faster and make Dallas try to catch up, putting Garrett in a "throw mode" more often and now he has to play the balanced act.

Garrett with HH's help, have really let this team down with a very bad offense.

Ah. Gotcha. Now I get what you're saying. I agree there.

 

[Picksix]

Okay, now im sure you didnt mean it to turn out this way, but its the flow i caught and i really have to answer the call of "im going to defend Garrett on offense, whos had control of the offense when he was hired and im going to compare that to Wade, whos had control of the defense since hes been hired and im going to state that Garrett isnt that bad"

OKay, apples and oranges right there. Ones doing defense, hes Wade Phillips, the other is doing offense, thats Jason Garrett.

Lets stick to Garretts offense with facts upon which we can see. He can take an explosive offense and make it mediocre real fast. How do we know this, simple, all the lazy researchers, who we dub the media, can even see there is talent on this team and some very good talent at one time thats usually not seen on many teams at 1 giving time.

We have Austin who emerged last year and who made Austin, thats right, Ray Sherman who was on the Tennesses War Draft table wanting Austin since he was one of the few to go to Austins work out and see him. No one took Austin, Tennesse fires Sherman and wheres Sherman end up, Lo and behold in Dallas, with who, thats right Austin. He believed in Austin and made Austin work. So now we have a legit first WR. Than we add Williams, subtract Terrell Owens and add a splash of Dez and now every unemployeed offensive coordinator wants in on Dallas.

You take one good runner with another runner with some speed and you got TWO guys running no where.

You take a horrible offensive line and you really have nothing going for you. You have an offensive coordinator who takes this all in and says, "well, lets not play to my guys strengths, but lets see if i can repeatedly get them to run this play which didnt work last year and ill try and stop their drive with it.

So on the first drive of the season, against the Skins, with our offense moving at will, what does Garrett want to do, you got it, run that one play that never works for us and bam, ordinary offense that stops after that.

Whats Garrett do after that, nothing, because he wont adjust, which you saw Chicago do when Cutler wasnt working in the first half, and you see Chicago blow right by us and we dont even bother trying to keep up.

So you think to yourself, okay the offensive coach has got to see this and take a week to adjust his boys to come out and play, and they do vs a very good Houston team.

So you say to yourself, 2 weeks off, got Tennessee coming up, our boy is going to adjust the team, tweak some plays and bring them out playing to their strengths. No way, they come out flat. Their mobile Qb has happy feet, their guys arent running the routes to their strengths, they are getting beat by a very generic but tough playing secondary.

And you say to yourself, wow why wasnt guys shuffled on the offensive line, why wont Romo hit Austin in stride which seems to work wonders for Austin, wow Roy Williams was wide open. Look at Dez give it his all and our offensive guy just watches in wonder as Tennessee tears us up.

So the team takes the next week off and you think, wow wont our offensive coordinator change the team, tweak some plays and make this thing work. And the Giants come to town and the D is ready to play, but that offense just cant seem to score with two take aways.

Instead of wishing this team will want to play, Special teams tries to pick it up and instead one rookie mistake and our qb is out of contention.

Now your just done iwth the offensive guy who had all offseason to fully understand what will be at his disposal, full say because we all know the guy who hired him before the HC, so you know he has say on the offense, and gets a draft to play with and free agents out on the market and he comes up with zilch for the offense.

One has to figure he decided well we'll just trot out the same players with this bad play that doesnt work but i wont give up on it and throw in a rookie just to make it easier for the other teams and we'll see how this does in preseason and if it does all right, than theres no bother to rework the playbook, or make adjustments and ill just rely on my players to run around and let happy feet toss the ball to them and we'll see where the dice roll when I toss em.

Because jack thats all we've seen this season. A hall of fame hopeful tight end, a pro bowl WR, a pro bowl center, one screaming fast RB, and 1 win to show for it.

Garrett punched his ticket out of Dallas last season and only the blind are hoping he can ressurrect that which hes not really looking to resurrect.

Now we can debate this and that and all it is at best is speculation. But you want to play with facts and all the facts anyone needs to see is that which is done on the field and theres not alot for his defenders to go out and collect and make an argument for. I dont know why its hard to see for some, but it is, but Garrett really doesnt wnat to be here. Maybe hes seen Jerry for what it is, he knows what Dallas is and maybe he just figured he'll hit the ejector seat and take his chances, but still trying to work in 1 play that doesnt work, nto bothering to adjust, not playing to your Wr's strengths with a whole offseason to make adjustments to the playbook and you dont run screens so well, other teams look like pro bowl defenders against you and the 1 rare time your offense starts clicking and you intercede to screw that up, does it take the sole person on the sideline to trip you as your running down the field to prove to you THAT person doestn want to be there?

The evidence is on the field, 1 win and 5 losses 3 of which should have been your games and you left the points on the field. This offense should be the ferrari of the NFL and our offensive genuis got in the volkswagon.

Oh i forgot all we do is draft dumb players. and our rookies are horrid. but other than that Garrett is doing alright. He can put that on his resume when hes done blowing off the dust because it should be spread around like snow up in Canada, because hes proving to a lot of people he doesnt have what it takes if he cant do it with this offense.

And dont hand me crap about the line because there are other teams with a more porous line than ours, Chicago comes to mind and they are doing things to win.

See, this is what I'm talking about. Your post smacks of the same type of thinking that a lot of Garrett haters have. At least I admitted my bias. You didn't, but your post practically screams it. In my post, I gave facts. You gave opinions, and tried to put them over as facts. For starters, you said, as "fact", that Garrett took an explosive offense and made it mediocre. How is our offense mediocre? We're near the top in just about every statistical category except running and points. What do you need to have a good running game? Good running backs and a good offensive line. Our line is terrible. Even you admit that. And our backs? Barber was limited even when he was good. Now, he's just limited. Felix is "screaming fast," but since when is that all it takes to be a good back? How about hitting a hole without hesitating? Oh wait, it's kind of hard to do that when there isn't one. How about making a guy miss in space? I love Felix, and he is very good, yet he is also limited. And as for Choice, well I'll give you that one, because honestly, I don't know why he's not playing.

As for the points, well you can point a finger in a lot of places, and this debate has been going on for some time. It's not Garret's fault that the offense seems to commit penalties and turnovers at the worst times, and that his kickers can't kick.

You talk of a "play that never worked." What play? A running play? A pass? Okay. We have plays that didn't work last year. So that means we don't ever try them again, in the first game of the year? Against a team that's switched coaches and defenses? Okay, fair enough. Our offense stalled because of one play. That's what it sounds like you're saying.

You claim that this offense is loaded with talent, citing of all people, the "dumb, lazy media analysts." You mention our number 1 WR, and that his development was all because of the WR coach. So, is it that coach's fault then that the same WR (whom I love, btw), is among the league leaders in drops this year, one of which cost a TD last game, and also cost a TD against Minnesota with a stupid/garbage OPI penalty? Nah, that was all JG's fault. And why then hasn't Sherman made all-pro's out of Hurd and Ogletree?

Our possibly HOF TE? You mean the guy who has taken over Flozell's spot as the team leader in false starts.? (Not sure if that's true, but you get the point.) Or the guy who fumbled right before half against the Giants?

Pro Bowl Center? Seriously, if you think Gurode is still playing at a Pro Bowl level, you need to watch him play.

You need to realize what a lot of other people have come to realize (dumb, lazy media notwithstanding) - WE ARE NOT THAT TALENTED. Yes, we have talent. Romo, Witten, Austin, and FJ are very good, sometimes great. We also have two other WR's playing well. If only Dez hadn't been hurt since the day he camp to minicamp, and knew the playbook. But if the OL isn't playing well, again, it doesn't matter. And no, tweaking plays and shuffling lineman during a bye week arent' gonna fix that. Shuffle them how?

You talk like Garrett has control over who we draft and get via free agency. No. He has input, but it's clear who has the control.

And finally, you brought up the Bears as evidence that a team can win without a good offense. Yeah, it's called DEFENSE. The Bears are at the bottom of virtually every offensive category, but they've overcome that - to a point - by playing good defense against mediocre to bad teams. Their offense hasn't been nearly as good as the Cowboys'.

It's apparent that you see what you wan to see, and that's okay. Really it is, because we all do it. And I don't mean to get into a pissing contest with you. I made a point, you countered, and I countered back. If I was insulting in any way, I apologize.

But my name isn't Jack. It's Mike.

 

[Kevinicus]

It's really funny that you say that, because up until this year everyone lauded Garrett for his in game adjustments. Our offense was a historically slow starter and gained the momentum after half time up until this year.

This was especially evident in '07 and last year.

In '07 maybe, but that is the only season. Certainly not last year.

 

[TheDude]

:

See, this is what I'm talking about. Your post smacks of the same type of thinking that a lot of Garrett haters have. At least I admitted my bias. You didn't, but your post practically screams it. In my post, I gave facts. You gave opinions, and tried to put them over as facts. For starters, you said, as "fact", that Garrett took an explosive offense and made it mediocre. How is our offense mediocre? We're near the top in just about every statistical category except running and points. What do you need to have a good running game? Good running backs and a good offensive line. Our line is terrible. Even you admit that. And our backs? Barber was limited even when he was good. Now, he's just limited. Felix is "screaming fast," but since when is that all it takes to be a good back? How about hitting a hole without hesitating? Oh wait, it's kind of hard to do that when there isn't one. How about making a guy miss in space? I love Felix, and he is very good, yet he is also limited. And as for Choice, well I'll give you that one, because honestly, I don't know why he's not playing.

As for the points, well you can point a finger in a lot of places, and this debate has been going on for some time. It's not Garret's fault that the offense seems to commit penalties and turnovers at the worst times, and that his kickers can't kick.

You talk of a "play that never worked." What play? A running play? A pass? Okay. We have plays that didn't work last year. So that means we don't ever try them again, in the first game of the year? Against a team that's switched coaches and defenses? Okay, fair enough. Our offense stalled because of one play. That's what it sounds like you're saying.

You claim that this offense is loaded with talent, citing of all people, the "dumb, lazy media analysts." You mention our number 1 WR, and that his development was all because of the WR coach. So, is it that coach's fault then that the same WR (whom I love, btw), is among the league leaders in drops this year, one of which cost a TD last game, and also cost a TD against Minnesota with a stupid/garbage OPI penalty? Nah, that was all JG's fault. And why then hasn't Sherman made all-pro's out of Hurd and Ogletree?

Our possibly HOF TE? You mean the guy who has taken over Flozell's spot as the team leader in false starts.? (Not sure if that's true, but you get the point.) Or the guy who fumbled right before half against the Giants?

Pro Bowl Center? Seriously, if you think Gurode is still playing at a Pro Bowl level, you need to watch him play.

You need to realize what a lot of other people have come to realize (dumb, lazy media notwithstanding) - WE ARE NOT THAT TALENTED. Yes, we have talent. Romo, Witten, Austin, and FJ are very good, sometimes great. We also have two other WR's playing well. If only Dez hadn't been hurt since the day he camp to minicamp, and knew the playbook. But if the OL isn't playing well, again, it doesn't matter. And no, tweaking plays and shuffling lineman during a bye week arent' gonna fix that. Shuffle them how?

You talk like Garrett has control over who we draft and get via free agency. No. He has input, but it's clear who has the control.

And finally, you brought up the Bears as evidence that a team can win without a good offense. Yeah, it's called DEFENSE. The Bears are at the bottom of virtually every offensive category, but they've overcome that - to a point - by playing good defense against mediocre to bad teams. Their offense hasn't been nearly as good as the Cowboys'.

It's apparent that you see what you wan to see, and that's okay. Really it is, because we all do it. And I don't mean to get into a pissing contest with you. I made a point, you countered, and I countered back. If I was insulting in any way, I apologize.

But my name isn't Jack. It's Mike.

I agree that we aren't that talented and that is a primary reason for the record.

But the oline functioned well in 2007. Garrett has to take some blame there. Whether evaluating talent, influencing jerry to get players,or developing others, he has not impressed.
the most worrisome is that displaying leadership in an oc role, to. Me, is the ability to lead,develop talent and influence the gm to get the players you need...i don't see that ability. The brad j fiasco os the example why i don't trust him

 

[Picksix]

Isnt part of the job of the offensive coordinator to make sure his players are prepared and execute at a high level? We are in the third year with basically the same players running his system yet we see the same mental mistakes this season that were present 3 years ago.

Good point. You're absolutely right. But it's this system, with basically the same players running it, that tied a team record in points his first year. So what's changed? Is it that Sparano left, and was more important to this team than we thought? Maybe. Did other teams catch up to it? Possibly, but I would think other teams would have caught up to the West Coast offense too. That's still effective, as long as the players have the ability to execute it. And how are they not prepared? And if they aren't, yes, some of that goes on the OC. But doesn't some also go on the players?

Again, I'm not trying to compare JG to Bill Walsh. The man could be better, without question. Things like calling that play at the end of the half in the Washington game made me want to reach through my TV and choke the man. But he doesn't deserve the wrath he gets, and doesn't deserve to take all the blame either.

 

[Picksix]

:
I agree that we aren't that talented and that is a primary reason for the record.

But the oline functioned well in 2007. Garrett has to take some blame there. Whether evaluating talent, influencing jerry to get players,or developing others, he has not impressed.
the most worrisome is that displaying leadership in an oc role, to. Me, is the ability to lead,develop talent and influence the gm to get the players you need...i don't see that ability. The brad j fiasco os the example why i don't trust him

2007 was three years ago. I think it's easy to see that those lineman are not what they were then. As for the Brad Johnson thing, yeah, if that was his call, then his talent assessment is definitely questionable.

As to the point of being able to influence the GM, well, I can only think of three people in 20 years who've been able to do that. Jimmy, Stephen and BP. An assistant coach has never really had that ability. I think JG is stronger than you give him credit for, but isn't really in a position of power, although I think he could convince JJ to offer 10 G's to an UDFA QB out of Eastern Illinois. That's really all Payton ever did as far as influence.