Roethlis-raper

[Stautner]

You seem like you're criticizing Goodall's decision here.

If you will go back and look at the full context you will see that the point in discussing the Ben vs. Vick situation was to negate the criticism in this thread directed at Goodell for reducing Ben's suspension from 6 to 4 games.

Further, my point is that Goodell has to judge each situation on it's own, and suspensions and/or punishments cannot be uniform as fans tend to expect.

 

[Stautner]

I feel like this is most likely the reason that Raper received such a harsh suspension from Goodall, because even though he wasn't convicted, you know he acted in an immoral and irresponsible mannar that night. I don't think anyone would argue with his behavior, or his reputation after the last accusation.

However, in the current situation with Vick, if they find that he's innocent, then you really can't say he did anything that was immoral or irresponsible just because he was out at a club. Hundreds of players in all professional leagues go out. So if he wasn't deemed responsible for the shooting, then he did nothing out of line, whereas Ben still acted inappropriately and obviously "not consistent with the values of the league".

That's the difference right there i believe.

I would agree with this except that you have to factor in Vick's history with the league - multiple issues, the last of which resulted in a conviction on federal criminal charges, and the fact that he is still on probation for the offenses.

So, while Vick may not have done anything immoral, it was not a good decision for him to be in a bar late at night with drunks all around. It makes for an unstable situation. Goodell has been known to come down on players simply for putting themselves in bad situations, especially when there is a history of being in bad situations.

 

[CanadianCowboysFan]

People who criticize Goodell crack me up.

He does have a God complex though and runs the NFL as if were Puritan New England where they should be calling each other Goodman (last name) or Goodie

 

[Hoofbite]

People who like George Carlin crack me up.

:laugh1:

George Carlin didn't crack you up?

 

[Hoofbite]

He does have a God complex though and runs the NFL as if were Puritan New England where they should be calling each other Goodman (last name) or Goodie

He runs the league exactly how the owners and players want.

The players went to Goodell and asked him to clean up the league.

The owners unanimously voted him to an extension, IIRC.

The only people who seemingly has a problem with the guy is the fans.

Go figure.

 

[Stautner]

He runs the league exactly how the owners and players want.

The players went to Goodell and asked him to clean up the league.

The owners unanimously voted him to an extension, IIRC.

The only people who seemingly has a problem with the guy is the fans.

Go figure.

This is exactly right. Kind of a modern day Kenesaw Mountain Landis, although not nearly as harsh or unreasonable.

The league understood the job couldn't be done effectively by a guy who tiptoes around and worries about stepping on toes or upsetting people. The fans seem to get that only as long as players they don't care for get busted hard, but the second it affects a player they do care for their persepective changes.

 

[CanadianCowboysFan]

He seems to think people care about whether their heroes/players are bad *****. They don't. All people care about are wins.

Wouldn't shock me if he has skeletons in his closet like Jimmy Swaggart, Jim Bakker or J Edgar Hoover who told others how to act while wearing women's underwear or scoring with hookers/skanks.

 

[Doomsday101]

He seems to think people care about whether their heroes/players are bad *****. They don't. All people care about are wins.

Wouldn't shock me if he has skeletons in his closet like Jimmy Swaggart, Jim Bakker or J Edgar Hoover who told others how to act while wearing women's underwear or scoring with hookers/skanks.

Some people do care and some players care enough so much that a group of players went to Goodell about cleaning the image of the league up one of those players was Jason Witten.


http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/draft/2007-02-23-corbett-at-the-combine_x.htm

NFL Players Association Executive Director Gene Upshaw on Friday commended the unanimous call from a panel of players for stronger disciplinary sanctions against their brethren who run afoul of the law. The 12-player Conduct Advisory Committee met during a three-hour Feb. 22 meeting here convened by commissioner Roger Goodell.

More deterrence, more accountability, fewer problems and fewer hits to the league's image seems to be the consensus.

A cross-section of team representatives and respected locker-room leaders summoned by Upshaw and Troy Vincent, the president of the players union, called for implementing penalties akin to escalating suspensions for violating the league's substance abuse policy.

Upshaw's feeling was that the level of player concern opened the eyes of Goodell as well as influential owners Dan Rooney of Pittsburgh and Pat Bowlen of Denver.

Among the members of the panel who recommended that more stringent punishment for conduct violations be strongly considered by the union: 15-year veteran defensive back Vincent, Colts Pro Bowl center Jeff Saturday, Panthers Pro Bowl receiver Steve Smith, Cowboys Pro Bowl tight end Jason Witten, Falcons Pro Bowl corner DeAngelo Hall, Bengals receiver T.J. Houshmandzadeh, Seahawks safety Ken Hamlin, Broncos cornerback Dominique Foxworth, Saints tight end Ernie Conwell, Dolphins Defense lineman Kevin Carter and Titans running back LenDale White .

"The common denominator was these guys really care," Upshaw said before addressing a meeting of player agents early Friday. "They care about the game.

"They care about the 10% that we're all painting with the same brush. That 90% are doing the right thing and 10% are not.

"Guys are moving in the direction that we need to have penalties similar to the drug (substance abuse policy) penalties. At some point, you're out. You can't just continue to keep violating policies. You can't be in the wrong place, three or four times.

"One time. Two times maybe. But three or four times in the wrong place at the wrong time, they didn't like that."

 

[joseephuss]

He seems to think people care about whether their heroes/players are bad *****. They don't. All people care about are wins.

Wouldn't shock me if he has skeletons in his closet like Jimmy Swaggart, Jim Bakker or J Edgar Hoover who told others how to act while wearing women's underwear or scoring with hookers/skanks.

If people only cared about wins, then why were there people protesting Vick? Wins go a long way, but there are limits.

Maybe all that players care about is money. Guys that get in constant trouble taint the image of the entire NFL. This possibly can cost everyone money whether that is from fans, advertisers or endorsement deals. That is one of the reasons why the players asked for something done.

 

[Seven]

This should've never been in Goodells lap. I blame the steeler org. They cut santonio for waayyy less an infraction all in the name of what the steeler org. 'represents' yet they keep this POS. Makes me sick to hear them, look their fans straight in the face and outright lie. Nice.


I have zero respect for the steelers organization. To tell the world they will not tolerate such actions and then turn a blind eye? I spat in their faces.

 

[T-RO]

The only people who seemingly has a problem with the guy is the fans.

Go figure.

You are flat wrong, hoofbite, if you think the players are always happy with Goodell. The only reason they don't speak up more is that they would get fined silly if they did so.

My displeasure with Goodell is tantamount to my displeasure with the league. I have no illusion about there being a difference.

There is a lot of disingenuousness to NFL policies. Running a clean ship often gets usurped by higher goals when it comes to pet teams and players.

 

[CanadianCowboysFan]

If people only cared about wins, then why were there people protesting Vick? Wins go a long way, but there are limits.

Maybe all that players care about is money. Guys that get in constant trouble taint the image of the entire NFL. This possibly can cost everyone money whether that is from fans, advertisers or endorsement deals. That is one of the reasons why the players asked for something done.

Telling someone they cannot be involved in dog fighting is one thing. Telling another he cannot go to a strip bar is another.

 

[CowboyMcCoy]

Am I the only one who believes in innocent until proven guilty? Unless there's something I don't know, I don't think he should be suspended at all.

 

[Hoofbite]

You are flat wrong, hoofbite, if you think the players are always happy with Goodell. The only reason they don't speak up more is that they would get fined silly if they did so.

My displeasure with Goodell is tantamount to my displeasure with the league. I have no illusion about there being a difference.

There is a lot of disingenuousness to NFL policies. Running a clean ship often gets usurped by higher goals when it comes to pet teams and players.

I'm sure the Pacman Jones' and Tanks of the league hate it. I'm sure all the jerks who can't handle themselves hate it.

As for the players who reflect positively on the league, I'm sure they don't care.

It's kind of like the police. All the people who dislike the police have a bunch of run-ins with them. People who never have to deal with the police don't have any issues.

Bottom line, he's doing the job asked of him and is getting applause from the owners.

 

[YosemiteSam]

So now "softy" Goodell says that Ben has gone above an beyond to warrant a 4 week suspension as opposed to a 6 week suspension. What does that mean? He hasn't raped or sexually assaulted anyone lately. What a joke.

If he murdered someone, he would have gotten five games.

 

[Stautner]

He seems to think people care about whether their heroes/players are bad *****. They don't. All people care about are wins.

Wouldn't shock me if he has skeletons in his closet like Jimmy Swaggart, Jim Bakker or J Edgar Hoover who told others how to act while wearing women's underwear or scoring with hookers/skanks.

You're pretty synical. Most people want to actually like the players they root for. It sells tickets and it sells merchandise, and it perpetuates interest in the game. Ocassional rogues don't do much damage to this, but if problems were allowed to go unpunished, and problems were allowed to become bigger problems, and problems became more frequent, fan interest would easily fall off.

If people only cared about wins, then why were there people protesting Vick? Wins go a long way, but there are limits.

Good point. All you have to do is look at the title of this thread and read all the comments about Rothlisberger, Vick and others that have been posted on this site over time to know that fans do care.

This should've never been in Goodells lap. I blame the steeler org. They cut santonio for waayyy less an infraction all in the name of what the steeler org. 'represents' yet they keep this POS. Makes me sick to hear them, look their fans straight in the face and outright lie. Nice.

I have zero respect for the steelers organization. To tell the world they will not tolerate such actions and then turn a blind eye? I spat in their faces.

The Cowboys have done the same kind of thing. They turned a blind eye to a lot of crap in the 1970's and 1990's, while at the same time condemning that kind of activity. All teams are trying to balance how to maintain an image with how to keep the best talent.

You are flat wrong, hoofbite, if you think the players are always happy with Goodell. The only reason they don't speak up more is that they would get fined silly if they did so.

My displeasure with Goodell is tantamount to my displeasure with the league. I have no illusion about there being a difference.

There is a lot of disingenuousness to NFL policies. Running a clean ship often gets usurped by higher goals when it comes to pet teams and players.

Of course the players aren't always thrilled with Goodell, just as students aren't always thrilled with the principle, or certain citizens aren't always thrilled with the police. All have been given the task of coming down on those that fall under their jurisdiction and who commit an act that they deem to violate some law, principle or ideal. And all have to go about their job knowing they aren't going to please everyone, and having thick enough skin that they are willing to get the job done knowing there will be those that hold a lot of ill will toward them.

The fact is that the inconsistency people often perceive from Goodell stems mainly from him looking at individual circumstances. Fans don't always know all the circumstances, nor are they privvy to conversations between Goodell and the player, nor do they see what Goodell sees in terms of changes the player has made to get his act together. Goodell takes all those things into account, which is fair, and the fan does not.