S Jeff Heath missed Saturday's game, graded 81st out of 89 safeties last year by PFF

Sydla

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A couple of questions:

Where, on PFF, does Heath rank among Safeties in the NFL who've
single-handedly won games? Or, where does Heath rank as far as
leading his team in interceptions for multiple years? Just curious,
since cherry-picking is the name of the game on the internet... lol.

Also, a more serious question, where is Karl Joseph ranked as an NFL Safety on the almighty PFF?
It appears that many feel we should trade for him. On this, I'm legitimately curious.

LOL.

Heath fan in da house!!!!

Hey, what grade did he get when he screwed up the Goff play in the playoffs and let slow footed Goff run right by him for a crucial first down?

He’s not a good safety.
 

RoboQB

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LOL.

Heath fan in da house!!!!

Hey, what grade did he get when he screwed up the Goff play in the playoffs and let slow footed Goff run right by him for a crucial first down?

He’s not a good safety.


So, you're saying you have no answers.
You're also cherry picking one play which essentially proved my point.
But no worries, you're not smart enough to realize it, so carry on.

Not a "Heath fan". I'm a Cowboys fan. I just don't get the hate towards him.
 
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RoboQB

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There are so many bad players that can lead the team in ints when youre secondary ranks near the bottom of the league every year in ints. Hes also cost us games. So just be real that the guy is a subpar starter

Okay. Any idea what Karl Joseph's PFF ranking is? Nobody answers my questions.
 

bsbellomy

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Ah, so that officially makes it half the starters out. Glad we cleared that up.

Heath is one of the worst, if not the worst starting safety in the NFL. This is a proven fact.

And after watching Hill get tossed around like a rag doll when he was in there, Im sticking by my draft disappointment that they passed on those quality safeties.

Hill simply doesnt have the upper body strength at this point to do much.

So glad they went and got Iloka lol. Is Eric Berry still available?
 

buybuydandavis

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We’re lucky to have one of the worst starting safeties in the league? Lol okkkk. I mean I like him on ST and as a third safety. But just as I was waiting on Church to be replaced I’m waiting on Heath to be replaced. I really like Woods though.

Heath is an over the top FS, not an in the box SS. He gets stuck with it because he is our best option. Frazier didn't pan out. Iloka look like a dud. It's Heath again unless they bring in someone else, which they really should. Shouldn't be hard to upgrade that role.
 

Beast_from_East

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Do you understand what it means to have solid football players on your team. Not everybody can be a superstar. Give me a bunch of solid football players I'll teach them make them play as one and win a championship . understand the game

And you think that is going to happen with Clappy as our head coach?

Haaaaaaaaaaaabaaaaaaaaaaaaahaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!

Clappy couldn't coach up a litter of kittens to find a bowl of milk:laugh:
 

Sydla

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So, you're saying you have no answers.
You're also cherry picking one play which essentially proved my point.
But no worries, you're not smart enough to realize it, so carry on.

Not a "Heath fan". I'm a Cowboys fan. I just don't get the hate towards him.

The “hate” (LOL that word) is because he’s not a good safety.

It’s just that simple. I have no issues with him being a backup S for us and special teams ace. But he should not be starting.

It’s just that simple. The better question is why, as a fan of the Cowboys TEAM, you are so defensive of an average S?

PS - it’s not cherry picking one play. He ranked near the bottom of NFL safeties at misses tackles. Which given he’s a SS is a pretty important job.
 
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RoboQB

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The “hate” (LOL that word) is because he’s not a good safety.

It’s just that simple. I have no issues with him being a backup S for us and special teams ace. But he should not be starting.

It’s just that simple. The better question is why, as a fan of the Cowboys TEAM, you are so defensive of an average S?

PS - it’s not cherry picking one play. He ranked near the bottom of NFL safeties at misses tackles. Which given he’s a SS is a pretty important job.

I'm not defensive, but I feel like I'm suddenly talking to a child.
I did ask a serious question that has been glossed over.
That is, what is Karl Joseph's ranking in the PFF?

News flash for you, the team doesn't give a damn what issues you may have with the team.
They don't care what anyone thinks about their safeties, quarterbacks, running backs,
coaching staff, free agent signings, contract disputes, front office... anything.
You don't matter. And neither do I.
 

HungryLion

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So, you're saying you have no answers.
You're also cherry picking one play which essentially proved my point.
But no worries, you're not smart enough to realize it, so carry on.

Not a "Heath fan". I'm a Cowboys fan. I just don't get the hate towards him.

Saying he should have competition isn’t unfair. Saying he should ideally be a backup isn’t unfair.
 

Future

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I just like PFF. They’re not perfect, but they quantify unknown information. Ignorance is the biggest obstacle in any circumstance. They do their best to alleviate ignorance.
Doing their best is the problem, because you move from assumption to inaccurate "data."

PFF is fine if you look at it as just a starting point for a discussion, but there is almost 0 merit to their rankings and grading, especially for a position like safety, because they are all subjective. They had DJ Swearinger at #1 at a point in October, and he's trash.
 

Future

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LOL.

Heath fan in da house!!!!

Hey, what grade did he get when he screwed up the Goff play in the playoffs and let slow footed Goff run right by him for a crucial first down?

He’s not a good safety.
The Goff play wasn't his responsibility.
 

Sydla

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I'm not defensive, but I feel like I'm suddenly talking to a child.
I did ask a serious question that has been glossed over.
That is, what is Karl Joseph's ranking in the PFF?

News flash for you, the team doesn't give a damn what issues you may have with the team.
They don't care what anyone thinks about their safeties, quarterbacks, running backs,
coaching staff, free agent signings, contract disputes, front office... anything.
You don't matter. And neither do I.

But this is a sports message board where fans discuss the team. The fact that the team themselves don't care what we say isn't really the point. I mean if it was the point, then why even have discussion boards and sports call in shows and editorials in the press on the team?

Why do you have a problem with the criticism of Heath? Do you think he's much better than people think?

PS - It wasn't just PFF that criticized Heath. Football Outsiders said this:

Jeff Heath can not tackle. We noted last year in this space that Heath had more missed tackles (11) than defeats (six). The problem got worse in 2018, as Heath's 22 broken tackles were the second-most allowed in the league. Heath just isn't a starting-caliber strong safety; he's a quality special teams player who has been promoted beyond his skill set.

And I don't even like PFF, but there is enough information and reporting beyond PFF that indicates Heath isn't a very good safety.

PPS - FWIW, Joseph got a higher rating in PFF than Heath. I think Joseph is a bit overrated based on where he was drafted but I suspect if given a choice, most teams would take Joseph over Heath right now.
 

Sydla

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The Goff play wasn't his responsibility.

This again?

Yes, we know, his first read was to cover the TE. But the TE never ran a route. He blocked down on a DL. There was no way that TE could run a route or even get back into the play even if he disengaged from the block. Heath got caught staring at a guy that was blocking. That shows one of the biggest criticisms of Heath - he lacks feel and instincts out there.

If he has even the slightest "feel" out there he could have recognized his guy wasn't a threat on the play and he was free to try to make a play. He had more that enough time to diagnose what was happening and react. But instead he's caught flat footed staring at a guy blocking and he lets Goff run right past him.
 

RoboQB

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Saying he should have competition isn’t unfair. Saying he should ideally be a backup isn’t unfair.

I agree.
Dude didn't even play Saturday but there's a thread started on him!?!
Seems a little off center.

And still, nobody will tell me what Karl Joseph's PFF ranking is.
 

TheMarathonContinues

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So it seems like Heath is always on this roster.....never up for a new contract so I was just curious to what type of deal he is on lol.....


4/13/2016: Signed a four-year, $7.671 million contract. The deal included a $1.8 million signing bonus.


I don't even remember this happening. Hard to say we aren't getting our money's worth at least lol.
 

RoboQB

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But this is a sports message board where fans discuss the team. The fact that the team themselves don't care what we say isn't really the point. I mean if it was the point, then why even have discussion boards and sports call in shows and editorials in the press on the team?

Why do you have a problem with the criticism of Heath? Do you think he's much better than people think?

PS - It wasn't just PFF that criticized Heath. Football Outsiders said this:



And I don't even like PFF, but there is enough information and reporting beyond PFF that indicates Heath isn't a very good safety.

PPS - FWIW, Joseph got a higher rating in PFF than Heath. I think Joseph is a bit overrated based on where he was drafted but I suspect if given a choice, most teams would take Joseph over Heath right now.

I was legitimately curious about Joseph's PFF ranking.
I don't have a problem with criticism towards Heath.
I think he's better than given credit for. I also think the position
needs to be upgraded. It's been that way for quite so time now.
Maybe, just maybe, we see Eric Berry after week 1.

My first post was targeted mainly at PFF and 'the like'.
All of these rankings are taken as the final word and actually
make it into thread titles such as this one.

It's stupid. For example, PFF has Dak as middle of the pack in QB ranking.
There are people who explode when a 'Regular Joe' claims that. They ignore
these rankings when it doesn't align with their agenda. Some people who
love Dak and ignore rankings are the same ones running to justify those
rankings when they rag on Heath.

I realize this is a message board. And that there are podcasts, talk shows, etc.
The team doesn't care what they think either. No team does. There's an old
saying "If you're worried about what the fans think, you'll soon be sitting with them in the stands".
So, our approval or disapproval means nada.
 

Sydla

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It appears that PFF changed their format a bit. You could look up the player's grade and ranking but now it shows the grade and some other stats but not his overall ranking. That appears to be a pay feature now.

I do believe Joseph was given a Top 30 ranking for 2018.
 

InTheZone

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If our QB shows up to make a few plays only in the 4th and is hailed the greatest qb of all time why isn't heath in the same category or at least praised a little considering he saved us once from Daks abysmal finish to 2017 and had a few moments in ganes where the rest of the defense was no where to be found.
 

Whirlwin

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CowboysZone DIEHARD Fan
And you think that is going to happen with Clappy as our head coach?

Haaaaaaaaaaaabaaaaaaaaaaaaahaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!

Clappy couldn't coach up a litter of kittens to find a bowl of milk:laugh:
Is something wrong with your reading comprehension. I said give me. Wow the hatred blind you
 
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