SI.com - MMQB Exceprt (Phillips v King)

[Colo]

9. I think, for the record, here's my side of Wade Phillips calling me a quote-fabricator. We spoke last Tuesday night about his team's miracle win in Buffalo, and after that we talked about the idiocy of the late-game field-goal do-overs, about the Patriots' Spygate scandal, and about how he hopes the league will pass a coach-to-defense communication system the same way the league allows quarterbacks to get plays called into their helmets.

He said the league's sanctioning the Patriots for cheating "was a black mark on their success ... not that I bet they gained much from it.'' He praised the Patriots and thought they deserved all the credit for winning the three Super Bowls.

I reported what he said about the "black mark'' on HBO's Inside the NFL show, and Phillips denied saying it in press conferences over the next two days. All I said afterwards was that I stand behind what I said, and that's all I will continue to say, because really, what else is there to say? He said it, I reported it, he disputes it. I dispute his denial. This job is based in part on trust, and you are going to have to decide who you trust -- Phillips or me.

Complete article

 

[Aikbach]

Phillips.

A fair amount of back peddling by King there, not so firm on the context of his "quote" as he had been when seeking a headline.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

IMO, it's a classic case of Wade reading in print something he said that didn't read the way he intended it. It's obvious from the overall content that Wade wasn't trying to stir a controversy and the way the quote read when printed it looked like he was stirring a controversy. That's why he went out of his way to deny it.

I understand why athletes believe they get "misquoted". The quote may be accurate but many times a quote reads and sounds in print totally different than the way the speaker intended.

 

[dbair1967]

seems several people have said they were "misquoted" in King articles the past few seasons...I think he hears what he wants to hear sometimes and runs with it

David

 

[SultanOfSix]

I'd have no qualms about calling the Pats cheaters, even if I was the opposing coach on the sidelines.

It's what they are.

 

[Nav22]

Jimmy cheated too...

 

[SultanOfSix]

Jimmy cheated too...

No he didn't.

 

[WoodysGirl]

No he didn't.

Yeah he did. It just wasn't a violation of league policy back then. You don't do something covertly like that and think it would be ok with the rest of the league. There's a reason why the rule was put in place.

 

[SultanOfSix]

Yeah he did. It just wasn't a violation of league policy back then. You don't do something covertly like that and think it would be ok with the rest of the league. There's a reason why the rule was put in place.

From the article you referenced, he was told by another team in the NFL to do this, correct?

Also, if it's not in violation of league policy, it's not cheating is it? By definition, you can't cheat if it's not against the rules.

 

[khiladi]

Yeah he did. It just wasn't a violation of league policy back then. You don't do something covertly like that and think it would be ok with the rest of the league. There's a reason why the rule was put in place.

But Jimmy said everybody did it, according to the quote you brought, even if what he did was totally different than what Bellichek did...

Isn't that how the Patriot homers have been trying to justify it.. Everybody did it...

But yeah, it must not be really that much of a help... Wait.. didn't Jimmy say that also? Bellichek was doing something that wasn't helping, but clearly violating league rules? Amazing, clearly violating league rules, being fined 500,000 dollars for something that wasn't helping... talk about gullible.. than the destroying of the tapes...

Let's not forget that their were other accusations labelled against the Patriots too, that conveniently are forgotten in this "everybody else did it" cheerleading Patriot homers...

What, you take what you want from the article and leave what you want...

 

[YosemiteSam]

Phillips

 

[CrazyCowboy]

Phillips is coach of my favorite team in the entire universe....therefore, I TRUST WADE!

 

[khiladi]

BTW, coaches have to watch what they say too, otherwise thay also can be hit by hefty fines... Just because a coach says something to the media, doesn't necessarily mean he believes what he is saying... He knows that questioning NFL decisions and speaking his real opinion can cause him a problem he doesn't want...

 

[WoodysGirl]

From the article you referenced, he was told by another team in the NFL to do this, correct?

A bunch of cronies sitting around talking about how they do things to gain a competitive edge doesn't make something right.

Also, if it's not in violation of league policy, it's not cheating is it? You can't cheat if it's not against the rules.

I believe it is. Just because there was no rule in place, doesn't mean it was right.

And that's the problem I find with people trying to justify Jimmy's methods back then. Whether it was effective or not, he used covert videotaping methods to tape another team's defense. If he thought it was ok, then why not place cameras on the sidelines? Or add more cameras for better angles? Just be out in the open about it. It was wrong and he knew it. Is what it is.

I totally agree that Belichick and Co. should've been disclipined more, because they were in direct violation of the rule.

But rule or not, Jimmy did the very same thing, as did other coaches around the league, which is probably why they instituted the rule.

But Jimmy said everybody did it, according to the quote you brought, even if what he did was totally different than what Bellichek did...

How was it totally different? He used video to tape signals, correct? Camera placement is not my issue. How he used the video tapes is not my issue.

Isn't that how the Patriot homers have been trying to justify it.. Everybody did it...

Not my concern what Pats fans say.

But yeah, it must not be really that much of a help... Wait.. didn't Jimmy say that also? Bellichek was doing something that wasn't helping, but clearly violating league rules? Amazing, clearly violating league rules, being fined 500,000 dollars for something that wasn't helping... talk about gullible.. than the destroying of the tapes...

Let's not forget that their were other accusations labelled against the Patriots too, that conveniently are forgotten in this "everybody else did it" cheerleading Patriot homers...

Don't even know what you mean by all this. Please clarify, because I think you're rambling. See my response to Sultan.

What, you take what you want from the article and leave what you want...

And you do the same...

 

[big dog cowboy]

I don't know who too believe. But I know I trust King less than Wade.

 

[khiladi]

A bunch of cronies sitting around talking about how they do things to gain a competitive edge doesn't make something right.

I believe it is. Just because there was no rule in place, doesn't mean it was right.

Or maybe what these coaches were doing wasn't effective like what Bellichek was doing... and it was outlawed because what Bellichek was doing was clearly impacting the game....

 

[khiladi]

How was it totally different? He used video to tape signals, correct? Camera placement is not my issue. How he used the video tapes is not my issue.

Well, there it is... If your not going to care how one uses video tapes than really... what is left to say... i would think that this is what the core of the argument is, i.e. what are the Patriots doing that gives them a clear competitive edge that other teams are not doing... isn't that why one needs to investigate?

I mean for you it really doesn't matter that the Patriots were accused of using technology to make half-time adjustments, and that the extent of Patriots chetaing went beyond just video-recording signals... To you it doesn't matter that 18 years of technology doesn't make a difference in how taping can impact a game...

but now, the Patriots with a WHOLE NEW TEAM, including the top defnsive player in free agency and two of the best receivers in the NFL in free agency, are 'legitimizing' their other 3 Super Bowls... this coupled with their dirty cheap artist OL...

 

[WoodysGirl]

Or maybe what these coaches were doing wasn't effective like what Bellichek was doing... and it was outlawed because what Bellichek was doing was clearly impacting the game....

Maybe, maybe not. All we know is that Jimmy said it wasn't effective for him.

We don't know and shouldn't assume we know that it wasn't effective for other coaches. Because if it wasn't effective at some point for coaches other than Belichick, then the rule wouldn't have been put in place.

Coaches are alway going to try to gain a competive edge, Belichick just perfected that particular edge.

 

[SultanOfSix]

You can believe whatever you want WG. You can believe in leprechauns and tooth fairies. It still doesn't mean they exist. Similarly, what Jimmy did still didn't make it cheating, because by definition, you cannot violate a rule that is not in place.

I wouldn't think it was fair either, but if you think a new coach in the league who is seeking advice from another team, this is what they tell you, you proceed to do it, find out it doesn't help you, and you stop doing it is comparable to Belicheat repeatedly and blatantly disregarding league rules, you're fooling yourself.

People want to say Jimmy cheated so that they can make the situation analaogous to Belicheat's situation, and it isn't even remotely similar except for the use of video cameras.

 

[WoodysGirl]

Well, there it is... If your not going to care how one uses video tapes that really... what is left to say...

Nothing, because the act of video taping signals is the same.

I mean for you it really doesn't matter that the Patriots were accused of using technology to make half-time adjustments, and that the extent of Patriots chetaing went beyond just video-recording signals... To you it doesn't matter that 18 years of technology doesn't make a difference in how taping can impact a game...

Exactly. And I'm glad you finally see my stance. I really don't care what technology was used and how it was applied. I find it to be a very simple issue for me. Did Jimmy do it? Yes, he did. Did he admit doing it? Yes he did. Real simple and to the point.

Did Belichick do it? Yes he did. Did he admit it? Nope. But he got busted anyway.