Surtain vs Horn Question

[3rdEyewarrior]

This Horn - Surtain argument could go on for months. I think both are good CBs which is why the argument continues. I won't be disappointed if either one is the pick. I like Horn a bit more because of his closing speed. I like Surtain a bit more because of his technique and NFL ready skills.

But let me ask the board this question: If the Cowboys traded down with Chicago to 20, and Caleb Farley drops that far, would you take him? It is the kind of risk Jerry would take in the 2nd round, but how about the first, considering Dallas gets an extra 2nd from Chicago? I know this is a tough question to answer since we have no data to evaluate the risk. What if there is a 75% chance he has no further injury in the future? And if Dallas get's an extra 2nd and a 3rd round pick to trade down? I might take Farley, then another CB in the 2nd with my additional pick to hedge my bet. If they both work out then there is plenty of depth and maybe we don't have to play Lewis or Brown.

Farley says the injury is nothing to worry about and the NFL medical staff cleared him to play in 2021. Rumor has it there are teams willing to take him in the second half of the 1st round.

https://cardswire.usatoday.com/2021/04/14/nfl-draft-caleb-farley-back-injury-cleared/

Yup with a huge smile on my face

 

[3rdEyewarrior]

Horn's physicality is intriguing but I think Surtain is the better overall player.

Of course, he might be gone, if Denver doesn't go QB it probably comes down to Surtain or Parsons.

Who’s better at man to man?

 

[3rdEyewarrior]

I’m going PS2. Just look at the murderers row of wideouts he covered in practice every day

Jeudy
Ruggs
Waddle
Smith

Did he do good in practice though?

 

[3rdEyewarrior]

I looked for both of them and the forty time for Surtain was higher than you indicated. Not calling you out, but this is what I based my comment on. It was something in the 4.5's.

I have been incorrect several times today, and i just got out of bed. So I could be wrong here.

Surtain tine was 4.42. That always translates to 4.52 or slower at the combine.

 

[DFWJC]

As prospects:

Surtain = Kahlil Mack
Horn = Clowney

shots fired

 

[DFWJC]

Fwiw, its literally a tossup which one will go first.
Carolina supposedly loves Horn

To me Surtain seems like the currently more well-rounded prospect, while Horn seems to have the greater upside.

 

[3rdEyewarrior]

shots fired

Mack is overrated. He lives up against r t: Clooney started off in the wrong g scheme. He should e started in a 4-3

 

[3rdEyewarrior]

I wo t be mad with either. I want fairly . Then horn. If not, surtain would be fine. Just let him play like revis.

 

[jnday]

My gosh, I have never seen someone try to pass more made up “facts” than you?

Anyone that has watched just one of Surtain’s games or YouTube cutups can demonstrably show Surtain played both sidelines (LCB/RCB).

What do mean Horn outplayed Surtain, lool?

Over the same amount of time (2018-2020) Surtain has:
- (i.e. lower) completion % against
- Significantly lower QB rating when targeted than Horn
- Gave up less TDs despite playing 900 more snaps than Horn
- Far fewer penalties than Horn despite playing 900 more snaps
- More interceptions

You clearly haven’t watched a single snap. Surtain has covered DK Metcalf, CeeDee Lamb, Pitts, S. Williams, et cetera.

But please, trot out Surtain’s high school 20-yard shuttle again.

And Horn’s play will have to be changed because he can’t use those hands in the NFL without drawing a lot of flags.

 

[jnday]

I wo t be mad with either. I want fairly . Then horn. If not, surtain would be fine. Just let him play like revis.

At his age and he already has back problems, he seems like too big of a risk in the first round. Dallas ignored the warning signs that LVE had neck problems and it looks like those problems has had a big impact on his decline since his rookie season.

 

[3rdEyewarrior]

At his age and he already has back problems, he seems like too big of a risk in the first round. Dallas ignored the warning signs that LVE had neck problems and it looks like those problems has had a big impact on his decline since his rookie season.

Last year was a collar bone.

 

[3rdEyewarrior]

And Horn’s play will have to be changed because he can’t use those hands in the NFL without drawing a lot of flags.

Revis and Sherman did

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

Who’s better at man to man?

Hey, are you still looking for that Darrelle Revis combine time?

 

[AsthmaField]

I really like both of them. They’re very close in talent and I’m sure there are teams that have Horn rated 1 and some that have Surtain rated 1.

Either would be a hell of a pickup for a Dallas team that needs a CB1.

They’re both physical, but Horn is a tad more so.

They’re both sound fundamentally, but Surtain is a little ahead in that regard.

They both tackle very well. I’d about call that a draw.

I could make a case for Horn and I could make a case For Surtain, honestly.

Frankly, I’ll be good with either one. There’s a lot to be excited about no matter which one of them Dallas has as the CB1.

 

[3rdEyewarrior]

Ac

Hey, are you still looking for that Darrelle Revis combine time?

tualky I forgot about it. I’ll get back to you when the more interesting posts stop.

 

[heir]

Which one is the better tackler? More aggressive and not shy about contact?

I understand Surtain has shown a weakness in the deep ball. If he also isn't a contact guy, then this could be critical.

I read where Horn is the more aggressive. But he also has a hole reading route combinations. But has that cornerback self assurance.

Just player vs player, which is the best in your opinion?

I personally think Surtain is by far the better prospect. He has Jalen Ramsey's size, pretty good speed, can tackle, and such a high football IQ. He can play man and zone. I will take that all day over someone whose best trait is that he is aggressive. With the cover 3 scheme Quinn is implementing he is the perfect fit. I don't know if Horn fits that system as well. If Horn is the pick, I will ok with it and obviously root for him to turn out to be great. I will also admit that I was wrong on him if he ends up better than Surtain.

I also will not blame other fans who feel Horn should be the pick. We just have different opinions, I will respect them.

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

Ac

tualky I forgot about it. I’ll get back to you when the more interesting posts stop.

Sure, when the multiverse spits a version of reality where Revis ran at the Combine.

 

[3rdEyewarrior]

Which one is the better tackler? More aggressive and not shy about contact?

I understand Surtain has shown a weakness in the deep ball. If he also isn't a contact guy, then this could be critical.

I read where Horn is the more aggressive. But he also has a hole reading route combinations. But has that cornerback self assurance.

Just player vs player, which is the best in your opinion?

Panthers Broncos and lions w
Could possibly go cb.

 

[Croomraider]

Not sure either of them are great tacklers. IMO it's more important to have your inside slot corner be a decent tackler as they are closer to the RB.

Surtain locates the ball and gets in position. His "IQ" as he calls it is indeed what makes him a better corner. The refs will see him constantly turn his head and locate the ball negating tons of potential penalty yardage. Horn might be a penalty machine. 40 yard dash straight line speed in spandex doesn't win me over either. Surtain is the better pick at 10. Horn is a mid to late first rounder.

 

[Creeper]

Horn's physicality is intriguing but I think Surtain is the better overall player.

Of course, he might be gone, if Denver doesn't go QB it probably comes down to Surtain or Parsons.

Denver just signed Kyle Fuller and Ronald Darby, is it really a given they would draft a CB? I am not so sure.