The 3-4 defensive scheme works

[DallasDW00ds0n]

The scheme is not the issue, some of the best defenses in the league run it... Sf... Houston....

Get real people simply aligning our players differently (ware + spencer at DE, etc) is laughable... At some point you need to start questioning the players themselves and not the scheme

 

[Numbers921]

The problem is the players. We don't have good lineman and haven't for pretty much the entire time we've been in the scheme. The only standout we've had is Jay Ratliff and he was always miscast. Right now, Jason Hatcher is the only guy I feel is a viable starter.

 

[TheCoolFan]

Well do you trust the GM to find the right players to fit this scheme? It's been 8 years running this and we still have underwhelming defensive linemen.

Jay Ratliff playing at an All-Pro level for 2 years really made this defense look a lot better than it should have (and even then it was never great).

 

[DallasDW00ds0n]

The problem is the players. We don't have good lineman and haven't for pretty much the entire time we've been in the scheme. The only standout we've had is Jay Ratliff and he was always miscast. Right now, Jason Hatcher is the only guy I feel is a viable starter.

You are completely right.... People overrate everyone on this defense aside from Ware and Lee..

 

[jterrell]

So the answer is to go to a defense that relies more on DL?

Good grief think through the point you want to make please.

This defense is average. It isn't great and it isn't crud. Right now it is first in net yardage allowed. It is 20th in points allowed and the top pass defense in football. That's playing a remarkably tough first 5 games.

The main problem with our defense is losing Church, Sensabaugh, Lissemore, Spencer and Ratliff within 5 games. That's a fair amount of talent to be without.

 

[jblaze2004]

we need to move rat to DE and let brent continue to start at NT. He was playing well there. Let rat move to DE and free up some other people. He can still kick to DT when we go to a 4 man line and rush the passer.

 

[supercowboy8]

The scheme woke if you have the line but we don't. But we do have a good line for a 4-3. So if you have thw players for a 4-3 and not a 3-4 then you should run the scheme that fit the players you have.

 

[jterrell]

The scheme woke if you have the line but we don't. But we do have a good line for a 4-3. So if you have thw players for a 4-3 and not a 3-4 then you should run the scheme that fit the players you have.

ROFL. No, we don't. It isn't even close.

The 4-3 relies on having MORE DL, not less.

Ware can play 4-3 DE but his best position BY FAR is OLB where he can move around and pick match ups. He can play out on the edge away from inside help.

Lee is a 3-4 LB for his entire college and pro career. He will likely coach this defense when he retires he knows it so well.

Those are the two best players on this team, not just this defense. The thought we'd switch is silly.

Rob Ryan loves the 4-3 as much as the next guy but he hasn't played it as much because we simply have better 3-4 personnel.

We do not have 4-3 DTs. Those guys need to either occupy 2 blockers or go make plays. Ask that of our DTs and expect to fail miserably. There is a reason 4-3 defenses draft DTs in round 1.

 

[supercowboy8]

ROFL. No, we don't. It isn't even close.

The 4-3 relies on having MORE DL, not less.

Ware can play 4-3 DE but his best position BY FAR is OLB where he can move around and pick match ups. He can play out on the edge away from inside help.

Lee is a 3-4 LB for his entire college and pro career. He will likely coach this defense when he retires he knows it so well.

Those are the two best players on this team, not just this defense. The thought we'd switch is silly.

Rob Ryan loves the 4-3 as much as the next guy but he hasn't played it as much because we simply have better 3-4 personnel.

We do not have 4-3 DTs. Those guys need to either occupy 2 blockers or go make plays. Ask that of our DTs and expect to fail miserably. There is a reason 4-3 defenses draft DTs in round 1.

. Penn state did not run the 3-4 with Lee first off.

Do toy really see 3-4 DL on this team? Brent is not a grwat 3-4 NT. And the DEs are no where near effective like most 3-4 DEs are.

Sorry dude toy can be blind all you want but I would rather see ratiff in a 43 now in his career and Spencer at 43 OLB. We could have Crawford or Hatcher as a DE like the way Seattle has red bryant as a DE.

 

[supercowboy8]

Hatcher and Crawford ate DE
Spears, Ratliff, Brendt, Lessimore at DT, Hatcher and Crawford can play DT too, dependa on the package.
Ware and Butler at DE

Spencer Lee, and Carter LB


Use Spencer like the way Denver uses Miller, or the way Oakland used Nimble, or the way Giants use Kwinuka, how ever you spell his name.


I don't think we have all the true pieces to go total 4-3 but we don't have all the pieces to play 3-4 either.

 

[DallasDW00ds0n]

So the answer is to go to a defense that relies more on DL?

Good grief think through the point you want to make please.

This defense is average. It isn't great and it isn't crud. Right now it is first in net yardage allowed. It is 20th in points allowed and the top pass defense in football. That's playing a remarkably tough first 5 games.

The main problem with our defense is losing Church, Sensabaugh, Lissemore, Spencer and Ratliff within 5 games. That's a fair amount of talent to be without.

Lol I did not say switch to anything, good grief read before u post, in fact the title of te thread is the 3-4 works. The problem lies with the roster not the scheme

 

[noshame]

ROFL. No, we don't. It isn't even close.

The 4-3 relies on having MORE DL, not less.

Ware can play 4-3 DE but his best position BY FAR is OLB where he can move around and pick match ups. He can play out on the edge away from inside help.

Lee is a 3-4 LB for his entire college and pro career. He will likely coach this defense when he retires he knows it so well.

Those are the two best players on this team, not just this defense. The thought we'd switch is silly.

Rob Ryan loves the 4-3 as much as the next guy but he hasn't played it as much because we simply have better 3-4 personnel.

We do not have 4-3 DTs. Those guys need to either occupy 2 blockers or go make plays. Ask that of our DTs and expect to fail miserably. There is a reason 4-3 defenses draft DTs in round 1.

Horse crud, rat is the closest think to a Glover you find in the NFL, the other T is just a stuffer.
Hows Ware working out in pass coverage for ya?

Do you honestly think Lee would be worse with more beef in front of him.

Please.

Todays centers are for the most part as slow as cows, they could never hope to block Lee.

This defense is 20th in points allowed, that says it all.

 

[VACowboy]

I actually think Rat's best position is 3 tech and that Lee/Carter would make a great set at Sam/Will LB in a 4-3. Crawford is a prototypical 4-3 LDE. Draft Manti Teo and you have a pretty formidable front 7:

LDE: Crawford
3 Tech: Rat
NG: Brent
RDE: Ware
Sam: Lee
MLB: Teo
Will: Carter

Not saying it's the way to go, but I do think this team has good 4-3 personnel.

 

[Risen Star]

The scheme is not the issue, some of the best defenses in the league run it... Sf... Houston....

Get real people simply aligning our players differently (ware + spencer at DE, etc) is laughable... At some point you need to start questioning the players themselves and not the scheme

Yep.

The 3-4 works. The 3-4 without a real NT and only one legitimate pass rusher doesn't.

 

[Doomsday101]

4-3 is a good defense as is the 3-4 it comes down to execution, there is no magic in changing the defense back. The only issue I really have with defense is Ryan still tends to use 3 man rushes in the course of the game and you give a QB that much time they will find a hole to throw into.

 

[xwalker]

They played 4-3 on multiple snaps against the Ravens. Conner, Lee and Carter were the LBs.

 

[DallasDW00ds0n]

They played 4-3 on multiple snaps against the Ravens. Conner, Lee and Carter were the LBs.

Yeah they did so well.

Pressure was there and it forced turnovers.

Yes they CAN lineup in a 4-3 but I believe the idea is to actually be effective in it.

 

[jterrell]

Horse crud, rat is the closest think to a Glover you find in the NFL, the other T is just a stuffer.
Hows Ware working out in pass coverage for ya?

Do you honestly think Lee would be worse with more beef in front of him.

Please.

Todays centers are for the most part as slow as cows, they could never hope to block Lee.

This defense is 20th in points allowed, that says it all.

You are pathetically mistaken.

Ratliff wouldn't protect anyone. He would burst through to make plays. And as he has stated many times he prefers NT because he likes using his quickness on centers who have to snap the ball.

The 2nd DT would be Marcus Spears. He would be asked to occupy two blockers.

You don't get MORE protection for Sean Lee in a 4-3 you get less. If you play Ratliff that is.

Again our best players all fit the 3-4 better. That's why it remains our base defense. Ryan uses both and will play whichever fits our talent.

 

[jterrell]

They played 4-3 on multiple snaps against the Ravens. Conner, Lee and Carter were the LBs.

They play it every week. The reason it is in for a few snaps and not as the base its because we are better in the 3-4.

With Spencer out the 4-3 makes more sense than it normally would. Playing Connor in place of a quality OLB would be a bad move 99 times out of 100. BUT Victor Butler isn't ready for every down playing time.

If they want to routinely play a 4-3 defense they need to use the top draft pick or huge free agent dollars on a stud DT.

Being able to play both defenses is a very nice thing as it forces offenses to prepare for much more.

 

[AbeBeta]

Hatcher and Crawford ate DE
Spears, Ratliff, Brendt, Lessimore at DT, Hatcher and Crawford can play DT too, dependa on the package.
Ware and Butler at DE

Spencer Lee, and Carter LB


Use Spencer like the way Denver uses Miller, or the way Oakland used Nimble, or the way Giants use Kwinuka, how ever you spell his name.


I don't think we have all the true pieces to go total 4-3 but we don't have all the pieces to play 3-4 either.

Spencer as a 4-3 LB? That is just nuts. He'd be a solid 4-3 DE but a terrible fit at LB in that scheme